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internetter Postdoc Posts 3400 |
07-23-18 10:12 AM - Post#259270
Spec reports he is leaving, to play with German team
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Chet Forte Postdoc Posts 2974 |
07-23-18 10:40 AM - Post#259275
This is a full blown disaster of Titanic proportions. I had expected a monster senior year from Meisner. And with only one incoming front court player to boot.
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TheLine Professor Posts 5597 |
07-23-18 11:32 AM - Post#259278
Agree. This sucks if true. |
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internetter Postdoc Posts 3400 |
07-23-18 12:08 PM - Post#259285
Lo and Meisner are on teams in the same league which will play each other twice, says C AD site.
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rbg Postdoc Posts 3059 |
07-23-18 12:20 PM - Post#259286
Looks true - https://gocolumbialions.com/news/2018/7/23/mens-b a... After her 2016-2017 sophomore year, Psuline Koerner left the women's team. She was born and raised in Germany and is presently playing for BC Winterthur of Switzerland's top women's league. |
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Chet Forte Postdoc Posts 2974 |
07-23-18 01:15 PM - Post#259290
Apparently the coaches were blind sided by this.
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Go Green PhD Student Posts 1149 |
07-23-18 02:12 PM - Post#259301
Apparently the coaches were blind sided by this. Dave McLaughlin feels the Columbia coaches' pain. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-23-18 05:21 PM - Post#259337
Chet: How could the coach(es) be "blindsided"? Or perhaps you meant to write that the coach is blind? This is the FOURTH player who's left the program in the last ten months for reasons totally unrelated to graduation, injury or poor grades: Andrew Panayiotou; Jaron Faulds; Myles Hanson; and now, Lukas Meisner. And there's no indication we're done counting, yet. |
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Local Observer Junior Posts 231 
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07-23-18 06:25 PM - Post#259340
Was anticipating such developments the rationale for extending 40++ offers to high schoolers? |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-23-18 06:36 PM - Post#259341
That does seem plausible, doesn't it? Or, to use the classic Australian adage: "If you throw enough crap up against a wall, some of it has got to stick!" |
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TheLine Professor Posts 5597 |
07-23-18 06:53 PM - Post#259343
No, LO. You're dead wrong on this. You've been told not to take that number seriously but you persist. At some point all you're doing is trolling the message board. BTW - How many recruits do you think TA "offers"? |
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Murph Masters Student Posts 626 |
07-24-18 08:12 AM - Post#259361
That is a shock. The only thing to do now is put Tape in the middle, surround him with the most athletic guards possible and run, run, run... |
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Clyde Freshman Posts 11 |
07-24-18 09:09 AM - Post#259368
A quick note on "Offers" Today's prep basketball players expect to "be offered" by schools, although that doesn't necessarily mean that an offer leads to a roster spot. An "offer" gets posted on social media and it's a big deal but it's not binding. When a D1 scholarship school "offers" a talented HS sophomore, they aren't actually handing the kid a LOI to sign. An "offer" from an Ivy League school to a HS underclassman isn't really anything other a way for the school to show that the kid is of very strong interest, near the top of their list for that class. I don't know what the proper number of offers is for a non-scholarship school. My sibling is a D1 assistant and says that having 10 or more per year is not uncommon. I follow UCLA closely and believe they have about 30 offers for the '19 and '20 HS classes despite only having a few scholarships available for those years. |
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Chet Forte Postdoc Posts 2974 |
 07-24-18 10:33 AM - Post#259371
That “40†number covers two years. LO should not throw stones insofar as he lives in a glass house. Shall we count the ways in which Harvard since Amaker has been gaming the system? And by being blind sided, while I am hardly a fan of the current HC, my one source told me that the coaches were surprised that Meisner decided to skip his senior year. In other words, whether they should have surmised this or not, the fact is that they were surprised by it. So Tape has to stay out of foul trouble if possible, Brumant and Nweke have to be productive, Smith has to take another step forward, and our several combo guards should produce at least one productive scorer. I am hoping to see Tai Bibbs step up
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Columbia 37P6 Postdoc Posts 2180 |
07-24-18 01:42 PM - Post#259393
Whether or not Engles should have anticipated Meisner's defection or the transfer of Faulds and Hanson is unimportant. What is crucial is that Engles somehow must find a replacement for one or two of them by November, or the Lions will lack the depth up front to be competitive. Columbia still has some very good pieces, and maybe the Lions will have a decent season after all, but the question now is when will this coaching staff's honeymoon finally end |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-24-18 02:35 PM - Post#259401
Would love to see 6'11" senior Shane Eberle be that guy. He's had some bad breaks with concussion and other health related issues; but he's a grinder, and sometimes it just requires being given a true opportunity. Also, I don't believe that Harvard man was throwing stones- that number he cited related to offers may be inaccurate; but it's a high number within the context of the Ivies, even if it references a two year recruiting period. |
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rbg Postdoc Posts 3059 |
07-24-18 04:35 PM - Post#259406
Eberle is not on next year's roster, so I'm not sure if he is still with the team. https://gocolumbialions.com/roster.aspx?path=mbbal... |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-24-18 06:06 PM - Post#259414
This is just another good example to me of how so little about Jim Engles and his program makes sense- at least to someone who's followed NCAA basketball over the last half-century. You're obviously correct that Shane Eberle's names doesn't appear on the 2018-19 roster; but Joseph Smoyer's name does, and he won't be eligible to play for Columbia till November, 2019 as he's a Portland transfer. Furthermore, if Eberle's not on the team, wouldn't the protocol be such that a statement be made from the administration about Shane's status- he did do all the work he could as a 3 year varsity team member, and some small statement from the coach would be in order; but Engles has had NOTHING to say about Shane Eberle; consistent with how he's whitewashed the departures of Andrew Panayiotou, Jaron Faulds and Myles Hanson by having nothing to say about them. |
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Columbia 37P6 Postdoc Posts 2180 |
07-24-18 10:35 PM - Post#259420
With Eberle gone, Columbia now has just one center and only two forwards over 6'5" on its entire roster. What the heck is happening? |
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HARVARDDADGRAD Postdoc Posts 2697 |
07-24-18 11:03 PM - Post#259423
The foreshadowing was the recruitment of Coyers. Apparently meant to respond to pending departures. Likely known for some time. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-25-18 12:01 AM - Post#259424
Call Engles in his office this morning and ask him that $600million question. When he refuses to answer you, follow up right away with the following: why are you running a fascist state? Perhaps because your coaching and communication skills are sorely lacking? |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-25-18 12:04 AM - Post#259425
SPlease forgive my ignorance, but who is Coyers? |
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HARVARDDADGRAD Postdoc Posts 2697 |
07-25-18 10:39 AM - Post#259431
My mistake: Joseph Smoyer - 6'11 230lb transfer from Portland This occurred last April. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-25-18 10:59 AM - Post#259432
Smoyer? Coyers?? What difference does it really make??? Hard to get too excited about a 7 footer, having averaged less than 2 rebounds per game and who won't be eligible to play again for another 17 months (and even then, only for one season). But make sure to at least put his name down on the roster; perhaps, twice-once as Smoyer, and once as Coyers; because you can't very well claim to have a roster in the first place without any names on it-can you? Thank you. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-26-18 08:40 AM - Post#259477
So it now appears that Shane Eberle has withdrawn himself from the basketball program. That makes FIVE individuals from the 2017-18 roster, not on this year's team and for reasons unrelated to graduation nor their academic performance. |
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Dr. V PhD Student Posts 1539 |
07-26-18 11:50 AM - Post#259489
"AntiUngvar," whoever you are, if you're going to accuse someone of "fascism," at least have the gonads not to hide behind some stupid name. But more importantly, please, please start taking your meds again. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-26-18 01:13 PM - Post#259491
I don't believe I'm off the mark. But don't take my word for anything, sir- I do suggest you consider the viewpoint of Mr. Tod Howard Hawks, '66, as cogently presented in today's Spectator. Reassuring to note that not ALL old guarders choose to be in complicit with institutional coverup. |
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Dr. V PhD Student Posts 1539 |
07-26-18 08:58 PM - Post#259507
Nothing you've written addresses the "fascism" nonsense or your other bizarre animus toward our coaches. Address that or, as I suggested, restart you meds please. With all due respect to him, a real fan of long standing, Mr. Hawks is wrong, not because I say so but because based on the information available and proper inferences. It is a fallacy to claim, without any additional evidence, that when two things happen in the same time period, one must have caused the other. It is somewhat unusual that so many players have left the program, which could legitimately raise the question of why, whether there is any pattern other than numbers, but nothing more until and unless there is more evidence of something. And there is not. There has been no information about the Australian, Andrew P. Did he just leave the program or school? And, of course, why one or the other or both? Faulds in effect said he was homesick and transferred to Michigan, an hour from his home. Meisner has decided to forgo his senior season to turn pro in Germany. There was some indirect evidence that Hanson may have been unhappy with the program or the coaches. But exactly why is unclear. Eberle has apparently had a series of health or injury issues. It's not clear whether he finally was healthy this year or whether he could contribute. This is collective evidence of bad luck, mostly for our coaches who have to deal with a series of unexpected events. Those of us who genuinely care about the program, in contrast to those who may just be malicious, would do well to avoid concocting silly conspiracy theories growing out of our disappointment with the effects of such unexpected departures. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-26-18 09:33 PM - Post#259508
Bad luck? You're most certainly entitled to your point of view. Thank you for that. |
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Chet Forte Postdoc Posts 2974 |
 07-27-18 05:46 PM - Post#259561
With respect to Dr.V, who is true blue, I take issue with the Faulds explanation. He obviously had a helicopter father who thought his son should be playing more.
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-27-18 06:24 PM - Post#259562
Chet: I enjoy your commentary and trust in your consistent attempt to be fair; but I must tell you that -having had countless textual, email and in person exchanges with Travis Faulds (Jaron's dad) during the past year- this is NOT a father who smothers his child. Travis, as a basketball coach himself, certainly bonds quite well and frequently with Jaron, and with his daughter ( a basketball player in her own right); and if the father felt the son should have been playing more as a CU freshman, that was only based upon what Jim Engles had assured him would happen, during Jaron's entire Columbia recruitment. You may recall that in the fall of 2016, Eagles & his staff actively marketed the commitment made by Jaron Faulds to Columbia. They even referenced him as the top recruit in the history of the school- a dubious claim given the defining presence at CU of Jim McMillan, Jack Molinas & others; still Jaron's early commitment made to Columbia early and the father's presence then as both a basketball & Columbia ambassador made it that much easier for them to seal the deal with several of the other freshman in Jaron's class. No doubt in my mind that Jaron Faulds is a quality kid, and Travis is a wonderful man and a terrific parent. Thanks. |
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SomeGuy Professor Posts 6413 |
07-28-18 09:12 AM - Post#259569
Yes, Faulds was a highly touted recruit, and that was played up. However, I think that it was expected that he would need time and likely wouldn’t be an immediate star. I don’t know what Engles told the family during the recruiting process, but I would be surprised if he promised something in terms of play8ng time and then didn’t follow through. I think a lot of recruits hear “you’ll have an opportunity to earn play8ng Time†and assume they’ll earn the playing time. But as was discussed some on this board, I think the most connected folks knew he wasn’t going to have a big impact out of the gate, regardless of the four star rating. |
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Silver Maple Postdoc Posts 3779 |
07-28-18 10:50 AM - Post#259572
OK-- so I'm experiencing some cognitive dissonance here. I would think that a four star recruit, by definition, would be expected to be an impact player right from the start at a mid-major program. Either I don't know what these recruiting ratings actually mean (a pretty good possibility), or Faulds was overrated (also plausible). |
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SomeGuy Professor Posts 6413 |
07-28-18 12:54 PM - Post#259577
Well, probably a little bit of both here. The ratings are far from perfect of course. And not an exact science. And some players are going to be the same guy wherever, or at least don’t have a style/skillset that would make them a lead player at a lower level. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-28-18 01:06 PM - Post#259579
SomeG & SilverM: Yes, quite an age of cognitive dissonance we live in, particularly in light of the stream of baffling information emanating from the White House on practically an hourly basis; in fact, I believe the events transpiring in Levien Gym&Dodge Fitness Center these days are the toy department's mirror/version of what's being played out in in the painful course of this sordid Presidency. You both know who the obvious protagonists are in the respective productions; and I'll allow you your conclusions in matching up the remaining, corresponding supporting actors. You both provide good reads; thank you for those. Few freshmen, nationally, and NONE in the Ivies has immediate star impact; but Jaron Faulds DID HAVE UNQUESTIONABLE IMPACT AS A FRESHMAN WHENEVER HE WAS ALLOWED THE OPPORTUNITY TO demonstrate it: he completed the season shooting 60% from the field (which very few NCAA players, nationally, do); he was probably the best rebounder & shot blocker on the team; he had a 2 game December streak against Albany & Quinnipiac when he made 13 of 17 shots, while scoring 29 points; and in 3 games against nationally labelled schools -Vilanova, PennState and Boston College- Jaron played a combined 58 minutes, while converting 10 of 18 shots and accumulating 21 points. I'd say that's pretty good for an 18 year old living 1,000 miles away from home for the first time & brand new to handling Columbia's course load, too- no sign of homesickness shown there, either, despite some erroneous reports of such! So, however you may choose to interpret those pre-existing ratings, Jaron Faulds usually showed us something in the way of helping his team in the 14 minutes per game playing time he received. Also, if you go back into the Spectator archives (fall, 2016;winter 2016-17), you'll see that information was put out, UNDOUBTEDLY with the basketball offfice's blessings that promoted Jaron as men's basketball's highest ranked recruit ever. Just look at Jered Everson's article from January 27, 2017, calling the Faulds commitment to CU a watershed moment for the program. And if/when you review this press, it's important for you to be mindful of the fact that the kid, Jaron, NEVER asked for this attention; the boy's father, Travis, NEVER asked for this kind of attention. This information only came out because Jim Engles knew it would be useful for the families of future CU freshmen Bibbs, Hanson, Stefanini and Brumant to have it known to them as they were deliberating on the best college choices to be made for their sons. Engles, in fact, encouraged Travis (Jaron's dad) to contact the parents of these other student-athletes, knowing that he'd be speaking most favorably to them about the Columbia program. So please understand that while Jaron Faulds and his family went through an at times arduous recruitment process; they were also actually used in the recruitment of others. Thus, I think it's reasonable to infer from all of this, that the Faulds family was led to believe the Columbia program would be built around Jaron. It's often true as SomeGuy states that recruits often hear what they want to hear; but Jaron Faulds wasn't just any recruit- at least not for Jim Engles. |
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Silver Maple Postdoc Posts 3779 |
07-28-18 01:44 PM - Post#259580
Thanks for all the info. However, I'm going to take issue with your statement that no Ivy freshmen have star impact. Obviously, to some extent, this is all dependent upon how you define 'star,' but there are several guys playing in the league right now who would have met pretty much anybody's definition of star when they were freshmen. |
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Old Bear Postdoc Posts 4000 |
07-28-18 01:45 PM - Post#259581
One of them plays for Brown . |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-28-18 02:22 PM - Post#259582
Yes, as the Bear points out, Desmond Cambridge from Tennessee had a heck of freshman year for Brown. But he was showcased by the Brown staff; to the tune of 30 minutes and 15 shots per game (shot only 40%, however). In my view, the Columbia freshmen didn't receive similar opportunities to show their wares; not being given a chance makes it easy for someone to conclude you're (probably) overrated. |
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PennFan10 Postdoc Posts 3589 |
07-28-18 04:38 PM - Post#259584
Miye Oni Bryce Aiken Des Cambridge AJ Brodeur Evan Boudreaux All stars as freshman. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-28-18 04:59 PM - Post#259585
PennFan10: All of the above mentioned five come with a strong body of work, and I applaud you for your presentation. To me, a "star" freshman will either have his name called during the 1st round of the most immediate NBA to his frosh season; and/or secure for his school a spot in the NCAA tournament of that same season- that's, of course, simply my definition; but none of the 5 aforementioned individuals would qualify. (Columbia's Jim McMillian came close to meeting that standard; when Columbia was invited to the tournament in 1968 it was indeed McMillian's 1st year of NCAA varsity competition, though he was a college sophomore.) |
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Silver Maple Postdoc Posts 3779 |
07-28-18 05:51 PM - Post#259586
To me that's an unrealistic definition. I would say that a star freshman is a player who immediately establishes himself as one of the best in the conference at his position, is a player to whom opposing teams must devote disproportionate attention, and who is an all conference selection in his first year. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-28-18 05:59 PM - Post#259587
I like your definition; you're probably much more of a realist than I am in everyday life, too. Actually, the subject of this thread may have come fairly close to qualifying, as a star, by your standard; though, at the time, he was a bit older than a traditional Ivy League frosh. |
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Silver Maple Postdoc Posts 3779 |
07-28-18 06:33 PM - Post#259588
Sorry-- I don't think you understand the social norms of this discussion board, so I'll explain. You're not supposed to agree with me. You might want to delete the above post and come back with something with an ever-so-slightly-nasty edge to it. I'll then escalate the tone, questioning your intelligence and objectivity. You'll then say something about my mother. Then Jeff will wade in, and will say that we're both idiots. Once Jeff's in, P38 won't be able to resist getting involved. No matter what Jeff says, he'll have to take the opposite position. You and I will have lost interest by this point, but Jeff and 38 will go back and forth for a week or so. By the time they blow themselves out, the argument will have become unrecognizable to its originators, as they'll be bitterly disagreeing about whether or not Jack Eggleston was the best Penn player of the modern era. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-28-18 06:59 PM - Post#259589
Tony Price, of Bronx, NY and Taft HighSchool was the best UPenn player of this or any preexisting era! (But perhaps such an opinion doesn't belong on a Columbia forum.) |
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CUBballFan Freshman Posts 14 |
07-28-18 09:08 PM - Post#259591
On the contrary, Chet, it is clear that this is one person you don’t know. Almost everyone who actually does know the family views the father as an “actively involved†parent, coach, and support system to his three kids AND their teammates, including many of the CU underclassmen. And those “in the knowâ€, say he has been that same parent with the high school team, the EYBL teams, and our CU team. In no other basketball or social circles is the father viewed as a “helicopter parentâ€, but rather one of the few parents who has always made himself available to the coaches and players when they needed something. In regards to players, if you look at his social media history, it is clear that he has always been a supportive and positive influence. That was a resource Engles should have embraced, not driven away. As AntiUngvar already stated, Engles sure liked it when the father was reaching out and helping recruit other members of the talented freshman class. The early departures of Panatayiou (who abruptly quit the team because he “didn’t enjoy the game anymore†after 1 year with Engles), Faulds & Hanson (who left because of the negative culture, not PT), Safir (who made a lateral move to the other side of the country to join our former coach), and Meisner (who left prematurely despite knowing he would be in a great position to post huge numbers this year) are not just a coincidence. Our HC continues to be the common denominator. And, Dr. V, as far your suggestion that AntiUngvar should start taking his meds... you may want to consider stopping the pill regimen Engles put you on. Despite the reality of the CU basketball situation, you seem to have slipped into a complicit state of mind. |
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SomeGuy Professor Posts 6413 |
07-28-18 09:40 PM - Post#259592
Yes, I think some of the debate here is about definitions and degree of impact. Faulds was efficient offensively, was a consistent rotation contributor overall, and showed potential for the future. To me, his performance was within what I think were positive expectations. To push back on some of your assertions, though, as a rebounder he was statistically significantly behind Tape and Meisner, and basically even with smaller options like Hunter and Hanson. As a shot blocker, he was basically even with Tape (for whatever reason, Tape was a much better shot blocker in conference). I also had the impression that Engles didn’t like the matchup with Faulds when opponents played small, which limited opportunities particularly in conference. Defensive stats are tricky, but there is some reason to believe that Tape was the better defensive option. offensively I think it is clear Faulds was the better player last year. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-28-18 09:55 PM - Post#259593
Sir or Madam, as the case may be: Thank you for acknowledging Travis Faulds as the true sportsman, parent and booster of Columbia basketball he's been and remains. Thank you, too, for giving your consideration and time to my remarks. You've actually made a friend for life, though obviously not by true design. If there's any large or small matter that I can ever address on your behalf, please do feel free to write me at: mtv9@caa.columbia.edu |
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Chet Forte Postdoc Posts 2974 |
07-29-18 07:26 AM - Post#259599
A few points: the tweets by Faulds senior IMHO were downright vicious. It is hard to believe that they were not directed at Engles despite later denials. In fact, no matter the cause, in my opinion they were basically unprecedented in my years on this board and seemed to be directly targeted and highly mean spirited. Second, while I am no fan of the Engles regime based upon what I have seen to date, I have to assume that if Faulds deserved more minutes Engles would have given them to him. All in all, a most unfortunate turn of events.
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-29-18 04:04 PM - Post#259605
SomeGuy: I have no problem with your "pushing back on my assertions"- hope, in fact that doing so improves the quality of your life somehow; but if your going to initiate these player comparisons, it may be wise to consider as much of the 2017-18 data available to you: You wrote that J.Faulds " as a rebounder was statistically significantly behind Tape and Meisner"; IN FACT, the primary category he was significantly behind those two starting players was minutes played- Meisner logged 300 more minutes than Jaron; and Patrick played almost 100 more last season; rather difficult to get credit for NCAA rebounds when you're sitting on the bench next to Gerry Sherwin, you may be willing to agree. You're not allowed to block shots from the bench, or score any points, either. You also write that "defensive stats are tricky." But offensive numbers can be somewhat ambiguous, as well. So much of all this is about being given the opportunity to perform well. Suppose Jaron Faulds got the star treatment at Columbia that Des Cambridge received at Brown- translating to 30 minutes playing time & 15 shot attempts, per event. That having been the case, it's reasonable to see the real probability of Faulds having supplied Columbia with more than 20 points and 7 rebounds per game, enough to have led the team in both categories. All, hypothetical? Yes; but if Faulds usually took good & makeable shots during 14 minutes on the court (which he did do), he would have taken more such shots given 30 minutes on the court. Whatever hustle he displayed in going after the ball would have continued with increased playing time, considering he was a healthy 18 year old kid. You go on to imply that Faulds was the team's best low post scoring option; and if you're as correct about that as I believe you are , Coach Engles obviously wasn't having it as Jaron (despite his 60% FGP) took the same amount of shots as Patrick, and about 150 less than Meisner during the course of the lost season. One more interesting point you made was that "Engles didn’t like the matchup with Faulds when opponents played small". That's true; he clearly didn't. But given his limited rate of success, when Engles doesn't like something, there's probably good reason for a normal coach, actually trying to win a game, to like it! What if Engles, instead of getting caught with his pants down 28 games in a row, DICTATED the terms under which the contest would be played? What if instead of responding to a team's small lineup with a small lineup of his own, Engles made the opponent ANSWER to his BIG lineup? Unfortunately, as the number of white knuckle losses mounted, it just never seemed to occur to this uninspired, vegetable of a man to ever attempt something different. |
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Dr. V PhD Student Posts 1539 |
07-29-18 05:19 PM - Post#259607
First it was alleged fascism, and now a “vegetable of a man�? Anyone still think this person doesn’t need to get back on his meds? I’m not complicit in anything. But I’m kinda old fashioned, I believe that facts matter. It’s one thing when something says stupid stuff (e.g., that it reflects badly on Engles that he didn’t thank or publicly acknowledge that a player who was on the team for three years but because of injuries or other reasons never played has left the team —no, coaches don’t do that, i.e., I’ve never seen or heard a coach do that in this type of situation; coaches may do that at an end of season banquet; and the reality of such situations is that most athletes get a highly coveted admission slot plus need based financial aid, which slot, through no fault of the player, did not contribute to the team) or just imagines something (e.g., that a writer for the Spec must have gotten the information that Faulds was purportedly the highest rated CU recruit ever from our coaches—no, I’ve never heard either our current coaches, former coaches or other coaches ever talk in terms of one recruit being higher or lower rated than others), but it’s another when such claims are made along with allegations of facism or whatever other lunacy is claimed and the poster is someone who just recently surfaced who seemed to have some sort of perverse animus or vendetta towards one of our coaches. Yes, that’s a problem if one has any sense of fairness or rationality. Re Faulds: on two occasions he indicated homesickness. On twitter when announcing his transfer to Michigan, he wrote that M is a great school with great BB and that it’s only an hour away from home! And in an article about the same time that ran in one of the papers in Michigan, he was asked why he had left CU and he said that it wasn’t anything specific but that CU was 11 hours away from home. Whether that was the major reason, the minor reason or one of several reasons why he left, more than what’s in the public domain I don’t know. Re Mr. Faulds, I’ve never met or had any dealings with the gentleman, so I have no opinion as to whether he is a helicopter father or the greatest person since Mother Theresa or what. Last year I attended several practices, I attended the end of season banquet and more recently spent a day watching one of the CU BB Elite camps at which almost all of our players worked. I have over the years watched numerous practices conducted by virtually all of our coaches since the early 70’s. Re the current coaching regime, I have never seen even the hint of anything unusual in terms of player-coach relations. The one thing that I did see this past year, which I feel free to share given that he is no longer at CU, is that at the practices that I saw—and I never asked whether that was typical or not, so don’t know—is that the player who repeatedly came in last in the multiple end to end sprints the players were made to run was Faulds. Again, I have no idea whether that was usual or unusual or whether that was a matter of stamina or conditioning or something temporary. |
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SomeGuy Professor Posts 6413 |
07-29-18 06:05 PM - Post#259608
The rebounding and block stats I was referencing weren’t totals. They are the percentage of available rebounds or blocks that each player got while they were in the game. When Faulds is on the floor he gets about 12.5 percent of the available rebounds, which is good (obviously the share of each player on the floor would be 10), but not particularly good for a big man. Tape and Meisner both get over 15%. On the defensive end, Meisner was at 25%. Blocks are the same — tape and Faulds are both 8-9%. I personally agree with Engles on the big versus small thing, and most coaches these days seem to. It may be part of why the rebounding numbers for Faulds were so poor on the defensive end, too. It can be hard for a big at this level to step out and defend a smaller guy, and then be in position to rebound. So what you end up seeing is Faulds play against guys like Lewis and Rothschild, who aren’t threats away from the basket, and sit against a guy like Gettings who I suspect would eat him alive. As he gains experience, Faulds may turn that around (it took Gettings himself a year to figure it out). On the offensive end and the Cambridge comments, the possession stats are again more complicated. Faulds has a very low usage rate, which is in part schematic, but also largely Faulds’ style of play. Cambridge used up 29% of Brown possessions while on the floor, while Faulds just used 16%. They operated at similar ORATs, but ORAT almost always goes down as usage increases. So presumably Faulds would be much less efficient if he was as much the focus as Cambridge, and Cambridge would be much more efficient if he picked his spots as much as Faulds. A lot of Penn fans can relate to what is going on at Columbia. Dr. V is right that the odds of playing winning basketball go down if everyone is sniping at each other, and that extends from the team itself all the way out to the alums who support the program. I think sometimes we make it a lot harder for the teams and kids we root for to succeed because we go negative. I know that you feel that you are reacting to negativity that starts with the coach, but I suspect there are quite a few around the program who would say it starts somewhere else. Some of the negativity around and about Kyle might suggest that the issue could be cultural and go beyond the head coaches. All this said (and the reason I started with the Penn comment), there are instances when you absolutely have the wrong guy and need to call that out. I don’t have the answer — just trying to lend some perspective where it seems like it might have been lost by those too close to it. Given the track record of success at NJIT, i’d Be inclined to play this out for another couple of years. But the loss of Meisner makes it hard to see Columbia being real competitive this year. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-29-18 07:09 PM - Post#259610
Chet: There was a basketball assistant coach here in the Tommy Penders / mid seventies period named James Brown- coming from the projects of Long Island City, Queens, NY & having made it through Dartmouth College at a time when few if any blacks even ventured into the state of New Hampshire. James, IMHO, was the greatest player in the history of the Dartmouth program-hands down; better than the James Brown of Harvard, who went on to fame with CBS; and good enough to be drafted by the NBA in 1973. James had a signature line back then, when we talked about players' skill levels, etc.; which was, when you choose to 'butt'"UME" you often make an butt of you and me. If you choose to "assume" certain things, that's indeed your choice; but doing so without considering all of the empirical information before usually tends to, I think, dishonor your fine Columbia education. So you're NOT actually having to assume anything; just as the CU administration doesn't HAVE to keep Engles here -while waiting for another pair of Nike shoes to drop- simply because he's under contract; you're both actually, actively or passively, making choices. And I must hold myself accountable, too, because, I've somehow and incorrectly presented Travis Faulds to you as Michigan's answer to Mother Teresa. I can see your interpretation of Travis's tweeting as plausible. I have a similar take to yours on that subject; though you may not be familiar with my own tweeting which at times, could by comparison, actually place Travis in a light alongside Mother Teresa! I don't know how broad a range of life experiences you've had or how old you are, but as someone close to the end of the line, I do know there comes a time for most of us to plant our feet and take a stand in defense of a family member facing a possible crisis or in obvious need of assistance. You probably realize that student athletes coming to Columbia invariably don't come because of Chet Forte's Blog, or Tom's Restaurant or Kenneth Jackson's History of New York Seminar; whether they're coming from Melbourne, Australia; or Chaska, Minnesota; or Holt, Michigan- they're here PRIMARILY because of the trust they and their families placed in the sports coach who CONvinced them to come to New York City. And when it becomes obvious to a blind man that this trust has been misplaced, something has to be done, efficiently, powerfully and quickly, because that student athlete then often finds him/her self in quite a vulnerable position. For the Faulds family, I think that defining moment took place on the evening of January 27 in Ithaca, New York, at the Cornell campus. In my view, Jim Engles is a small man in terms of character, with large insecurities connected to his very limited skill sets. I do believe that Engles, over time, grew more & more intimidated by the Travis Faulds persona; and why wouldn't he be? Travis being a much more polished, well rounded, and empathetic individual, who human beings of all backgrounds simply gravitate to. Engles knew that Travis had far more credibility than he, Engles could ever come close to matching with the Columbia athletes entrusted to him. Travis, unwittingly, made Engles all too aware of his insecurities; and the coach saw social media as simply an extension of how people like Travis made him appear so feeble by comparison. #%$@ YOU to the Faulds family- and make no mistake about it; this was a FOCK YOU production orchestrated by a piece of excrement given human form by a Brooks Brothers suit. So if you're to ASSume Jaron got the overall playing time he deserved, then ASSume further that he deserved ZERO minutes of playing time that night in Ithaca, too; and ASSume further still, that we all deserved witnessing the nightmarish season as it played out; and which we're still paying for in terms of shoes/Nikes dropping since the nineteenth Lions loss in Cambridge on March 3rd- IMHO, look for one more pair to drop before Labor Day. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-29-18 07:29 PM - Post#259612
Sir: You're entitled to say whatever you wish to say herein. However, you will never succeed in censuring or marginalizing me. Furthermore, you should know that broaching this issue of medication FULLY discredits you as a supposedly educated and humane person. And, at the very least, you are surely a learned and reasonably intelligent fellow, who by this time knows how to reach out to me. Please do so, and I'll make arrangements to meet with you at your complete and soonest convenience to more than state my case to you to you, in person completely, thoroughly and in a manner that's not possible within the framework of this forum. Thank you, and do enjoy the rest of your evening. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-29-18 07:33 PM - Post#259613
Track record of success? Engles lost 30 games one year at NJIT; given the opportunity, that piece of history may soon repeat itself. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-29-18 10:15 PM - Post#259616
Chet, I inadvertently blew up a piece of that message- my apologies. Basically, my contention is that Engles threw away that game at Cornell because he needed to make a statement to Travis. Crazy, perhaps. But not so when you factor in Engles's concerns about criticism of him on social media. |
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SomeGuy Professor Posts 6413 |
07-29-18 11:01 PM - Post#259618
Right. But that was a team that had just recently come from division III and had won zero games the year before he took over. The 1-30 season is actually part of what makes their rise under Engles so remarkable. He took what was quite literally the worst team in division 1 and made them a 20 game winner in a remarkably short period of time. |
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SomeGuy Professor Posts 6413 |
07-29-18 11:19 PM - Post#259619
This is kind of cryptic. What exactly was the “defining moment†in Ithaca? |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-29-18 11:33 PM - Post#259620
And he then took a program here, that won 100 games over the course of 6 years, and turned it into a laughing stock in a matter of less than eighteen months. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-29-18 11:45 PM - Post#259621
I'll get back to you tomorrow on that Some Guy. I do like you SG- but stick to analytics, though I'd love to know where you get these available rebound numbers from! And then when you get into your "suspicions" and "presumptions", I'm tempted to suggest you place those in a neat pile and apply them forcefully where the sun doesn't shine. Thank you. |
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SomeGuy Professor Posts 6413 |
07-30-18 01:58 AM - Post#259622
Well, I’m not certain which presumptions and assumptions are bothering you, but my presumptions in regard to offensive efficiency (when I used the word “presumablyâ€) are analytically driven. Rebounding percentage and block percentage are available in various places, but the easiest for me to use is college basketball reference: https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/ |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-30-18 09:44 AM - Post#259627
So SomeGuy, why not simply read your posts & see where you used that language? Also, why did your program altering coach have Patrick & Jaron take the same number of shots last season? Even you, SomeGuy, clearly not a Faulds fan by any means, stated that he was the better option,offensively speaking. |
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TheLine Professor Posts 5597 |
07-30-18 12:01 PM - Post#259633
Agree with SomeGuy's analysis of the numbers. It's fair to say Tape was a bit better than Faulds overall, with Tape better on the defensive end and Faulds on the offensive end. My eyeballs don't disagree with that. I would've like to see both play more minutes, especially towards the end of the season. As much as I liked Faulds the player, he wasn't a 4 star and I wasn't expecting him to be. He was a good get overall but more like a 2*+ which is still good for our league. He didn't impress me as much as Cambridge or Atkinson. But don't think that's important to the gist of the conversation on this thread. The bigger issue was why Hickman was given as long a leash as he was. He was a sinkhole. Pairing him with a good but somewhat out of control Smith didn't work because neither did much to help the rest of the team develop. And it's never a good sign to have so many players transfer out, especially ones you are counting on. Sometimes you recruit a malcontent and that's understandable but rare. Sometimes there are events out of the coach's control - that also is understandable. But more likely something is amiss when you have this many players transferring out. |
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SomeGuy Professor Posts 6413 |
07-30-18 01:51 PM - Post#259641
Offense wasn’t the issue for Columbia last year. Statistically they had the best offense in the league. Defense is where they lost games. So it makes sense to go with the better defensive option between Tape and Faulds. As to who got more shots, Tape actually had a little higher usage rate than Faulds. But the argument that Faulds should get more shots than Tape could be extended out to explain why Faulds took so few shots — the only rotation players who had lower ORATs than Faulds were Tape, Hunter, Hickman and Hanson. So the guys taking the shots last year were generally better options (with the exception of Hickman). |
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SomeGuy Professor Posts 6413 |
07-30-18 02:00 PM - Post#259643
Kind of a mystery to me what happened with Hickman. He was so good at the start of his junior year. Don’t know if they were just waiting for that guy to come back or what. Your point about the Smith pairing is a good one though — it seems like a pairing where the scoring was fairly static, and as one went up the other went down. So maybe after those first 6 games or so it became Smith’s team, and Hickman scored less. I thought Hickman got a bit of an unfair bad rap last year, as he defended the perimeter better than any of the other options and seemed to be a leader. But the offense would have been more efficient if Adlesh shot more and Hickman less. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-30-18 02:05 PM - Post#259645
That word "generally" lets you maneuver; but you're saying Smith, with 250 missed shots was a better option than a kid making 60%- is that correct? |
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Columbia 37P6 Postdoc Posts 2180 |
07-30-18 02:50 PM - Post#259662
May I suggest that you back off on Smith already, he's a great basketball player and certainly the key to whatever success this Columbia Basketball Team will have next season. None of us have been happy with Columbia's record in the Engles era, but Smith has been sensational and a joy to watch. |
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SomeGuy Professor Posts 6413 |
07-30-18 02:58 PM - Post#259663
Correct. Much of that is because of Smith’s ability to get to the line and convert (and Faulds’ ability to get to the line and not convert). Some of it is because a 3 is with more than a 2. |
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Mike Valmas Freshman Posts 26 |
07-30-18 03:12 PM - Post#259664
I love Coach Engles. |
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Chet Forte Postdoc Posts 2974 |
07-30-18 03:14 PM - Post#259665
I think the criticisms of Smith are unfair and frankly off point. Smith is a great player with NBA level skills. His shooting percentage suffers because he has to carry such an enormous load. And here is my last comment on Faulds. He has potential but just wasn’t strong enough to play more minutes. He needed some serious strength and conditioning work. And my final comment on Hickman; Caitlin was much better and Hickman should have been benched as soon as Caitlin was ready to go.
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Chet Forte Postdoc Posts 2974 |
07-30-18 03:14 PM - Post#259666
Meant Castlin of course.
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Clyde Freshman Posts 11 |
07-30-18 03:18 PM - Post#259667
NBA level skills? You're high. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-30-18 03:24 PM - Post#259670
Interesting commentary-thanks. SomeGuy works hard on the analytics and I guess you do, as well; but one thing I wish you guys would place some value on when you do these player comparisons is the respective ages of the individuals- Jaron Faulds was just 18 for the entire 17-18 season Patrick was more than a full year older, and these people you mention Cambridge and Atkinson (both attended prep schools after HS) are both a year older, too. And, believe it or not, Meisner turns 23 this week- big physical difference at times between a teenager and a 23 yearly man. Faulds is a huge loss for the program; he should have encouraged more when he was still here, and the relationship didn't have to end as it did. Regardless of your numerical evaluation, John Beilein apparently believes in Jaron, and will offer him a real opportunity to contribute in Michigan; and I believe he'll do just that as soon as he's eligible to perform in 2019. Nathan Hickman I thought actually came on during the final 2 Ivy weekends of the season- actually shooting over 50% and offering 17 points per game; thought he had a particularly hard time playing with Smith- though Nate was team captain, what could he possibly tell Smith (in the way of reeling him in) who usually played the whole game? |
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Mike Valmas Freshman Posts 26 |
07-30-18 03:28 PM - Post#259672
You should be a basketball coach. You're not realizing your full potential posting on message boards from your kitchen all day. |
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TheLine Professor Posts 5597 |
07-30-18 03:32 PM - Post#259674
I already said I'd have preferred they both received more minutes. If I went by eyes alone I'd have wanted Tape out there more than Faulds. But this isn't a Tape vs. Faulds thing to me, it's more of a why didn't both of them play more thing. I disagree that Faulds going to be a difference maker at Michigan - if he couldn't dominate at our level then he has little chance of being anything better than back of the rotation there. Him transferring to Michigan lends more credence to the homesick argument TBH. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-30-18 03:38 PM - Post#259677
A three is worth more than a two, if you make it. Consider it arithmetically: If you're shooting 60% (Faulds), you've got 12 points after taking 10 shots; 10/3s at 30 %(Smith) gives you 9 points. Smith didn't really get a good return on shooting fouls given all the misses- usually driving into a pack of players maintaining vertical position and tossing up prayers. Faulds wasn't out there enough and not given enough opportunities with the ball to accumulate a reasonable sample size of free throw attempts for you to gauge his FTP. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-30-18 03:42 PM - Post#259678
What's your basis for that? |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-30-18 04:14 PM - Post#259684
The criticisms of Smith are not unfair; you may not like them or agree with them, and why would you say they're off point? If he's been worn down by the manner his enabler's made use of him, use him differently- could the results possibly be any worse? |
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SomeGuy Professor Posts 6413 |
07-30-18 04:55 PM - Post#259702
All of that gets baked into the ORAT. So once you add the rate at which he gets to the line and the makes, Columbia is more likely to score when the ball is in Smith’s hands then they were with in Faulds’ hands. |
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SomeGuy Professor Posts 6413 |
07-30-18 05:02 PM - Post#259703
Well, now i’ll be the jerk who disagrees with everyone on both sides of the argument. Offense wasn’t the problem for Columbia last year. Defense was. The same could be said for Smith. I don’t think he was anywhere lose to NBA level on offense, but he was obviously very good. But on defense, he hurts, and pairing him with another short guard in Adlesh hurts even more. And playing 2 small guards left Hickman with the toughest matchups of all. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-30-18 05:06 PM - Post#259704
Columbia was also more likely to not to score when it was in Smith hands because it's more often than not in his hands. But I'd have to say that most of this from you, of late, has been nonsense- a whitewashing of a season of horrible, horrible results. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-30-18 05:08 PM - Post#259705
You're actually amazing- you do manage to disagree with everyone; yourself included! |
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SomeGuy Professor Posts 6413 |
07-30-18 05:11 PM - Post#259707
I’m not entirely sure what relative ages have to do with it. If the question is whether he was used enough, it doesn’t matter if Meisner is older; the question is simply who gives Columbia the best chance to win. On the Michigan thing, we will see what happens. Ryan Pettinella comes to mind as an Ivy player who had similar controversy (and maybe a similar Dad) and managed to become a useful piece at UVA. Maybe Faulds will do the same at Michigan (my other Alma mater). But he will need to work very hard and develop a lot to play at all. Personally i think the odds are against him playing a meaningful role (if at all), and the choice itself suggests that might not be the ultimate goal. |
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SomeGuy Professor Posts 6413 |
07-30-18 05:22 PM - Post#259710
I assume as a math tutor you got this, but just in case: when the ball is in Smith’s hands, Columbia has a higher percentage chance of scoring than when the ball is in Faulds hands. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-30-18 05:23 PM - Post#259711
That was good- you wrote 200 words and didn't manage to disagree with yourself even once! |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-30-18 05:29 PM - Post#259712
I answered you on that (though it wasn't in a very polite manner); and since the ball was in said player's hands more often than not, were you correct, CU would have had more wins to show for it. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-30-18 05:47 PM - Post#259715
Chet:There was a basketball assistant coach here in the Tommy Penders / mid seventies period named James Brown- coming from the projects of Long Island City, Queens, NY & having made it through Dartmouth College at a time when few if any blacks even ventured into the state of New Hampshire. James, IMHO, was the greatest player in the history of the Dartmouth program-hands down; better than the James Brown of Harvard, who went on to fame with CBS; and good enough to be drafted by the NBA in 1973. James had a signature line back then, when we talked about players' skill levels, etc.; which was, when you choose to 'butt''"UME" you often make an butt of you and me. If you choose to "assume" certain things, that's indeed your choice; but doing so without considering all of the empirical information before usually tends to, I think, dishonors your fine Columbia education. So you're NOT actually having to assume anything; just as the CU administration doesn't HAVE to keep Engles here -while waiting for another pair of Nike shoes to drop- simply because he's under contract; you're both actually, actively or passively, making choices. And I must hold myself accountable, too, because, I've somehow and incorrectly presented Travis Faulds to you as Michigan's answer to Mother Teresa. I can see your interpretation of Travis's tweeting as plausible. I have a similar take to yours on that subject; though you may not be familiar with my own tweeting which at times, could by comparison, actually place Travis in a light alongside Mother Teresa! I don't know how broad a range of life experiences you've had or how old you are, but as someone close to the end of the line, I do know there comes a time for most of us to plant our feet and take a stand in defense of a family member facing a possible crisis or in obvious need of assistance. You probably realize that student athletes coming to Columbia invariably don't come because of Chet Forte's Blog, or Tom's Restaurant or Kenneth Jackson's History of New York Seminar; whether they're coming from Melbourne, Australia; or Chaska, Minnesota; or Holt, Michigan- they're here PRIMARILY because of the trust they and their families placed in the sports coach who CONvinced them to come to New York City. And when it becomes obvious to a blind man that this trust has been misplaced, something has to be done, efficiently, powerfully and quickly, because that student athlete then often finds him/her self in quite a vulnerable position. For the Faulds family, I think that defining moment took place on the evening of January 27 in Ithaca, New York, at the Cornell campus. In my view, Jim Engles is a small man in terms of character, with huge insecurities connected to his very limited skill sets. I do believe that Engles, over time, grew more & more intimidated by the Travis Faulds persona; and why wouldn't he be? Travis being a much more polished, well rounded, and empathetic individual, who human beings of all backgrounds simply gravitate to. Engles knew that Travis had far more credibility than he, Engles could ever come close to matching with the Columbia athletes entrusted to him. Travis, unwittingly, made Engles all too aware of his insecurities; and the coach saw social media as simply an extension of how people like Travis made him appear so feeble by comparison. #%$@#%$@ YOU production orchestrated by a piece of excrement given human form by a Brooks Brothers suit. So, Chet, if you're to ASSume Jaron got the overall playing time he deserved, then ASSume further that he deserved ZERO minutes of playing time that night in Ithaca, too; and ASSume further still, that we all deserved witnessing the nightmarish season as it played out; and which we're still paying for in terms of shoes/Nikes dropping since the nineteenth Lions loss in Cambridge on March 3rd- IMHO, look for one more pair to drop before Labor Day. |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
07-30-18 06:01 PM - Post#259717
True- that's just hyperbolic nonsense. One player of NBA skill level should be more than enough to advance any Ivy League school team to its league's post-season tournament, even one with the burden on a stuffed shirt nitwit a coach pinned to its sideline. |
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LionFan Senior Posts 398 |
08-01-18 12:14 PM - Post#259805
AntiUngvar, you've made your point far beyond the excessiveness. It's no longer interesting or entertaining. Isn't that the reason the rest of us are here, after all? We're just chatting about a bunch of kids playing a game. I don't like to criticize individuals here, but AU if you check yourself you'll find that you've progressed into obsession, and it has become peculiar. Just look at the name you've chosen to identify yourself with and your persistent use of it. You've become a troll, man. Not good. |
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Clyde Freshman Posts 11 |
08-02-18 08:20 AM - Post#259854
Agreed. We all get that you don't like Jim, hope he fails and love the Faulds family etc but it's sort of tiresome and predictable. There are quite a few people, including an increasing number of basketball alumni, pulling for Jim and the program. Go Lions! |
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AntiUngvar Masters Student Posts 530 |
08-02-18 10:58 AM - Post#259861
I hadn't responded to anything here in 48 hours and was actually going to give it a rest. But apparently, some of you, want to just hammer away, and expect the person on the receiving end of your blows to simply accept them. I believe one can support the Columbia program and oppose a coach who's driven 5 kids away from it in less than 1 year. Even if he's had nothing to do with the attrition, it will be used against CU by opposing recruiters- you see the sarcasm of people from other schools on this site. But if you want to support JE, that's your right; & if you want to buy into the fantasy that a kid who's missed 500 shots in 2 NCAA years is NBA ready, go right ahead. But if you direct something to/at me, know that I won't be discredited- that's something from Trump's playbook, and I'm not having it! |
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Billy Hoyle Freshman Posts 82 |
08-03-18 06:32 PM - Post#259938
I am an unapologetic Kyle Smith fan but he did not leave the roster in great shape. His final team lost one of the best ever at CU in Lo, a power 5 contributor in Mullins, the classic swiss army knife in Issac Cohen and a great all-around player in Rosenberg, rising seniors Coby and Petrasek and nothing comparable to replace them. Hunter? Eberle? Killingsworth? Of course, the program was going to slip
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