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| Username | Post: 3 Player suspension - It May Not Be Over | |
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candyfan Masters Student Posts 459 
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03-02-18 07:04 AM - Post#250108
Coach Davis indicated after the win over Loyola that the suspension of Moore, Toomer and Newman may not be over? Said the team will review the status of the three players and the incident(s) between now and next game. That's all he would say. Gave no further details on what happened or even when it happened. This is a big letdown to the Team and should not be happening to players with high academic standards. One would like to think that smarter means smarter! Staying out of trouble for sake of the team. Note, the Loyola bench vastly outscored the Bucknell bench. Result of three guys suspended? |
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BUFan PhD Student Posts 1936 
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03-02-18 07:16 AM - Post#250109
I feel like (and hope) that may be coach speak. By leaving the door open to keep the suspension going he may be hoping to motivate the players in practice and to make certain whatever triggered the suspension does not recur. Disappointing regardless. |
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Old Bison Masters Student Posts 619 |
03-02-18 08:29 AM - Post#250112
Disclosure- I have no inside information That said. Although the staff obviously has some character and is fulfilling the Bucknell mission statement with respect to priorities I would expect the “teaching moment†is now over. You can’t let the animals run the zoo but at the same time it’s counterproductive to burn the zoo down to prove they’ll be other zoos on other days. I’m more concerned about whether these recurring infractions are getting to the point where the program and these young men are going to agree to disagree. This is push comes to shove time now and it is not a situation where “if nothing changes, nothing changesâ€. This is sustainable at a place like Bucknell. |
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Old Bison Masters Student Posts 619 |
03-02-18 08:30 AM - Post#250113
Not sustainable |
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bison63 Postdoc Posts 3857 |
03-02-18 09:29 AM - Post#250115
Strike two on Bruce Moore! |
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Bison89 Professor Posts 5370 
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03-02-18 09:33 AM - Post#250117
It would be interesting to learn what actually happened, but there is a good chance that we will never know.
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DoCtoR62 Masters Student Posts 463 |
03-02-18 10:02 AM - Post#250120
Given the players' visibility on the bench (next to the coaches, not at the end) and their level of engagement with the players on the floor, my guess is this is not a long-term issue. |
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Old Bison Masters Student Posts 619 |
03-02-18 10:13 AM - Post#250121
Doctor - your read is correct and counter to my last post where I was concerned about longer term complications I will conclude this by saying that at places like Buck “teaching moments†come first. |
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Old Bison Masters Student Posts 619 |
03-02-18 10:18 AM - Post#250122
B63...if you include Monmouth it was strike 2 1/2. That said it’s over. Time to concentrate on attacking zones |
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raymondbucknell Junior Posts 295 |
03-02-18 12:10 PM - Post#250133
Given the players' visibility on the bench (next to the coaches, not at the end) and their level of engagement with the players on the floor, my guess is this is not a long-term issue. I noticed the same thing and I hope you’re right. |
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NoMoney89 Freshman Posts 89 |
03-02-18 01:07 PM - Post#250153
And lets not all jump to conclusions. (although that's what message boards are for I guess). The players in question are all 18 or 19 yrs old, correct? Who among us has a blemish free existence for those years of our lives? Yes it's a shame they did whatever caused them to be suspended, but I'm not ready to throw them under the bus until we know a lot more. (which we may never do) |
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A Western Bison Sophomore Posts 179 |
03-02-18 03:28 PM - Post#250186
I am glad that ND, during the post-game, allowed last night's game stand with the minimum of discussion of the suspensions. That presser was about that game. I believe that is why he delayed further discussion of the suspensions. We just get to wait it out. |
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Bison89 Professor Posts 5370
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03-02-18 04:15 PM - Post#250202
And lets not all jump to conclusions. (although that's what message boards are for I guess). The players in question are all 18 or 19 yrs old, correct? Who among us has a blemish free existence for those years of our lives? Yes it's a shame they did whatever caused them to be suspended, but I'm not ready to throw them under the bus until we know a lot more. (which we may never do) To the best of my knowledge, I never did anything that might be considered rude, stupid, irreverent, disrespectful, or otherwise just plain dumb 1985-1989 . . . and if you believe that one, I have a bridge to sell you! 
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candyfan Masters Student Posts 459
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03-02-18 05:11 PM - Post#250210
Sticking my basketball neck out on speculation, I'm thinking Davis will let them hang by their thumbs until sometime before the game on Sunday at 2pm. There's the teaching moment and then there's the reality of the game on Sunday. It would seem there's room for both - let 'em sweat it out, Loyola into the weekend, then get them motivated to shape up and help win what could be a tough semi-final game. |
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Old Bison Masters Student Posts 619 |
03-02-18 07:04 PM - Post#250218
Doctor - your read is correct |
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jkrun80 Postdoc Posts 3305 |
03-02-18 09:08 PM - Post#250248
And lets not all jump to conclusions. (although that's what message boards are for I guess). The players in question are all 18 or 19 yrs old, correct? Who among us has a blemish free existence for those years of our lives? Yes it's a shame they did whatever caused them to be suspended, but I'm not ready to throw them under the bus until we know a lot more. (which we may never do) Yes, let's not read too much into the situation. I recall Will Carter getting suspended from the football team a number of times. But when he joined the track team his senior year, the coaches and his teammates had no issues with him. Sometimes discipline issues are in the eye of the beholder. I know nothing about the current situation on the basketball team, but it could be far milder than many of the things I did during my time at Bucknell. That is the nature of things now. Athletes are held to a higher standard than the general student body at Bucknell which was not the case back in the day. |
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MrPhillie Postdoc Posts 2757 
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03-02-18 11:19 PM - Post#250339
Mild or not, apparently rules the team and/or athletic department/school feels are appropriate, important and fair were broken and suspensions were deemed necessary and appropriate. While I understand young adults will be young adults, I’d be careful to just blow it off, especially since this is Bruce’s second suspension. I am admittedly not a historian of Bucknell basketball but since I’ve been following the team, I do not recall such suspensions...and Coaches Flannery and Paulsen did not appear to be coaches to let much slide, so I have to assume there wasn’t cause to suspend players. Why this year have there been multiple occasions? Are expectations of behavior really that much higher today? I’m not saying to make this more than it needs to be, but I also don’t believe in the “kids will be kids†excuses. They let the team down as well as themselves. It is easier to not make a big deal about it because Bucknell won the game...but I wonder if the mood would be different if the Bison lost? We all make mistakes, hopefully it is a lesson learned. |
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bison63 Postdoc Posts 3857 |
03-02-18 11:31 PM - Post#250344
I agree, Phillie. |
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candyfan Masters Student Posts 459
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03-03-18 02:52 AM - Post#250370
Hafta say that standards for athletes at Bucknell and elsewhere have not changed from back in the day. It's always been the case that athletes represent their school, while on home court and especially when visiting other courts. Ditto for a football field, baseball field, etc. Changes? Well, for one, Bucknell basketball players playing away were required to wear white shirt and necktie "back in the day", the way I remember it. I believe that's correct and I also believe that's not true of today's Bucknell basketball players? |
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BUFan PhD Student Posts 1936
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03-03-18 07:13 AM - Post#250372
Bucknell just posted the game notes. Says Toomer and Newman will be in uniform while Moore remains out indefinitely. Speculating it is due to a second offense for Moore? In uniform doesn’t definitely mean play or start, but I would guess no restrictions. |
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BUFan PhD Student Posts 1936
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03-03-18 07:13 AM - Post#250373
http://m.bucknellbison.com/mobile/ViewArticle.dbml... |
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bisonmania Masters Student Posts 920 |
03-03-18 09:55 AM - Post#250392
Without Moore tomorrow it will be very tough. He is a solid defender. It will be very important for Sestina to not get into foul trouble and the same for Toomer. |
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bison63 Postdoc Posts 3857 |
03-03-18 12:14 PM - Post#250416
I’m all for rules and such, but have definite mixed emotions here. Apparently, the team does not appear to have a hard and fast rule like “late once miss one game, late twice miss two.†I’d think if they did ND would just say so. In any event i’d guess Moore has done himself irreparable damage. The mixed feelings on my part have to do with the fact that the whole team is in fact punished for his actions. OTOH, you can’t accuse ND of just applying the rule for an “easy†game. (Some easy game Loyola was) |
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HuskyColonial PhD Student Posts 1976 |
03-03-18 08:31 PM - Post#250535
So call me naive but this seems to me that three of them engaged in an activity in which Moore was the leader. If so and this is Moore’s second infraction, he should sit indefinitely. |
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bison63 Postdoc Posts 3857 |
03-03-18 09:18 PM - Post#250566
Looks to me like that is what is happening. |
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MrPhillie Postdoc Posts 2757
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03-03-18 09:43 PM - Post#250593
Just from outward appearance at the Loyola game, Bruce didn’t seem too concerned, as he was his usual smiling, silly self. |
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Bison137 Professor Posts 16147 
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03-03-18 09:49 PM - Post#250604
So call me naive but this seems to me that three of them engaged in an activity in which Moore was the leader. If so and this is Moore’s second infraction, he should sit indefinitely. All three did the same thing, but I haven't seen anything that indicates Moore was the leader. As others have said, I think his longer suspension is simply a function of it being his second violation. I think Bruce has a good attitude as far as the actual basketball goes and is usually very positive on the bench. But there seem to be some maturity issues and he may need a lot better organizational skills.
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bison63 Postdoc Posts 3857 |
03-09-18 12:19 AM - Post#251475
Ok, let’s talk about this Moore suspension. All we hear is “violation of team rules,†but I am wondering just what that rule is. Is there a rule that says “ late one time for a meeting and you sit the next game?†Do it again and you sit the season.†Just what rule was violated that would lead you to tell a kid he cannot play the NCAA tourney? It would seem to me that it would have to be a lot more serious than being )8late, and maybe it is. Just having a hard time believing that being late for a meeting should get a kid suspended for the dance after he has already sat out the league tournament. So what’s going on here. Is it possible that there is no connection between the Moore suspension and Toomer/Newman ones and that Moore really did something serious. I’m not questioning rules, or the need for them, nor am I questioning the need to enforce them once they are set. Just wondering what the hell this kid did to warrant so severe a punishment? |
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raymondbucknell Junior Posts 295 |
03-09-18 01:01 AM - Post#251478
They’re young adults. And I’m sure basically good kids. So, it seems to me the three of them all got in the same trouble and Moore is paying the heavier price bc it’s not his first offense. And I’d just as soon not know what it is about. That is between ND and his players. There is a reason why we don’t get to know. As much as we all are enthusiastic about Bison basketball, some of what goes on in the relationship between student athlete and the University and coaches is really none of our business. Go Bison! |
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atlantabison PhD Student Posts 1835 |
03-09-18 08:04 AM - Post#251483
Yes, nice post Raymond. Let us not sink into what could only become gossip without the fact. Facts which we will never have and which we should not have.
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BisonFan4 Junior Posts 211 |
03-09-18 09:58 AM - Post#251499
You nailed it right on the head Raymond, all 3 were involved in same incident but it was Moore's 2nd time for the same offense. I'm just grateful to see Bruce has maintained a great attitude & enthusiastically supports his teammates on the sideline thru this suspension. Not being able to play in either tournament has got to be killing him. A stupid decision has cost him greatly. I'm.sure it's a lesson learned |
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mcapodee Sophomore Posts 156 |
03-09-18 12:30 PM - Post#251536
I'm all for teaching moments, but assuming there are no potential legal issues which (through fourth-hand information) it sounds like there aren't, I think ND should allow Bruce to play in the tournament. The seniors deserve the best chance to win next week and that means Bruce on the floor. Hopefully he gets the point by now that rules apply to everyone, even the starting five, and the rest of the team can stop paying consequences for his indiscretion. |
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bison63 Postdoc Posts 3857 |
03-09-18 01:45 PM - Post#251551
That is basically what I was trying to say! Thanks! |
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Old Bison Masters Student Posts 619 |
03-10-18 10:02 AM - Post#251645
I agree. Unless Bruce did something really egregious the point has been made. Without knowing the offense though it's hard to say that conclusively. One way out of this bind politically w/o compromising discipline and integrity in the future is for the coach to put it to a private vote of team members that is walled off (I.e., team doesn’t know who voted what). I don’t get the impression ND is running a Democracy however, but I do get the impression it is very important to the coaching staff that the nature of the offense remains within the program. |
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BisonFan4 Junior Posts 211 |
03-10-18 10:08 AM - Post#251647
I do know the offense, & knowing it I believe the severity of the punishment is due more to the fact it was his second offense for the same incident. |
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Old Bison Masters Student Posts 619 |
03-10-18 10:12 AM - Post#251648
Thanks for holding private. Bruce should be protected. |
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Bison137 Professor Posts 16147
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03-10-18 11:30 AM - Post#251661
I do know the offense, & knowing it I believe the severity of the punishment is due more to the fact it was his second offense for the same incident. Agree 100%. I also know it, and I think the three games is definitely enough for the offense. At many P5 schools, there would have been no suspension at all.
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BisonFan4 Junior Posts 211 |
03-10-18 01:53 PM - Post#251674
I agree, although you know others may feel differently |
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bison63 Postdoc Posts 3857 |
03-10-18 03:57 PM - Post#251700
Who is punished most by keeping him out? Bruce or the team? |
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BisonFan4 Junior Posts 211 |
03-10-18 04:00 PM - Post#251702
By our performances in the Semis & Championship, with PL record margin of victory, I think the team is doing just fine in his absence. So to answer your question, Bruce. |
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bison63 Postdoc Posts 3857 |
03-10-18 04:24 PM - Post#251708
Sorry, but Colgate, Boston, and Loyola, Md are one thing. Michigan is quite another. The additional big body can’t hurt, even if he is simply held in reserve. |
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bison63 Postdoc Posts 3857 |
03-12-18 07:29 AM - Post#252258
Now that we know we are playing MSU, I have 2 questions. First, do we know for a fact that Moore is gone for the season? Second, is there anybody here who thinks that does not matter in a game against the likes of the Spartans? At this point, IMO, it is the team and the fans being punished more than Moore. I love Nate Sestina, but I would like to have every big body possible available for this game, especially given Nate's propensity for foul trouble. |
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Bison137 Professor Posts 16147
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03-12-18 11:08 AM - Post#252331
As far as I know, there has been no public statement that he is gone for the season. I wouldn't be surprised to see him on Friday, but I have no info. He is certainly much needed against a team like Michigan State.
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HuskyColonial PhD Student Posts 1976 |
03-12-18 11:24 AM - Post#252339
I still trying to shake my bitterness over the opponent and location. What’s the line on the game? |
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BisonRoadWarrior Professor Posts 5203 
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03-12-18 11:27 AM - Post#252342
What’s the line on the game? Spartans by 14 |
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HuskyColonial PhD Student Posts 1976 |
03-12-18 11:36 AM - Post#252345
I really like us to cover that. The Arkansas game is the only the evidence that we wouldn’t and that was our only blow out loss in 34 games. |
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bison63 Postdoc Posts 3857 |
03-12-18 11:48 AM - Post#252351
I really like us to cover that. The Arkansas game is the only the evidence that we wouldn’t and that was our only blow out loss in 34 games. I do not think the St Joe’s game was as close as the final 13 point margin would suggest, and i’d definitely consider Northeastern a blowout. Both those losses, which at the time were “ bad,†looked better by the seasons end, as NE actually passed us in many rankings and the Hawks closed the gap considerably. Still, I think we will give a good account of ourselves. |
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BUFan PhD Student Posts 1936
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03-12-18 11:52 AM - Post#252355
MSU has not been blowing out most B10 opponents, and I truly feel Bucknell would’ve been a middle of the pack B10 squad. They should be able to hang around. |
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alg55 Pre-Frosh Posts 4 |
03-13-18 01:09 AM - Post#252659
They ARE really good kids. They made a mistake and have learned their lesson. |
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alg55 Pre-Frosh Posts 4 |
03-13-18 01:11 AM - Post#252660
I also know it and I know how sorry he is. He has learned his lesson and the punishment should be over. |
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Paulie777 PhD Student Posts 1767 |
03-13-18 09:32 AM - Post#252667
Sometimes students of any demographic in the bubble need to blow off some steam and it may be a tough place at times for some basketball players. I hope coach understands this and gives them a break, everyone needs one at times. That said, Stephen Brown has risen to every challenge and even overcame the coaching change with poise and Nana also. I can't believe we're going to the dance with one player not playing and two others disciplined. This team is fragmented through and through with Flannery's asst. running the show and star Griffin on bench trying to get these guys going. Paulson is gone but his three recruits are running the show and even Hardt has jumped ship. Now we have a player thats not playing in the big dance and we're supposed to try to beat Mich. St. in Detroit? |
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DoCtoR62 Masters Student Posts 463 |
03-13-18 11:50 AM - Post#252717
I hope it is not the case that this team is fragmented. I believe everyone on here who has knowledge of the infraction(s) and who believes the punishment up to this date should be enough. But, it should be noted that the one person who beyond all others would profit the most from a first round win is head coach Nathan Davis. And, the one person who beyond all others would want to have these seniors experience the thrills of 2005 and 2006 is head coach Nathan Davis. I am hard pressed to think that he hasn't had conversations with his seniors and with his assistants throughout this ordeal. Possible, but unlikely. GO BISON. |
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Bison137 Professor Posts 16147
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03-13-18 12:00 PM - Post#252718
Sometimes students of any demographic in the bubble need to blow off some steam and it may be a tough place at times for some basketball players. I hope coach understands this and gives them a break, everyone needs one at times. That said, Stephen Brown has risen to every challenge and even overcame the coaching change with poise and Nana also. I can't believe we're going to the dance with one player not playing and two others disciplined. This team is fragmented through and through with Flannery's asst. running the show and star Griffin on bench trying to get these guys going. Paulson is gone but his three recruits are running the show and even Hardt has jumped ship. Now we have a player thats not playing in the big dance and we're supposed to try to beat Mich. St. in Detroit? I think "fragmented" is absolutely incorrect. Paulsen's three recruits have now played three very successful years - in an offense that brought out the best in them. Also the discipline for two of the players is in the past, and the discipline for the third may be as well. As for the discipline, it is different at a school like Bucknell - as it should be - but having said that, the same offense at most P5 schools would not have warranted even a one game suspension. Maybe a few extra laps. As for Hardt, I wouldn't say he "jumped ship". He had an opportunity to make a lot more money at a school in a higher-level league. Also in an area where he might well want to retire.
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BisonRoadWarrior Professor Posts 5203
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03-13-18 12:45 PM - Post#252733
This team is fragmented through and through with Flannery's asst. running the show and star Griffin on bench trying to get these guys going. Paulson is gone but his three recruits are running the show and even Hardt has jumped ship. What an absolutely preposterous post. You're truly just making things up out of thin air. If you must delve so deep into fiction, how about concocting an alternative reality that's positive? So, for example, rather than characterizing one of the closest, best-chemistry teams you'll ever see as "fragmented through and through," you could tell us they've all grown two inches since the league championship. |
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Bison89 Professor Posts 5370
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03-13-18 02:16 PM - Post#252769
This team is fragmented through and through with Flannery's asst. running the show and star Griffin on bench trying to get these guys going. Paulson is gone but his three recruits are running the show and even Hardt has jumped ship. What an absolutely preposterous post. You're truly just making things up out of thin air. If you must delve so deep into fiction, how about concocting an alternative reality that's positive? So, for example, rather than characterizing one of the closest, best-chemistry teams you'll ever see as "fragmented through and through," you could tell us they've all grown two inches since the league championship. Why stop there? How about adding in the Jolly Green Giant, Snow White, and one of my favorites, The Grinch?
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Paulie777 PhD Student Posts 1767 |
03-13-18 02:44 PM - Post#252777
If you must delve so deep into fiction, how about concocting an alternative reality that's positive? I think my Michigan St. post is pretty positive. I think this team is fragmented. Bruce Moore being suspended is fragmented enough. There are remnants of the Kansas era in Davis and Griffin, and remants of the Paulson era with Zach, Nana, and Stephen. Flannery and Paulson are gone and we have an interim AD. Davis's recruits are being disciplined. We have great individual play but we can't make a pass and are turnover prone. Again, for my positive alternate reality post, see the Mich.St.thread. |
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MangyOne Freshman Posts 96 
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03-13-18 03:05 PM - Post#252786
Boy, Paulie 777, who tinkled in your Wheaties? With the absolutely absurd post, you best stick to the Michigan State site. Who gave you this sccop - Sasquatch? |
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crd012 Junior Posts 262 |
03-13-18 03:12 PM - Post#252794
If you must delve so deep into fiction, how about concocting an alternative reality that's positive? I think my Michigan St. post is pretty positive. I think this team is fragmented. Bruce Moore being suspended is fragmented enough. There are remnants of the Kansas era in Davis and Griffin, and remants of the Paulson era with Zach, Nana, and Stephen. Flannery and Paulson are gone and we have an interim AD. Davis's recruits are being disciplined. We have great individual play but we can't make a pass and are turnover prone. Again, for my positive alternate reality post, see the Mich.St.thread. Stop digging. The first post was ridiculous, no need to double down on it. |
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bison63 Postdoc Posts 3857 |
03-13-18 03:25 PM - Post#252803
Maybe we need to know what Pauline means by “ fragmented,†because the conventional definition is certainly negative and implying factions warring against each other. Is he possibly just pointing out the varied nature of this teams makeup. |
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BisonFan4 Junior Posts 211 |
03-13-18 03:31 PM - Post#252807
That was actually how I interpreted his post & was a little confused as to why ppl were jumping down his throat lol |
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Paulie777 PhD Student Posts 1767 |
03-13-18 03:36 PM - Post#252809
Thank you Bison63. Essentially they are fragmented in the make up of the team perhaps affecting minor aspects of their play, all the ally-oops are from MacKenzie to Sestina they seems to have a unique chemistry. And what did Bruce Moore do to warrant a suspension? Drink expired milk? Im guessing its not really anything horribly bad. Horribly bad could be saved for our opponent with the gymnastics debacle where perhaps Izzo should have resigned. Thats bad, we should get a free pass from them right there. Or Arizona also. These teams shouldn't even be playing in this tournament. |
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bison63 Postdoc Posts 3857 |
03-13-18 03:54 PM - Post#252813
Did not mean to say “Pauline,†in my previous post. Freaking iPhone always miscorrecting me. |
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JDBison2010 Masters Student Posts 763 |
03-13-18 03:55 PM - Post#252814
No need to speculate any more, Bruce is out for the game https://twitter.com/GoodmanESPN/status/97 364618443... |
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Paulie777 PhD Student Posts 1767 |
03-13-18 04:05 PM - Post#252819
And yeah, our AD did leave for greener pastures and Michigan States AD resigned to let the country heal. Maybe I get swept up in a middle class morality but it does bother me when some coach has to feel up some young gymnasts. Yet the prevailing thought is get over it and enjoy the tournament! We're all in the same country and its nagging on me. What are Michigan State people thinking? So what, get over it? I guess I have no choice but to fill out my brackets. |
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DoCtoR62 Masters Student Posts 463 |
03-13-18 04:31 PM - Post#252825
The suspension has certainly fragmented this board. Remember, we all want the same thing, regardless of the perspective from whence we view the world. I am all in on Bruce Moore in 18/19. |
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crd012 Junior Posts 262 |
03-13-18 04:35 PM - Post#252826
No need to speculate any more, Bruce is out for the game https://twitter.com/GoodmanESPN/status/97 364618443... To me this is cutting off our nose to spite our face. If he has the same offense as Avi and Newman there is no reason to go to this degree of punishment (especially if he is truly sorry). Playing in the NCAA tourney is a life event...we’re really taking that away? Are we trying to force a transfer? Seems like a good idea when you consider our recruits for next year. Not to mention this hurts the senior class that has been so great. This is just unreasonable to me. |
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Bison137 Professor Posts 16147
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03-13-18 06:23 PM - Post#252849
And yeah, our AD did leave for greener pastures and Michigan States AD resigned to let the country heal. What does John Hardt leaving for a higher-level job and a higher salary - going from one prestigious school to another - have to do with the Michigan State AD leaving due to being right in the middle of a terrible scandal?
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Bison137 Professor Posts 16147
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03-13-18 06:26 PM - Post#252850
If he has the same offense as Avi and Newman there is no reason to go to this degree of punishment (especially if he is truly sorry). We can debate the length of the suspension, but it is not accurate to say it is the same offense as Avi and Paul. For Bruce it was a second offense, as opposed to it being a first offense for the others. Yes, the punishment seems a bit harsh to me, but I imagine after the first violation that Bruce was told what the punishment would be for a repeat offense. Having said that, I guarantee that if one of Tom Izzo's regulars committed the same offense, they would not have sat out.
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SpartyJon Freshman Posts 7 |
03-13-18 06:29 PM - Post#252851
Have not a thing to do with Izzo. I appreciate Bucknell's reputation for integrity but I'm not going to stand for people trying to dragging Izzo through the mud because of what happened in another sport and above his head. |
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crd012 Junior Posts 262 |
03-13-18 06:32 PM - Post#252852
If he has the same offense as Avi and Newman there is no reason to go to this degree of punishment (especially if he is truly sorry). We can debate the length of the suspension, but it is not accurate to say it is the same offense as Avi and Paul. For Bruce it was a second offense, as opposed to it being a first offense for the others. Yes, the punishment seems a bit harsh to me, but I imagine after the first violation that Bruce was told what the punishment would be for a repeat offense. Having said that, I guarantee that if one of Tom Izzo's regulars committed the same offense, they would not have sat out. If that’s the case why did Davis say they would evaluate Bruce’s eligibility after each of the PL games? This seems like nothing was set in stone and that Davis is deciding each game. You are obviously more connected than me, but to me this doesn’t seem set. I really don’t like this at all. It’s one thing to hold yourself to higher standards it’s another thing to be on your high horse. |
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Bison1999 Junior Posts 227 |
03-13-18 06:44 PM - Post#252853
I don’t know about the rest of you, but I think this about sums it up: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ |
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bison63 Postdoc Posts 3857 |
03-13-18 06:45 PM - Post#252854
No need to speculate any more, Bruce is out for the game https://twitter.com/GoodmanESPN/status/97 364618443... To me this is cutting off our nose to spite our face. If he has the same offense as Avi and Newman there is no reason to go to this degree of punishment (especially if he is truly sorry). Playing in the NCAA tourney is a life event...we’re really taking that away? Are we trying to force a transfer? Seems like a good idea when you consider our recruits for next year. Not to mention this hurts the senior class that has been so great. This is just unreasonable to me. I agree 100%!! That is why I am thinking there is more to it. |
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Bison137 Professor Posts 16147
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03-13-18 06:49 PM - Post#252855
Have not a thing to do with Izzo. I appreciate Bucknell's reputation for integrity but I'm not going to stand for people trying to dragging Izzo through the mud because of what happened in another sport and above his head. Not talking about the various scandals. Talking about minor rules violations where players have not been suspended for multiple games. What Moore did wouldn't even be a blip on the radar of a P5 school.
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Bison137 Professor Posts 16147
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03-13-18 06:51 PM - Post#252856
No need to speculate any more, Bruce is out for the game https://twitter.com/GoodmanESPN/status/97 364618443... To me this is cutting off our nose to spite our face. If he has the same offense as Avi and Newman there is no reason to go to this degree of punishment (especially if he is truly sorry). Playing in the NCAA tourney is a life event...we’re really taking that away? Are we trying to force a transfer? Seems like a good idea when you consider our recruits for next year. Not to mention this hurts the senior class that has been so great. This is just unreasonable to me. I agree 100%!! That is why I am thinking there is more to it. I am pretty sure that all there is to it is that this is a second offense and he was told the punishment would be a lot harsher the next time. I think too severe - but each coach has to decide what he thinks is best for the long-term success of the team.
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Bison137 Professor Posts 16147
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03-13-18 07:05 PM - Post#252859
A few things to keep in mind when evaluating the seriousness of the offense and whether he is still viewed as part of the team: 1. He was allowed to sit on the bench with the rest of the team every game. 2. He was allowed to help cut down the net with his teammates following the final win. 3. He was in the official team championship picture. 4. He was in the sophomore class picture on BucknellBison.com of the three sophs holding the trophy. 5. The Bison website had a picture of him cutting down the net - something they didn't have to do. Also he was very animated on the bench in terms of supporting his teammates. No sulking of any kind.
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jkrun80 Postdoc Posts 3305 |
03-13-18 07:14 PM - Post#252861
Playing basketball (or any sport) at Bucknell is about more than basketball. Not knowing the offense, I have to trust that the coaching staff thinks this is best for Bruce's future. |
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MrPhillie Postdoc Posts 2757
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03-13-18 07:21 PM - Post#252863
I have no idea of what caused the players to be suspended and I guess it’s none of my business. Obviously Coach Davis feels this punishment isn’t too severe. Just as he runs a particular offense and defense he feels will make his team most successful, just as his coaching style is different from previous coaches because it is what he feels is most successful, he has a discipline system in place which he feels will help players be more successful not only as basketball players on his team, but as people in life. He sees Bruce everyday and perhaps he doesn’t see yet what he wants to see from him. I have no idea. But he is in a much better position to know these things than any of us. We don’t have to agree with all of his decisions but I suppose he’s earned the right to make them and for us to respect that right. As for the difference between any Patriot League or Ivy League school and a Power 5 school, you could list a million differences, including this discipline decision. These comparisons do little to be productive. Bucknell’s students are just like many other students across America, they do stupid things that hopefully they learn from. No better, no worse. (However, Bucknell is often cited as a leading party school...which is either a good thing or bad thing depending on your perspective.) I am often critical of Coach Davis for certain things but at the end of he day, he is much better equipped to make these decisions than I, so I have to respect that. |
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Bison89 Professor Posts 5370
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03-13-18 08:33 PM - Post#252885
I have largely stayed out of this debate, but ultimately, I am in favor of deferring to Coach Davis when it comes to discipline. It is a very slippery slope when it comes to giving athletes preferential treatment of any type, and as a Bucknellian, I would prefer to not go there. I feel bad for Moore, but hopefully, this will make him a better person. Not just a better player.
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MangyOne Freshman Posts 96
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03-14-18 07:23 AM - Post#252930
Well said, Mr. Phillie - Time to move on - GO BISON ! |
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Paulie777 PhD Student Posts 1767 |
03-14-18 10:21 AM - Post#252952
Lewisburg is a small town so I do know the offense but what I heard from a reliable source is Bruce won't be playing until Jan. of next year. |
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bison63 Postdoc Posts 3857 |
03-14-18 11:01 AM - Post#252961
That cannot be for simply being late to a meeting. |
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Bison89 Professor Posts 5370
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03-14-18 11:03 AM - Post#252963
That cannot be for simply being late to a meeting. You got that right!
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Old Bison Masters Student Posts 619 |
03-14-18 11:15 AM - Post#252966
Jan of next year...this is insane. Also, It appears that I'm the last person to know so if someone could "inmail" me I would in fact be quite appreciative. |
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JDBison2010 Masters Student Posts 763 |
03-14-18 12:08 PM - Post#252975
Lewisburg is a small town so I do know the offense but what I heard from a reliable source is Bruce won't be playing until Jan. of next year. The game isn't until 7 on Friday. It's Wednesday. Put down the bottle |
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BisonFan4 Junior Posts 211 |
03-14-18 12:09 PM - Post#252976
Wait what?! Where did it state he's out til then? That is absolutely absurd. I get that he "violated team rules" twice for the same offense but still, this is excessive even for a more esteemed university as Bucknell. |
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bison63 Postdoc Posts 3857 |
03-14-18 12:18 PM - Post#252981
I’d say that depends on the offense! If he is truly out till January, I’d say he did something egregious. OTOH, why all the mystery? Is ND going to go game by game without putting some definition on the length of the suspension? |
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BUFan PhD Student Posts 1936
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03-14-18 01:09 PM - Post#253002
I have no clue what the offense is but if it is truly the same thing as Newman or Toomer, this seems egregious for a second offense. I doubt the January report is accurate. Or if it is, then there is no way it was the same offense |
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BisonRoadWarrior Professor Posts 5203
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03-14-18 02:03 PM - Post#253021
When evaluating the reliability of information, it’s essential to consider the credibility of the source. Especially before you decide to wig out over it. Meanwhile, our team— including and especially Bruce—have been able to avoid letting the suspension distract them from their mission. Depressingly, one can’t say the same of so many people here. |
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atlantabison PhD Student Posts 1835 |
03-14-18 02:05 PM - Post#253022
People, off the ledge. It's really none of our business.
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Bison137 Professor Posts 16147
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03-14-18 02:23 PM - Post#253030
Lewisburg is a small town so I do know the offense but what I heard from a reliable source is Bruce won't be playing until Jan. of next year. We will see. I doubt that is accurate however.
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MangyOne Freshman Posts 96
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03-14-18 04:08 PM - Post#253072
My God ! Unless someone has truly reliable, verifiable info on Bruce's status and his violation particulars, enough of all this crazy speculation. This post is beginning to look like a bunch of Crossports posters have changed their names and come over to this board. We are acting like a bunch of old ladies with nothing better to do than spread vicious gossip rumors. This does NO GOOD WHATSOEVER for the team, especially if they are viewing all this. If he is out for the MS game, so be it. Let's move on and support the Bison and Coach Davis in a POSITIVE MANNER. This is a team sport (remember the saying "there is no I in the word team"). I am sure Bruce doesn't want us all to be concentrating on him, and wants us all to rally around the team. For the team, and for Bruce, let's just do that 
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raymondbucknell Junior Posts 295 |
03-14-18 07:07 PM - Post#253103
Amen! |
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HuskyColonial PhD Student Posts 1976 |
03-14-18 08:20 PM - Post#253116
This is a perfectly fine topic of conversation for fans and I don't understand why on a fan site if people know the real infraction why it isn't being disclosed. This is NCAA sports and Moore is getting an expensive scholarship to play basketball. He's not a juvenile so with great respect, this hush hush stuff is for the birds. |
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md2377 Freshman Posts 17 |
03-14-18 09:13 PM - Post#253141
This is a perfectly fine topic of conversation for fans and I don't understand why on a fan site if people know the real infraction why it isn't being disclosed. This is NCAA sports and Moore is getting an expensive scholarship to play basketball. He's not a juvenile so with great respect, this hush hush stuff is for the birds. I know I am new here, so not to overstep, but..... Lots of young people screw up. I know I did a bit as an undergraduate at Bucknell. In the age of social media (like what we are doing here) sometimes it is better to be discrete. He screwed up. Just because he is a D1 athlete, doesn't mean his "screw up" should be for all the world to see. I am sure he is plenty embarrassed; there is no need for whatever he did to be subject of public fodder or in a google search for the rest of eternity. I am confident he is an exceptional student and an athlete with skills many of us could never dream of having. This is a harsh learning experience and it may or may not cost the team. Let's trust Coach Davis to help this young man grow. Sorry for the rant.
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bison63 Postdoc Posts 3857 |
03-14-18 10:48 PM - Post#253151
Gotta disagree with those who think this is not a valid topic of discussion. We are on this board because we are fans of Bucknell basketball. We got a tough draw in the tournament as a team that many of us thought had Sweet 16 possibilities. Injuries may have played a role in us not being seeded as highly as we wished, and now as we prepare for a match with the best team we have played all year, a team with a plethora of bigs, we find that one of our biggest bodies is unavailable because of a “violation of team rules.†I’m not disagreeing that the coach has the right to keep quiet as to the violation, but it is certainly a more than valid point to talk about on a freakin’ message board. Be we alums, locals or whatever, we are here all year talking about the team. I’m sure many if not most of us are contributors to the University or the team and I do not think it is s violation of anybody’s rights but ours to have kept us guessing as to whether or not Bruce will play. I do not care what the rule is, or how many times he violated it, I simply think we were entitled to know from the gitgo that he was suspended for the season. If it was, as speculated, for being late a second time then IMO missing the PL Tourney and the Dance is awfully harsh. It is not just Moore being punished. By putting a lesser team than we could on the floor on Friday, it is the team and less importantly the fans, I think we deserved less mystery surrounding the terms of the suspension. Davis could have said Bruce is suspended for the season, he did not have to act like it was game to game, when clearly it was not. Finally, if you have had enough of this topic you can simply skip this thread. As for me, I think something with the impact of this on the team’s chances is valid for discussion. |
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Old Bison Masters Student Posts 619 |
03-14-18 11:20 PM - Post#253158
Md2377 - No rant at all. Leave it to me to do the ranting. I think your sentiment is the correct one and you have my full agreement and support.? That said, the situation came to light when 3 players were suspended for VoTR’s. At that time, no distinctions were made and 2 were subsequently reinstated and 1 was not. All inquiries’ to assess what had transpired at that stage wuold have been directed internally ((i.e., to BU athletics and basketball personnel) and informally the response came back that the infractions were MINOR. Publicly, the position was espoused that Bruce’s suspension was now “game to gameâ€, thereby reinforcing the initial responses that the infractions were minor. Based on the sequence of events above it led supporters to assume/ get the impression that reinstatement was imminent. However, the reinstatement was not imminent, there continues to be no further concrete information forthcoming and new conjecture/information suggests that the reinstatement may now not be manifest well into the ‘19 season. Therefore, the reality is that the punishment is NOT MINOR despite the fact that the infraction was qualified that way. Being suspended for 3 games of the PL tourney and now a Ro64 NCAA game (the dream of every kid that’s ever picked up a basketball) now raises the question of whether the punishment fits the crime. I support the staff and Coach Davis and that this is 100% his call...as well as the fact that he’s clearly putting principles over his personal self interest. What remains at issue though illustrates why P.R. Departments exist. During the regular season there might be 20% of the posts that exist under this thread. However, in the context of “1 and out†PL CT and NCAA Ro64 games this issue clearly gets more magnified. After supporting the program day in, day out, traveling to games, and potentially providing some degree of financial support it is not outrageous to suggest loyalty cuts both ways and that more consideration might have been warranted with respect to addressing the externals as opposed to the internals (I.e, the transgression itself). Lastly, it may have been more fair to Bruce to not leave this situation so opaque. I don’t know what the kid did but if your not playing him in an NCAA game then the infraction shouldn’t have been informally addressed as “minorâ€. It should have been addressed publicly upfront that the VoTR’s was considered serious and that the suspension was of indeterminate length, would encompass the totality of the PL CT and the entirety of any postseason and could well extend beyond the present 2018 season. I for one think the public/supporter facing side of this has been very poorly handled and that we have a responsibility to protect Bruce despite his transgression. As it stands now, if we were to advance by way of upset you now have to address the situation on a singular basis for the fifth time!!!! Why do that to the kid? You’ve now dragged your dirty linen onto a national level. It’s not the Bucknellian and the Daily Item now. This should have been clarified and put to bed in my mind...acknowledging at the same time my mind is often wrong. |
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Bison137 Professor Posts 16147
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03-14-18 11:44 PM - Post#253159
Publicly, the position was espoused that Bruce’s suspension was now “game to gameâ€, thereby reinforcing the initial responses that the infractions were minor. Based on the sequence of events above it led supporters to assume/ get the impression that reinstatement was imminent. However, the reinstatement was not imminent, there continues to be no further concrete information forthcoming and new conjecture/information suggests that the reinstatement may now not be manifest well into the ‘19 season. Two thoughts. First, was there any statement by Bucknell that his punishment was "game to game", or was this message board speculation? Secondly, I think the thoughts about the punishment extending into next season fall, at best, into the category of conjecture.
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DoCtoR62 Masters Student Posts 463 |
03-15-18 09:18 AM - Post#253176
The only terminology I recall the coaching staff or the SID use is "indefinite." Initially, for all 3 suspensions and, subsequently, for Moore's suspension. While the conjecture on here, for both the transgression itself and the punishment, has elevated most everyone's frustrations, we truly don't know what is going on. It's conceivable Bruce and his teammates have known his fate all along or soon after the Loyola game, and we are the only ones twisting in the wind. I can't imagine Bruce is happy about it, but he sure seems to be handling it well, as has the rest of the team. If anything, recent weeks have shown how strong the bond is between teammates and coaches. Save for playing time in games, everything else seems to be normal within the team. This has gone on long enough that a fragmented team would start to show cracks. Go Bison! |
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Old Bison Masters Student Posts 619 |
03-15-18 09:19 AM - Post#253177
Yes on the first. If I'm not mistaken I got it from the mouth of ND during the press conference after either the first or second PL tourney game. Can anyone confirm. On the second I agree, that was exactly my wording (i.e., that there was no further concrete information and "new conjecture" suggesting... In the interests of Bruce why should any of this be left for conjecture? |
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md2377 Freshman Posts 17 |
03-15-18 09:21 AM - Post#253178
And how much of the PR issue could have been prevented if Hardt hadn't left at the beginning of the year. I completely agree that this is a PR issue more than anything else.
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HuskyColonial PhD Student Posts 1976 |
03-15-18 02:37 PM - Post#253216
Watching Penn let their lead slip away to Kansas has preoccupied me. Their big man is terrible. |
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Bison137 Professor Posts 16147
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03-15-18 05:01 PM - Post#253301
A few things to keep in mind when evaluating the seriousness of the offense and whether he is still viewed as part of the team: 1. He was allowed to sit on the bench with the rest of the team every game. 2. He was allowed to help cut down the net with his teammates following the final win. 3. He was in the official team championship picture. 4. He was in the sophomore class picture on BucknellBison.com of the three sophs holding the trophy. 5. The Bison website had a picture of him cutting down the net - something they didn't have to do. Also he was very animated on the bench in terms of supporting his teammates. No sulking of any kind. Adding one more item to consider: 6. Bruce traveled with the team and was present for the open practice today.
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BUFan PhD Student Posts 1936
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03-15-18 07:39 PM - Post#253318
In uniform and practicing? |
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alg55 Pre-Frosh Posts 4 |
03-16-18 01:18 AM - Post#253345
If he has the same offense as Avi and Newman there is no reason to go to this degree of punishment (especially if he is truly sorry). We can debate the length of the suspension, but it is not accurate to say it is the same offense as Avi and Paul. For Bruce it was a second offense, as opposed to it being a first offense for the others. Yes, the punishment seems a bit harsh to me, but I imagine after the first violation that Bruce was told what the punishment would be for a repeat offense. Having said that, I guarantee that if one of Tom Izzo's regulars committed the same offense, they would not have sat out. The three of them did have the same offense. |
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alg55 Pre-Frosh Posts 4 |
03-16-18 01:22 AM - Post#253346
Lewisburg is a small town so I do know the offense but what I heard from a reliable source is Bruce won't be playing until Jan. of next year. This isn't true. |
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