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Username Post: Miami
mbaprof
Senior
Posts 342
12-01-18 12:34 PM - Post#267710    

What are our chances?
AntiUngvar
Masters Student
Posts 530
12-01-18 12:59 PM - Post#267711    

Outstanding; and the greater the number of attendees, the better!

TheLine
Professor
Posts 5597
12-01-18 01:04 PM - Post#267712    

They are a better team than the one that beat us 2 years ago.

Their best player is Chris Lykes, who I'd think will be Dev's assignment. Comp for Lykes is Spud Webb - short but difficult to contain on the offense end and tenacious on the defensive end.

Miami's big man, Izundu, is a bad matchup for AJ and don't think Max has a chance against him.

Miami is very good defending 3's.

In short - chances are not good.

PennFan10
Postdoc
Posts 3580
12-01-18 03:13 PM - Post#267720    

Heck, let’s just forfeit then.
SteveChop
PhD Student
Posts 1150
12-01-18 03:59 PM - Post#267728    

Chances may not be good but that's why they play the game. Maybe we can call American Airlines and arrange for a 20 hour flight to Philadelphia.

Seriously, it is still good to place these kinds of challenges in front of our guys. We will now have played a Big 12 team, a Pac 12 team, and an ACC team with games against a Big East school ('Nova) and two A-10 schools coming up. I must applaud Steve for putting together this kind of challenging schedule - it can only make our guys better and prepare them for the Ivy season and hopefully, a post season tournament (NCAA or NIT)

PennFan10
Postdoc
Posts 3580
12-01-18 04:21 PM - Post#267730    

Kansas State is better than Miami and we competed with them. We may not win, but I like a strong showing at home.
PennFan10
Postdoc
Posts 3580
12-01-18 04:22 PM - Post#267731    

But our SOS sucks though relative to all the other Ivys!
palestra38
Professor
Posts 32685
12-01-18 05:29 PM - Post#267737    

Marquette 73-K. State 61 with less than 6 minutes to go.
10Q
Professor
Posts 23199
12-01-18 10:34 PM - Post#267763    

Yale beat Miami. Hello
AntiUngvar
Masters Student
Posts 530
12-01-18 10:49 PM - Post#267766    

Sam:
That can't be true (re: SOS) unless you view Columbia as so no longer part of the IL; and maybe they're not! And though it's clearly not within your purview to declare a forfeit, I'd say that what the Bulldogs can accomplish in Miami, the Quakers can more readily make happen in the City of Sisterly Affection- especially if you and your entire entourage show up to watch!

Mike Porter
Postdoc
Posts 3615
Mike Porter
12-02-18 01:27 AM - Post#267770    

Where do I get what some of this guy is having? Is there an app that delivers it?!?
10Q
Professor
Posts 23199
12-02-18 10:58 AM - Post#267782    

6 games in 13 days for Miami.
PennFan10
Postdoc
Posts 3580
12-02-18 12:19 PM - Post#267797    

I watched the Yale @Miami game on replay on ESPN3. Yale played a great game and Miami was terrible down the stretch. A few notes:

-Yale shot 22% from 3 and still won (Miami shot 23%)
-Oni had 29 pts and was the best player on the floor
-Atkinson (17), Bruner (11) and Reynolds (10) had half Yales pts
-Miami led 68-55 with 10:38 left and scored just 5 more points the rest of the way. A 3pt play by Izundu at 7:12 and a layup at around 3:40 mark. A lot of step back, James Harden distance 3 pt attempts with great rebounding by Yale during that stretch.

Yale matched the rebounding of Miami, who played 2 bigs most of the game and didn’t double Yale at all, preferring to stick with shooters beyond the arc. Oni was the benefactor of that strategy as Miami couldn’t stay in front of him. Atkinson and Bruner were both very good one on one against Miami’s bigs. Yale is going to be a problem for every Ivy team.

Our formula for beating Miami probably isn’t the same unless Dev Goodman can go Oni on us and AJ/Wang/Max can do what those three Yale bigs did. It’s possible but we are probably going to have to shoot better than 22% from 3 to win.

We move the ball as well as Yale


TheLine
Professor
Posts 5597
12-02-18 01:20 PM - Post#267801    

Dev needs to have a good game.

I think the other key is a good game out of Mike and/or Jarrod. They have to force Miami's bigs to defend away from hoop and be able to handle Miami's bigs on the defensive end.

PennFan10
Postdoc
Posts 3580
12-02-18 01:31 PM - Post#267802    

Mike can do that. Jarrod can’t. Max is a better defender than both of them but they won’t guard him on the perimeter. . Probably same for AJ. Mike is our best bet but is a liability against those guys on D.
Charlie Fog
Masters Student
Posts 586
12-04-18 08:04 AM - Post#267921    

penn +5
Quakers03
Professor
Posts 12480
12-04-18 11:30 AM - Post#267928    

We've been pretty lucky this year with facing teams off of wins and not losses, but that is not the case this time. What are the chances that Miami takes us lightly after losing 3 straight including the last one to Yale? This is going to be a challenge. I hope some students show up.
palestra38
Professor
Posts 32685
12-04-18 11:35 AM - Post#267930    

Not much respect for us after they lose in Miami to Rutgers and Yale.

No students will be there
10Q
Professor
Posts 23199
12-04-18 11:45 AM - Post#267933    

It'll be interesting to see how full the Palestra is.
SteveChop
PhD Student
Posts 1150
12-04-18 11:46 AM - Post#267935    

Why will no students be there?

palestra38
Professor
Posts 32685
12-04-18 11:55 AM - Post#267941    

Same reason as there are no students for any game...and now we are on the verge of finals
AsiaSunset
Postdoc
Posts 4350
12-04-18 12:29 PM - Post#267943    

".and now we are on the verge of finals "

Well not really. Reading days start a week from today. I think even the most obsessed student could take a few hours off tonight and go to the game.

Of course attendance in general is an issue no matter when we have a game
palestra38
Professor
Posts 32685
12-04-18 12:41 PM - Post#267944    

Today's students don't start studying for finals during reading days like we did.

But yes, we aren't getting students at any time now.

My guess is a 3000 crowd.
Okoro Dude
Senior
Posts 309
12-04-18 01:19 PM - Post#267946    

Looks like a little over 2,000 tickets are sold as of now. Add some walk up crowd, band, students, etc. and my guess is you are about right
13otto
Masters Student
Posts 779
13otto
12-04-18 01:51 PM - Post#267952    

  • palestra38 Said:
Today's students don't start studying for finals during reading days like we did.

But yes, we aren't getting students at any time now.

My guess is a 3000 crowd.


I'd be very surprised (and disappointed) if we get only 3,000 for this game.
http://www.letsgoquakers.com/

10Q
Professor
Posts 23199
12-04-18 02:02 PM - Post#267953    

Just got my ticket!
penn nation
Professor
Posts 21086
12-04-18 04:16 PM - Post#267973    

Need a big game out of AJ tonight if we are to have a chance at pulling it out.
10Q
Professor
Posts 23199
12-04-18 04:54 PM - Post#267975    

We’re going to win!
Streamers
Professor
Posts 8141
Streamers
12-04-18 04:59 PM - Post#267976    

you coming to visit at halftime?
PennFan10
Postdoc
Posts 3580
12-04-18 05:18 PM - Post#267983    

If we want to win we need the following:

Dev has to penetrate, score and dish
Antonio has to penetrate and score
AJ has to have a big game.

All of that is because Miami plays man straight up and doesn’t help/double. They guard the 3 pt line so a premium on player who can beat people 1 on 1 and those 3 are our only chance. Yale got a huge game from Oni and they 3 bigs (68 of their 77 came from those people) Atkinson was particularly strong.
10Q
Professor
Posts 23199
12-04-18 05:24 PM - Post#267985    

Sure
rbg
Postdoc
Posts 3044
12-04-18 05:27 PM - Post#267986    

Also, the Quakers need to stay out of foul trouble.

Looking at the first half of the Yale-Miami game, Bruner picked up 3 fouls, played 9 minutes and scored 4 points. Reynolds picked up 2 fouls, played 10 minutes and socred 2 points. In the second half, both picked up 0 fouls and played 15 minutes with Bruner scoring 7 and Reynolds 8.

In the first half, Miami shot 12 of 14 FT in the 1st half and only 3-4 in the second.
PennFan10
Postdoc
Posts 3580
12-04-18 06:36 PM - Post#267993    

I don’t think we will be able to shoot 22% from 3 and win like Yale did either.
penn nation
Professor
Posts 21086
12-04-18 06:59 PM - Post#267994    

I don't either, especially since most of our players don't shoot FTs well.
penn nation
Professor
Posts 21086
12-04-18 08:17 PM - Post#267999    

Looks like they heard us.

  • PennFan10 Said:
I don’t think we will be able to shoot 22% from 3 and win like Yale did either.



weinhauers_ghost
Postdoc
Posts 2125
12-04-18 08:26 PM - Post#268003    

7-12 from three so far.
penn nation
Professor
Posts 21086
12-04-18 08:29 PM - Post#268004    

Once again, well into a game where our 3 point shooting % tops our FT%. And in this game that's a very good thing.
weinhauers_ghost
Postdoc
Posts 2125
12-04-18 08:34 PM - Post#268005    

  • penn nation Said:
Once again, well into a game where our 3 point shooting % tops our FT%. And in this game that's a very good thing.



We're defending them pretty well so far, and no one is in foul trouble.
Silver Maple
Postdoc
Posts 3765
12-04-18 08:37 PM - Post#268006    

Mike Wang has the smoothest, prettiest stroke from 3 that I think I've ever seen from a Penn player. I'm feeling a massive man-crush right now.

(Is that an expression we're not supposed to use any more? Man-crush?)
penn nation
Professor
Posts 21086
12-04-18 08:40 PM - Post#268007    

Should have taken AJ out. Could see that one coming a mile away.
Silver Maple
Postdoc
Posts 3765
12-04-18 08:45 PM - Post#268008    

I really enjoyed the first half, and don't want to take anything away from the team, but is it possible the Miami just isn't very good?
Stuart Suss
PhD Student
Posts 1439
12-04-18 08:48 PM - Post#268009    

Folks, this was a 30 possession half. Penn's defensive efficiency was not good at all. The defensive failure has been obscured by unconscious Penn shooting.

To win Penn must either sustain this level of offense or significantly improve the defense.


dperry
Postdoc
Posts 2211
dperry
12-04-18 08:49 PM - Post#268010    

Can't comment too much, as must conserve phone charge, but great start. Must figure out how to play defense, however, as they won't make 3's like this all game. Also, while still not as many as we'd like, definitely significantly more students than for the first couple of games.
David Perry
Penn '92
"Hail, Alma Mater/Thy sons cheer thee now
To thee, Pennsylvania/All rivals must bow!!!"

10Q
Professor
Posts 23199
12-04-18 08:55 PM - Post#268011    

No way there’s 3000 here.
dperry
Postdoc
Posts 2211
dperry
12-04-18 08:57 PM - Post#268014    

Outrebounding them 2-1 right now. Did not see that coming.
David Perry
Penn '92
"Hail, Alma Mater/Thy sons cheer thee now
To thee, Pennsylvania/All rivals must bow!!!"

weinhauers_ghost
Postdoc
Posts 2125
12-04-18 08:58 PM - Post#268015    

We shot their zone to ribbons. I love flashing AJ or Max to the free throw line and letting them find open shooters.

I didn't realize Miami had so little depth. I don't think they play more than seven guys.
penn nation
Professor
Posts 21086
12-04-18 09:04 PM - Post#268016    

Biggest crowd in HISTORY at Penn. Well, except for the party I threw at Wharton when I was named #1 in class rank. Even bigger than my inauguration.
weinhauers_ghost
Postdoc
Posts 2125
12-04-18 09:08 PM - Post#268017    

  • penn nation Said:
Biggest crowd in HISTORY at Penn. Well, except for the party I threw at Wharton when I was named #1 in class rank. Even bigger than my inauguration.



::snicker::
dperry
Postdoc
Posts 2211
dperry
12-04-18 09:11 PM - Post#268018    

Michael Wang is. . .en fuego.
David Perry
Penn '92
"Hail, Alma Mater/Thy sons cheer thee now
To thee, Pennsylvania/All rivals must bow!!!"

weinhauers_ghost
Postdoc
Posts 2125
12-04-18 09:15 PM - Post#268019    

I don't see how that was a foul on Goodman.
dperry
Postdoc
Posts 2211
dperry
12-04-18 09:19 PM - Post#268020    

Wang left, Wang right, Wang up the middle!
David Perry
Penn '92
"Hail, Alma Mater/Thy sons cheer thee now
To thee, Pennsylvania/All rivals must bow!!!"

penn nation
Professor
Posts 21086
12-04-18 09:23 PM - Post#268021    

Everybody Wang Chung tonight!
10Q
Professor
Posts 23199
12-04-18 09:23 PM - Post#268022    

Wang Chung tonight!
dperry
Postdoc
Posts 2211
dperry
12-04-18 09:25 PM - Post#268023    

Also have to say that with the exception of that last possession, Brodeur's touch in the post tonight has been immaculate. Gotta be his best offensive game relative to the opposition as a Quaker
David Perry
Penn '92
"Hail, Alma Mater/Thy sons cheer thee now
To thee, Pennsylvania/All rivals must bow!!!"

penn nation
Professor
Posts 21086
12-04-18 09:26 PM - Post#268024    

Very nice all-around game tonight from AJ. Much needed.
dperry
Postdoc
Posts 2211
dperry
12-04-18 09:31 PM - Post#268025    

Aarrgh. Gotta figure out how to stop Lykes. Just killing us right now
David Perry
Penn '92
"Hail, Alma Mater/Thy sons cheer thee now
To thee, Pennsylvania/All rivals must bow!!!"

Chip Bayers
Professor
Posts 6997
Chip Bayers
12-04-18 09:31 PM - Post#268028    

Went to clock kill way to early, and the result was four straight possessions with bad offense.

penn nation
Professor
Posts 21086
12-04-18 09:32 PM - Post#268029    

We've only had 4 shots since the 8:01 mark and have missed them all.
weinhauers_ghost
Postdoc
Posts 2125
12-04-18 09:32 PM - Post#268030    

  • Chip Bayers Said:
Went to clock kill way to early, and the result was four straight possessions with bad offense.



Yep. Too early to take our foot off the gas. Gotta make some shots now.
Chip Bayers
Professor
Posts 6997
Chip Bayers
12-04-18 09:37 PM - Post#268032    

And some MF FTs.

weinhauers_ghost
Postdoc
Posts 2125
12-04-18 09:40 PM - Post#268033    

Seriously. We are totally stagnant.
Stuart Suss
PhD Student
Posts 1439
12-04-18 09:40 PM - Post#268034    

7 straight empty possessions including the obligatory missed FT.
penn nation
Professor
Posts 21086
12-04-18 09:43 PM - Post#268035    

That was 5 minutes between points. Glad we got one there.
Chip Bayers
Professor
Posts 6997
Chip Bayers
12-04-18 09:44 PM - Post#268036    

Nice response, attacking the overplays.

dperry
Postdoc
Posts 2211
dperry
12-04-18 09:44 PM - Post#268037    

Goodman with 2 enormous plays, plus Max with the stuff of Lykes.
David Perry
Penn '92
"Hail, Alma Mater/Thy sons cheer thee now
To thee, Pennsylvania/All rivals must bow!!!"

weinhauers_ghost
Postdoc
Posts 2125
12-04-18 09:45 PM - Post#268039    

Man, did we ever need those two baskets.
Chip Bayers
Professor
Posts 6997
Chip Bayers
12-04-18 09:46 PM - Post#268041    

Critical 2-2 FT trip from Woods.

penn nation
Professor
Posts 21086
12-04-18 09:51 PM - Post#268042    

This team is tough. Could have easily choked it away down the stretch. Well done.
Chip Bayers
Professor
Posts 6997
Chip Bayers
12-04-18 09:52 PM - Post#268043    

So the last time we beat Miami, their star was Rick Barry?

dperry
Postdoc
Posts 2211
dperry
12-04-18 09:55 PM - Post#268046    

Actually longer than that--1953. And we finished out a win with good FT shooting. Totally did not see THAT coming!
David Perry
Penn '92
"Hail, Alma Mater/Thy sons cheer thee now
To thee, Pennsylvania/All rivals must bow!!!"

10Q
Professor
Posts 23199
12-04-18 09:58 PM - Post#268047    

So much fun!!!!
penn nation
Professor
Posts 21086
12-04-18 09:59 PM - Post#268048    

Miami was KP 35 and we were KP 140 heading into this one. Probably been a while since we beat a team that highly ranked.

Normally, I try to avoid KP duty but for this once I made an exception.
AsiaSunset
Postdoc
Posts 4350
12-04-18 10:05 PM - Post#268050    

A really great team to root for. So much fun.
rbg
Postdoc
Posts 3044
12-04-18 10:12 PM - Post#268054    

Wow!!!

Another huge win for the Quakers!

Great games by AJ, Wong, Silpe, and Goodman. Solid performance by Antonio and a good couple of minutes by Jackson Donahue.

It was nerve wracking when Miami made their run, but Dev's acrobatic old-fashioned three really stopped the bleeding.

While Miami is probably not #35 in the nation, especially after this four game losing streak, they are a good team. Of course, they are fortunate to be in a conference where all the teams make into their postseason tournament. If they were in the Ivy League, they would probably have to hope for the many tiebreak scenarios to make it to the Madness.
penn nation
Professor
Posts 21086
12-04-18 10:14 PM - Post#268058    

They'd already lose the head to head tiebreak with 2 teams.



  • rbg Said:
If they were in the Ivy League, they would probably have to hope for the many tiebreak scenarios to make it to the Madness.



penn nation
Professor
Posts 21086
12-04-18 10:27 PM - Post#268060    

Now, we're at 122. Miami at 39.

  • penn nation Said:
Miami was KP 35 and we were KP 140 heading into this one. Probably been a while since we beat a team that highly ranked.

Normally, I try to avoid KP duty but for this once I made an exception.



Chip Bayers
Professor
Posts 6997
Chip Bayers
12-04-18 10:32 PM - Post#268061    

Miami has 3 pattycake home games left—Houston Baptist, Florida Atlantic, and Campbell—before they host NC State in their ACC opener.

10Q
Professor
Posts 23199
12-04-18 10:37 PM - Post#268063    

This is our biggest OOC win in a long time.
palestra38
Professor
Posts 32685
12-04-18 10:41 PM - Post#268065    

Great F--'--g Game. Postgame whiskey in S. Philly. Better comments later.
10Q
Professor
Posts 23199
12-04-18 10:48 PM - Post#268066    

Beat a Power Five conference team for the first time since the 2002-03 season.
10Q
Professor
Posts 23199
12-04-18 10:51 PM - Post#268067    

Miami beat Lasalle by 36 points.
Chip Bayers
Professor
Posts 6997
Chip Bayers
12-04-18 11:07 PM - Post#268069    

23 assists on 34 FGM.

A.J. with 6 of them, against only 3 TOs.

Dev with 4 against 2. Keep up that 2-1 ratio!

Silpe 5 assists, 0 TOs in 25 minutes off the bench.

Antonio 4 over 0. Really great stuff overall from the guard rotation.

Quakers03
Professor
Posts 12480
12-04-18 11:48 PM - Post#268070    

They were 12 assists on 16 makes in the first half I believe...or at least close to it. What an absolute joy to watch. These are great shots they get and everyone on the team can do it. What Steve has done and how these guys have bought in is just incredible.

Some thoughts:

Dev is the game changer we needed after Ryan went down. He is well past his 0 assists to 10 turnover streak and was just awesome tonight. He shoots the 3 with confidence and is fearless going to the rim. He saved the game for us tonight.

Bryce is really going to be a strong contributor in his 4 years. Darnell would have killed to have the finishing ability that Bryce has and he should keep getting better.

Michael Wang...What else can you say. Anyone who was at the scrimmage saw the potential, but man can he be special. That pass he threw to Max (that went through him) was just incredible. He is going to be so fun to watch these next 4 years and could set some records.

AJ came to play tonight. Bigly. He was a star and was really strong going at the rim. His touch was there and when he plays like this and makes his shots, Penn is really tough to beat.

Watching Jake grow over the years has been awesome and I am sure glad he gutted it out. We are too.

8-man bench tonight for Steve. I found that interesting. No Jarrod or Eddie.

Makes me feel old to to think the last time they beat a football school was my senior year and the last time they beat an acc school was GaTech my junior year. Anyone remember how contenting that one was? After the brutal sophomore year we came out on the road, and took it to them. The game was on an hour delay and Ugonna went big.
weinhauers_ghost
Postdoc
Posts 2125
12-05-18 12:00 AM - Post#268073    

Here's what ESPN had to say about Penn in the recap of tonight's game:

"The reigning Ivy League champs are looking like a very dangerous mid-major squad once again, even after losing last season's top scorer Ryan Betley to a season-ending knee injury in the opener."


Chip Bayers
Professor
Posts 6997
Chip Bayers
12-05-18 12:04 AM - Post#268074    

That’s not from ESPN. They’re re-publishing Dave Zeitlin’s AP story. Here’s the original.

Chip Bayers
Professor
Posts 6997
Chip Bayers
12-05-18 12:06 AM - Post#268075    

  • Chip Bayers Said:
That’s not from ESPN. They’re merely re-publishing Dave Zeitlin’s AP story. Here’s the original.



(There are far fewer original ESPN stories, and much more wire copy, since they canned so much of their original content.)

palestra38
Professor
Posts 32685
12-05-18 12:12 AM - Post#268076    

Forget that---THIS is fun:

https://www.canesinsight.com/threads/miami-vs-penn ...
penn nation
Professor
Posts 21086
12-05-18 12:29 AM - Post#268077    

Yeah, it stinks that they only had 6 scholarship kids on to finish the game.

How the heck are we supposed to compete against that?
weinhauers_ghost
Postdoc
Posts 2125
12-05-18 01:09 AM - Post#268082    

  • Chip Bayers Said:
  • Chip Bayers Said:
That’s not from ESPN. They’re merely re-publishing Dave Zeitlin’s AP story. Here’s the original.



(There are far fewer original ESPN stories, and much more wire copy, since they canned so much of their original content.)




Didn't realize they'd grabbed their recap from another source.

Penndemonium
PhD Student
Posts 1878
12-05-18 04:08 AM - Post#268083    

Great game by the Quakers. They were composed throughout. Even in the second half drought, they weren't choking or afraid of the moment.

Most times when we play a major conference team, a win looks like a lucky break of shooting and good fortune. The interesting thing about being against #35 was that our Quakers actually looked like the better team.

Brodeur came to play. Per our other thread on his development, his footwork looked great, he was active all game, he passed really well, and he showed amazing touch with his jump hook.

Wang started out looking shaky with some bad TOs and misses, but then got red hot with his 3s.

The only distressing part is 3,000 people at the Palestra - and the upper levels empty. Penn students don't seem to understand that this is one of the best teams to watch and support ever at Penn.
AntiUngvar
Masters Student
Posts 530
12-05-18 06:14 AM - Post#268084    

Judging by the pregame chatter, your peers may not have known this, either! Amidst all the doomsayer's, I alone mentioned (3 days before the game) that your chances of defeating Miami were outstanding.

palestra38
Professor
Posts 32685
12-05-18 08:34 AM - Post#268086    

What a fun night! I think we can put the AJ Brodeur "not working to expectations" theme to bed. Against a big and tough opposing center, AJ got his shots pretty much at will and fouled him out. Goodman is the real deal. Wang is a revelation. And when we really need to stop someone, such as that Spud Webb lookalike, we put Antonio on him. It's really hard to believe that we may be better than last year with our losses, but that appears to be the case. And the credit has to go to Steve Donahue. Now let's see what we do against LaSalle and Villanova.

BTW, the announced crowd was 3019. Predictable, but ridiculous.
Charlie Fog
Masters Student
Posts 586
12-05-18 08:35 AM - Post#268087    

  • Mike Porter Said:
Where do I get what some of this guy is having? Is there an app that delivers it?!?



They are handing it out at the Palestra
10Q
Professor
Posts 23199
12-05-18 08:41 AM - Post#268088    

I’d say there were about 2000 there.
TheLine
Professor
Posts 5597
12-05-18 08:41 AM - Post#268089    

I underestimated our chances because Miami's strengths seemed tailor-made to counteract our game. However, Penn has more weapons on offense than Miami could deal with and was able to play disciplined enough on the defensive end. I also didn't realize how thin Miami's roster is.

I did get the keys to beating Miami right.
- Big game from Dev because he'd be important in slowing down Sykes and breaking down Miami's D. Check.
- Big game from the 3rd Penn big to stretch Miami's D. Check. I had already developed a mancrush for Mike Wang, it only got more intense after last night. Sorry, SM.

Can't say enough about the willpower of this team. It flows from the coaching.
TheLine
Professor
Posts 5597
12-05-18 08:55 AM - Post#268090    

Just checked the advanced numbers for the game on basketball reference, which confirmed Stu's halftime comment. This game was won on the offensive end. Penn's ORat for the game was 136.9, Miami's was 115.4. Sykes was the only significant player who had a sub-100 ORat. Penn's bench was phenomenal.

Streamers
Professor
Posts 8141
Streamers
12-05-18 10:10 AM - Post#268098    

This was one of the special nights at the Palestra in recent memory. The kids dont know what they are missing and that is sad.

Miami is a flawed and shallow team, but they are atill an ACC top 50 squad with some talented guys. Penn beat them with lights out shooting off great ball movement (maybe we should start shooting FTs from behind the arc) and great work creating 2nd chances when we missed. Yes, the defense wasn’t great, but they had key stops when it mattered most.

If Penn had lost this thing, we would be wailing about the officiating, which was inexplicable at time in key spots and, believe me, there was real fear in our hearts when the lead was cut to 4 and the collapse we all feared all night was unfolding before our eyes.

At that point, both teams, who were only playing 7 (JD’s cameo not withstanding) were pretty gassed and the fouls were piling up. Then, along comes Goodman with those 2 amazing scoops, the latter with no time left on the shot clock, that really were the difference in the game. He was the star of the game (no disrespect to Wang and his 23 pts) because he was harassing Lykes all night long to go with his offense. Can’t wait to see him against the likes of Mike Smith and Matt Morgan.
palestra38
Professor
Posts 32685
12-05-18 10:42 AM - Post#268101    

Goodman was great, but unless I missed things, they switched off to Antonio playing him after Lykes scored 7 or 9 in a row, and he didn't score again (with about 4 to go) and that's also when Goodman made his clutch shots.


10Q
Professor
Posts 23199
12-05-18 10:51 AM - Post#268102    

Yes, Antonio took Lykes beginning around the 4:30 mark I think. AJ had a huge block of a Lykes shot. Antonio got him to travel with about 2:00 to go.
10Q
Professor
Posts 23199
12-05-18 11:05 AM - Post#268104    

Loved Wang's post-game comments about the "gym".
Jeff2sf
Postdoc
Posts 4466
12-05-18 11:07 AM - Post#268105    

  • TheLine Said:
Just checked the advanced numbers for the game on basketball reference, which confirmed Stu's halftime comment. This game was won on the offensive end. Penn's ORat for the game was 136.9, Miami's was 115.4. Sykes was the only significant player who had a sub-100 ORat. Penn's bench was phenomenal.




this will sound more confrontational than intended - do we need ORat to tell us the obvious? We shot 56% from 3. That's clearly not sustainable and basically accounts for the difference in us winning (plus Miami shooting 30%).

But that's okay, we don't have to play this well to beat almost any team in the Ivies. I'm shocked at how well we're playing without Ryan.

AntiUngvar
Masters Student
Posts 530
12-05-18 11:24 AM - Post#268106    

Jeff:
There's nothing but sound commentary in what you write. There was another gentleman (Quaker3?) who pointed out that Miami was playing last night, a sixth game in thirteen days- surely those Miami kids were tired coming in to Philly, having lost 3 straight games by tiny margins to SetonHall, Rutgers and Yale. No, I don't believe you were witnessing nearly the best Miami had to offer last night. Nevertheless, Penn earned it; and won the game going away which should stand them in good stead going into Princeton just a month from today!

10Q
Professor
Posts 23199
12-05-18 11:25 AM - Post#268107    

That was me.
AntiUngvar
Masters Student
Posts 530
12-05-18 11:29 AM - Post#268108    

Yes, sorry about the misattribution. Actually made a small sum of money, largely on the basis of your lead.
Thank you.

Chip Bayers
Professor
Posts 6997
Chip Bayers
12-05-18 12:01 PM - Post#268112    

  • 10Q Said:
That was me.



Mitigating that 6 in 13 days stretch is that most of those were frontloaded; they got back from the Fullerton, CA tourney on Sunday the 25th and spent what, 8 days in their own beds, playing only twice, on Wednesday and then Saturday, before they flew for last night’s game? Without having to change time zones? Easier than an Ivy Road weekend on the bus for hours, with a Princeton game on the following Tuesday!

Streamers
Professor
Posts 8141
Streamers
12-05-18 12:36 PM - Post#268114    

Clearly, both teams were weary in those last few minutes given the short benches and the pace of the game. Oddly though, our guys looked even more gassed than theirs to our group. This was evidenced by the silly fouls, missed bunnies, and botched rebounds during that horror stretch when the lead nearly evaporated. Fouls played a big role when Izundu left early trying to guard AJ and Devon was forced to rest (leaving Woods on Lykes) before coming in to make those huge buckets to seal the game.

Given the FT shooting, there was some discussion around the benefits of the bonus for Penn.
Streamers
Professor
Posts 8141
Streamers
12-05-18 12:41 PM - Post#268116    

I have to wonder what Jay Wright must be thinking as he watches the video from that shooting exhibition Penn put on in the 1st half.
Stuart Suss
PhD Student
Posts 1439
12-05-18 12:47 PM - Post#268117    

Thanks to "The Line" for the important reminder about defense.

Excluding deliberate fouls and the final few garbage possessions at the end, Penn's defense surrendered 1.25 points per possession. 30 1st half defensive possessions surrendered 36 points and the first 30 second half possessions surrendered 39 points.

The offense scored 1.41 points per possession.

Penn does not have to give back the win. All the praise about offensive performances is deserved (although one day I would like to see A.J. take a shot with his left hand).

But, to borrow a term used by Jeff, a 1.41 points per possession offense outscoring a 1.25 points per possession defense is not a "sustainable" way to win basketball games.

TheLine
Professor
Posts 5597
12-05-18 01:45 PM - Post#268121    

Yes, my comment was a confirmation of the numbers you provided at halftime that showed we were winning due to incredibly good shooting. Defense was not so good, though could have been worse - Sykes was contained for most of the game except that 5 minute stretch when Miami made it close.

Chip Bayers
Professor
Posts 6997
Chip Bayers
12-05-18 02:30 PM - Post#268128    

I wonder if the short bench was a response to what happened against the high major opponents in V.I. when the deeper bench guys were in.

Okoro Dude
Senior
Posts 309
12-05-18 02:31 PM - Post#268129    

Agreed, but the good news is that the story over 8 D-1 games is different - it shows that we are still essentially in the top 100 in adjusted defensive efficiency (ended in the 70s last season) and doing it in a similar fashion (not allowing many 3-pt attempts, solid on defensive boards, not fouling, opponents with low assist rates, etc.).

Everyone needs a hot-shooting night every now and again to win a game they wouldn't normally win (1985 Villanova). That's okay - in fact, it's good to see that we have the ability to have that night from time-to-time. What it shows me is that we have chance to pair the top 100 D with an improved offense/shooting team vs. the team that ended last season out of the top 200 in adjusted offensive efficiency.
Quakers03
Professor
Posts 12480
12-05-18 03:15 PM - Post#268135    

  • Streamers Said:
If Penn had lost this thing, we would be wailing about the officiating, which was inexplicable at time in key spots and, believe me, there was real fear in our hearts when the lead was cut to 4 and the collapse we all feared all night was unfolding before our eyes.


It was the same guy every time too. Why does that always happen? I think his name was Dwayne and he was brutal. He totally changed the game himself during that run.

I hope we see more teams play zone against us.
SomeGuy
Professor
Posts 6391
12-05-18 04:00 PM - Post#268138    

One thing I like is that we seem to be finding different ways to win. It’s interesting that we got into something of a shootout with a team that plays a short bench, and we played a short bench ourselves. Almost like we just said, if that’s the way you want to play, we’ll play it your way and still win.

Can’t say enough about this group. Great to see Silpe’s play in this one — 5:0 assists to turnovers. Love the way Wang’s offensive game plays against more athletic teams. He may have an easier time with Yale and Harvard than he will with Columbia and Dartmouth.

Only negative thing I can say is that we’ve probably made La Salle into a dangerous trap game.
palestra38
Professor
Posts 32685
12-05-18 04:08 PM - Post#268139    

I guarantee that Donahue will not allow the team to overlook any Big 5 game, especially one at LaSalle
10Q
Professor
Posts 23199
12-05-18 04:14 PM - Post#268140    

We will win.
Streamers
Professor
Posts 8141
Streamers
12-05-18 04:37 PM - Post#268141    

  • Quakers03 Said:

I hope we see more teams play zone against us.


This is the first time in a while I might agree, especially without Betley; but this is what Washington (the only one without his long-range game last night) and Wang bring us. Add to that Goodman's outside shooting improvement and Silpe hitting them when he is open. The outstanding ball movement makes it all possible.

I actually think we have a real shot at beating Nova, but I'm not counting on it unless the FT shooting improves a lot. We will miss Tyler in that game. Let's hope they are not looking ahead on Saturday.


penn nation
Professor
Posts 21086
12-05-18 04:40 PM - Post#268142    

Goodman has really stepped it up from his one dimensional play in his freshman year. It's actually remarkable to see the number of Penn guards over the past couple of seasons who have shown marked improvement over time.
TheLine
Professor
Posts 5597
12-05-18 04:55 PM - Post#268143    

Foreman
Wood
Woods
Silpe
Goodman

Yes, wonderful track record.

No one improved in the years between Rosen leaving and Donahue taking over as coach. Hicks maybe slightly but that's it.



Silver Maple
Postdoc
Posts 3765
12-05-18 05:50 PM - Post#268144    

I don't think Hicks improved at all. And the shame of it is that he really could have. By all accounts he was a very hard worker with a great attitude. A competent coach would have helped him grow as a player.
10Q
Professor
Posts 23199
12-05-18 05:56 PM - Post#268145    

I want to see Simmons improve.
Mike Porter
Postdoc
Posts 3615
Mike Porter
12-05-18 06:01 PM - Post#268146    

  • Charlie Fog Said:
  • Mike Porter Said:
Where do I get what some of this guy is having? Is there an app that delivers it?!?



They are handing it out at the Palestra



Haha yes they were handing it out last night and wish I was there to get some too!

And to be clear, I was optimistic that we would give Miami a good game so I wasn’t doubting that. I was more commenting on not understanding what that dude was talking about because of his, let’s say... rather peculiar approach to the English language.

This was extra fun as my younger brother is a Miami grad.


Silver Maple
Postdoc
Posts 3765
12-05-18 06:03 PM - Post#268147    

  • 10Q Said:
I want to see Simmons improve.



I realize he didn't play last night, but I think Jarrod has shown improvement this season. Exactly how much, we don't know yet. He certainly seems to be somewhat surer of himself. Time will tell-- let's revisit this issue in 3 months.
Mike Porter
Postdoc
Posts 3615
Mike Porter
12-05-18 06:17 PM - Post#268149    

  • AntiUngvar Said:
Judging by the pregame chatter, your peers may not have known this, either! Amidst all the doomsayer's, I alone mentioned (3 days before the game) that your chances of defeating Miami were outstanding.



Indeed you did. My joking aside, well played sir.
PennFan10
Postdoc
Posts 3580
12-05-18 08:14 PM - Post#268155    

  • Silver Maple Said:
  • 10Q Said:
I want to see Simmons improve.



I realize he didn't play last night, but I think Jarrod has shown improvement this season. Exactly how much, we don't know yet. He certainly seems to be somewhat surer of himself. Time will tell-- let's revisit this issue in 3 months.



Jarrod will be an important factor at some point this season. I don't know exactly when, but he will be called on to contribute in my opinion. He has to be ready.

UPIA1968
PhD Student
Posts 1117
UPIA1968
12-05-18 09:58 PM - Post#268167    

Someone said a year or two back that Stevie's teams usually improve their 3-point shooting. Here are the numbers for the four years, old to current. Pomeroy ranks 322, 220, 173, 33. Sure the 33 is only through nine games, but this has the mark of a good shooting team. With Betley back and Wang and Washington playing big minutes next should be very strong as well.
PennFan10
Postdoc
Posts 3580
12-05-18 10:42 PM - Post#268172    

I said that. Every year at every stop the team 3pt % has improved. At Cornell I think they were top 2 or 3 in the country at over 40% in the sweet 16 year. BC they improved every year to about 36% if I remember. Penn, every year we have gotten better at the arc. Who would have thought with the loss of Caleb and Sam and Darnell, we would be better at 3s this year than last.
dperry
Postdoc
Posts 2211
dperry
12-06-18 12:20 AM - Post#268180    

  • palestra38 Said:


They need to realize that

a.) This ain't your father's Ivy league, or even your older brother's. We're not pushovers anymore (of course, a lot of other people need to realize that, too.)
b.) They didn't get into the ACC because of their basketball program. Yes, being in that league could be helpful if they got someone who could take advantage of it, but right now, they're pretty much a glorified middle-echelon team.
David Perry
Penn '92
"Hail, Alma Mater/Thy sons cheer thee now
To thee, Pennsylvania/All rivals must bow!!!"

Chip Bayers
Professor
Posts 6997
Chip Bayers
12-06-18 01:26 AM - Post#268184    

Larranaga did take a mid-major to the Final Four, so he’s not a slouch. They’ve been crippled this year by losing their best player to shoe company craziness, and have probably only been punished for that _because_ they’re not one of the elites in their conference. If Darwin Hernandez were at UNC or Duke he’d be playing already.

TheLine
Professor
Posts 5597
12-06-18 09:21 AM - Post#268190    

The Miami board was respectful for the most part - far more so than other boards I've waded into.

10Q
Professor
Posts 23199
12-06-18 11:15 AM - Post#268193    


If there was any good news about this night, it was that the game only streamed on ESPN’s subscription-based plus service and much of the fanbase missed having to watch the game.

A late run put UM within four points, 77-73 with 3:23 to play.

But that was the closest the Canes would get.

Penn pulled back ahead to win 89-75. The night represented all that has gone wrong during this now four game losing streak, dating back to the final of the Wooden Legacy Tournament, and extending through two losses to Ivy League opponents.

The Quaker offense flew around and attacked the Canes on all fronts. Guards Devin Goodman and Jake Slipe frustrated Miami from long-range, going 3-5 and 3-4 on three-point shots.

AJ Brodeur was productive in the post, and was just two rebounds away from a double-double to go along with 18 points.

But the leading scorer for Penn didn’t even start, as Michael Wang had a career night off the bench, accounting for 23 of the Quaker’s 36 bench points. The stretch forward went 9-12 on FG and an astounding 5-6 on 3FG.

One of the positive storylines for the Canes was the performance of Sam Waardenburg. Despite his poor performances lately, the forward came to life Tuesday night with a career-high 14 points.

Zach Johnson was also very good, with 17 points off the bench, proving himself to be the player fans could expect after his years at Florida Gulf Coast.

Consistency has hurt this team over the last four games, and reared its ugly head tonight as well. Chris Lykes, up and down all season, was held to just six first half points as Miami by fourteen at the break. His 10 second half points gave UM late life but not enough to get over the hump.

With just 10 assists, the Hurricanes did not put themselves in good position to be successful tonight in that regard either. For a team that wants to win by shooting and ball movement, 10 assists won’t do the job.

As final exams arrive at UM, Jim Larrañaga and his players will get a two week break to reassess their approach to this still young season. With this team’s lack of depth, the rest will be vital for the young core of players before their next game against Houston Baptist on December 19.
OldBig5
Masters Student
Posts 639
12-06-18 08:03 PM - Post#268226    

Didn't get to see the game so watching the replay tonight--first half so far and very impressed even if Miami is not what they have been the last few years. Should be a fun Ivy season and nice to be able to watch on ESPN+; including replays. I wonder how long they have the replays available?
OldBig5
Masters Student
Posts 639
12-06-18 08:05 PM - Post#268227    

  • Chip Bayers Said:
Larranaga did take a mid-major to the Final Four, so he’s not a slouch. They’ve been crippled this year by losing their best player to shoe company craziness, and have probably only been punished for that _because_ they’re not one of the elites in their conference. If Darwin Hernandez were at UNC or Duke he’d be playing already.


Look at what the NCAA is doing with Landers Nolley at VT--their top recruit in years; making him take the ACT again because they said it didn't match his school grades--no evidence of any cheating. They would not do that to Duke or UNC.




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