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Username Post: Hello? ::Echo... Echo::        (Topic#17699)
Mike Porter 
Postdoc
Posts: 2135
Mike Porter
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
Reg: 11-21-04
03-14-15 09:55 PM - Post#186027    

If Yale blows a chance to make the NCAAs but has no fans to see it, did they really even blow if?!?

Sorry can't help myself but still amazed this is a deadzone.

 
SRP 
Postdoc
Posts: 3084

Reg: 02-04-06
03-14-15 11:10 PM - Post#186037    
    In response to Mike Porter

There's probably a secret Eli club with decoder rings where they discuss Ivy hoops and rowing. Scull and Jones.

 
TigerFan 
Masters Student
Posts: 871

Reg: 11-21-04
03-15-15 12:14 AM - Post#186046    
    In response to SRP

There appeared to be a lot of Yalies at today's game--may have been more than they get in a season at that church they play in. Maybe they spread rumors in New Haven that the Whiffenpoofs were singing at the Palestra.

 
Tiger69 
Postdoc
Posts: 2003

Reg: 11-23-04
03-15-15 11:25 AM - Post#186069    
    In response to TigerFan

Most of us are either old geezers or approaching it. Yale's old geezers have no good memories of basketball to reminisce about.

 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 15890

Reg: 11-21-04
YALE NOT IN THE NIT??
03-15-15 10:00 PM - Post#186204    
    In response to Tiger69

I thought that the Ivy champ in a playoff game was guaranteed a NIT slot. Yale not in it. Anyone with knowledge needs to explain this.

 
Kit 
Senior
Posts: 375

Loc: Central Massachusetts
Reg: 11-29-04
Re: YALE NOT IN THE NIT??
03-15-15 10:24 PM - Post#186205    
    In response to palestra38

Did Penn go to the NIT in 1996?
The Ivy runner-up does not have an automatic bid to the NIT.

 
Bruno 
Masters Student
Posts: 910

Loc: Brooklyn, NY
Reg: 11-21-04
Re: YALE NOT IN THE NIT??
03-15-15 10:26 PM - Post#186206    
    In response to palestra38

I don't get it. A number of teams ranked way lower than Yale got a slot. Bucknell is a 139 / 202 on rpi/kpom. St. Francis is a 178 / 151. yale's a 62 / 74. Plus I'd think having Yale in there would be compelling storytelling.

I guess the nice thing about being the NIT is that you have to answer to no one. And don't have to make any sense.
LET'S go BRU-no (duh. nuh. nuh-nuh-nuh)


 
whitakk 
Sophomore
Posts: 144

Age: 26
Reg: 11-11-14
03-15-15 10:30 PM - Post#186207    
    In response to Bruno

1-seeds in their conference tournament get automatic bids to the NIT (including Bucknell and St. Francis). The Ivy League's playoff loser does not get an automatic bid, in part because it doesn't designate a 1-seed. (Even so, it's not clear who would've been the '1-seed' in this year's playoff.)

Yale is ahead of only three at-large NIT teams in KenPom (assuming more in RPI but didn't check), and George Washington / Pitt are right behind. UTEP is the real puzzler from a KenPom rankings standpoint, way down at 97.

 
Kit 
Senior
Posts: 375

Loc: Central Massachusetts
Reg: 11-29-04
Re: YALE NOT IN THE NIT??
03-15-15 10:31 PM - Post#186208    
    In response to Bruno

The NIT is run by the NCAA. St.Francis(NY) and Bucknell were #1 seeds in their respective tourneys and lost. Thus, they automatically qualify for the NIT,


 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 15890

Reg: 11-21-04
Re: YALE NOT IN THE NIT??
03-16-15 06:57 AM - Post#186231    
    In response to Kit

That rule was implemented in 2005, after the NCAA bought the NIT. It was not in place in 1996. The Ivies really get screwed if an awarded 1st place team that loses a playoff doesn't get an automatic NIT bid, but conferences that are ranked lower get that treatment.

 
Penn94 
PhD Student
Posts: 1461

Loc: Dallas, Texas
Reg: 11-21-04
Re: YALE NOT IN THE NIT??
03-17-15 10:23 AM - Post#186505    
    In response to Kit

  • Kit Said:
Did Penn go to the NIT in 1996?
The Ivy runner-up does not have an automatic bid to the NIT.



Not relevant. The NIT did not start giving auto bids to "conference champions" that didn't win the NCAA bid until after this date.

This just goes to show you that all people who cheer "Ivy Champions" as ones that tie for the title but don't win the playoffs are cheering on frauds. The true Ivy champs go to the NCAA tournament.


 
Kit 
Senior
Posts: 375

Loc: Central Massachusetts
Reg: 11-29-04
Re: YALE NOT IN THE NIT??
03-17-15 11:15 AM - Post#186511    
    In response to Penn94

Actually, the NIT gives auto bids to #1 seeds, not conference champions, who lose their tournament. In the Colonial Athletic Association there was a four-way tie for first place. Only William & Mary received an auto bid to the NIT.


 
mrjames 
Postdoc
Posts: 4617

Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
Re: YALE NOT IN THE NIT??
03-17-15 05:45 PM - Post#186583    
    In response to Penn94

To be fair, I noticed a 1996 Ivy Co-Champs banner hanging in the rafters of The Palestra on Saturday. I thought it was a little odd given the Penn faithful's stance on this topic.

 
SRP 
Postdoc
Posts: 3084

Reg: 02-04-06
03-17-15 08:01 PM - Post#186611    
    In response to mrjames

Regardless of any pettifoggery about whether Yale qualified under the "lost the conference tourney" rubric, it seems pretty odd that the NIT wouldn't have wanted this Yale team for quality's sake. They even have two promotable stars, which the media seem to prefer over more-balanced teams.

 
rbg 
Senior
Posts: 361

Reg: 10-20-14
03-17-15 09:56 PM - Post#186641    
    In response to SRP

I agree, Yale had a very good team, as well as interesting players. Not only do you have POY Sears, COY Jones, 1st Team All-Ivy Duren, but you get Rhodes Scholar Townsend.

With regards to past Ivy history in the NIT for co-champs, Penn was not invited in 1996. Yale did go in 2002 after losing the final playoff game against Penn.

Sad to read this ending to the story at the New Haven Register, http://www.nhregister.com/sports/20150315/yale- snu...

  • Quote:
A disappointed Jones said the fact that there's no real history of Yale basketball or the Ivy League in the tournament hurts the chances more than anything else.

"They don't know how good we are," Jones said. "We had a great year, one of the best Yale's ever had. If we can't get in this year, I don't know how we get in. It's disheartening."



Seeing how most league commissioners lobby to get its teams into post-season tournaments, does the Ivy League leadership bear some responsibility for the snubbing of its co-champion?

 
SRP 
Postdoc
Posts: 3084

Reg: 02-04-06
03-17-15 10:23 PM - Post#186650    
    In response to rbg

That is sad.

 
Mike Porter 
Postdoc
Posts: 2135
Mike Porter
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
Reg: 11-21-04
03-19-15 12:22 AM - Post#186778    
    In response to SRP

Yeah I know I posted this tongue in cheek, but man I didn't think they would get shafted out of the post season entirely. Definitely a deserving NIT team and they got hosed.

How could they miss the CIT and CBI also? I think they could have won either.

 
Mike Porter 
Postdoc
Posts: 2135
Mike Porter
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
Reg: 11-21-04
03-19-15 12:24 AM - Post#186779    
    In response to Mike Porter

And Duren sounded like such a great sport after. A real shame for those kids.

 
dperry 
Masters Student
Posts: 780
dperry
Loc: Oreland, PA
Reg: 11-24-04
Re: YALE NOT IN THE NIT??
03-19-15 07:33 AM - Post#186791    
    In response to mrjames

  • mrjames Said:
To be fair, I noticed a 1996 Ivy Co-Champs banner hanging in the rafters of The Palestra on Saturday. I thought it was a little odd given the Penn faithful's stance on this topic.



I think the athletic department is at odds with much of the Penn faithful on this one.
David Perry
Penn '92
"Hail, Alma Mater/Thy sons cheer thee now
To thee, Pennsylvania/All rivals must bow!!!"


 
Tiger69 
Postdoc
Posts: 2003

Reg: 11-23-04
Re: YALE NOT IN THE NIT??
03-19-15 02:30 PM - Post#186826    
    In response to dperry

I think that most fans agree that the playoff winner is the real Champ. However,1996 was a rather unusual case in that Penn had beaten Princeton in both of the regular season meetings. If the champion had been chosen by a tiebreaker formula such as the results of head to head competition, Pennsylvania would have been the Ivy Champ that year.

I like the playoff if necessary and I hate ties. And if a playoff is necessary to determine our NCAA rep, let it also determine the uncontested league champion.

 
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