HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2786
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
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Penn
01-09-16 08:12 PM - Post#199084
In response to puband09
Nothing intentional. Bell was fouled on a layup but he arched back to try and grab the rebound and collided with the Penn player who was actually grabbing the rebound. Bell's head was leading his reach and was low, below the Penn player's elbow. Not dirty at all. In fact, the foul was called on the shot, not on the rebound.
Bell was definitely woozy and didn't return.
Edited by HARVARDDADGRAD on 01-09-16 08:12 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
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umbrellaman
Masters Student
Posts: 476
Reg: 11-21-04
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Re: Penn
01-09-16 08:16 PM - Post#199091
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
Concur with HDG on the Bell foul. Next League game is 20 days - my guess is he'll be ok by then.
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joe nassau
Sophomore
Posts: 150
Reg: 02-13-05
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01-09-16 08:23 PM - Post#199096
In response to umbrellaman
Well I have to say that I was actually impressed with PU 2day. They were a little lucky with some of the late Penn looks but they won even with several of their key players having flat shooting games...Of course finally making free throws didn't hurt?
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1LotteryPick1969
Postdoc
Posts: 2339
Age: 74
Loc: Sandy, Utah
Reg: 11-21-04
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01-09-16 08:25 PM - Post#199097
In response to penn nation
Pretty bad when you consider the calls went 25-14 for the opposition on your home court. Many questionable calls and non-calls tonight really hurt the Quakers.
There is no question Penn played well, better than us for most of the game. But at the end of regulation and at end of overtime, Silpe seemed completely baffled as to what to do (other than dribble). I'm sure that will change with experience.
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Charlie Fog
Masters Student
Posts: 587
Age: 56
Loc: Philly
Reg: 11-12-13
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01-09-16 08:29 PM - Post#199100
In response to 1LotteryPick1969
Penn needs to play better defense on 7 vs 5 sets
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penn nation
Professor
Posts: 23204
Reg: 12-02-04
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01-09-16 08:32 PM - Post#199103
In response to 1LotteryPick1969
Yes. Most of the turnovers tonight came from putting the ball on the floor, with Silpe the worst offender.
Silpe probably also had to wonder what was going on when he did drive, since most of the time he was getting hammered but no fouls were called. Probably was another factor in his trying to do too much in OT.
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Tiger69
Postdoc
Posts: 2833
Reg: 11-23-04
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01-09-16 09:11 PM - Post#199111
In response to penn nation
Glad I missed the game. I couldn't have taken it after the women's nail biter. As for the fouls, it seems like every time Penn loses a tight game to us, we hear the whines about officiating. How is it that we are so good at controlling the refs? 
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SRP
Postdoc
Posts: 4971
Reg: 02-04-06
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01-09-16 09:12 PM - Post#199112
In response to penn nation
The Penn whining about the officiating is unbelievable. Nelson-Henry got away with at least four uncalled obvious fouls, Weisz was repeatedly hacked without getting the call as noted by the commentators, and that play at the monitor where the ball went off Miller was an obvious foul on Foreman raking him across the arm. Home cooking all through the first half, one close make-up call at the end.
I feel bad for Bell getting clocked in the head (twice in one play, first by Foreman's forearm on the drive and then by the other Penn guy bulldozing into him) because this was the first game I've seen where he looked like the stud I'd been expecting him to develop into.
And I also don't understand people saying the Tigers looked sluggish. On the contrary, they looked rushed and overpumped at times; they got a ton of ORs in the first half and failed to convert them by hurrying. (As predicted near the top of this thread, Penn was hustling and flying around and got some favorable bounces on loose balls, but they weren't always the first one to the ball.) And this was one of Princeton's better efforts at blocking and bothering shots. But Penn did end up with too many second-chance points--if the Tigers box out that poorly against a Harvard or Yale they'll have real problems.
I would have liked to see better half-court offense in the second half. Slowing it down like that (they were going really fast in the first half when they made their run) is only a good thing if you move the ball and make good cuts.
Still, survive and advance. Cannady missed some big treys but they looked pretty good at launch and his overall confidence is refreshing. That floater into the zone when the chips were down was uber-impressive. He had every right to be bouncing and dancing after the game.
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penn nation
Professor
Posts: 23204
Reg: 12-02-04
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01-09-16 09:27 PM - Post#199115
In response to SRP
Sorry, but your team doesn't win without the refs constantly calling fouls against Penn but not Princeton throughout the game, particularly on drives to the basket.
Princeton can't even make a FG during OT, but gets bailed out by the refs with 30 seconds to play. Please. Even your own fans know you shouldn't have won this game.
And none of the Penn fouls were malicious, despite the way you want to paint it.
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SRP
Postdoc
Posts: 4971
Reg: 02-04-06
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01-09-16 09:29 PM - Post#199116
In response to penn nation
The officiating was no-call-city in the first half and Penn got away with tons of fouls. The next time Silpe drives without fouling with his off hand will be the first time, but he only got called once. You have nothing to complain about from the officials.
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thelaird
Freshman
Posts: 33
Age: 67
Reg: 12-08-15
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01-09-16 09:33 PM - Post#199117
In response to SRP
The whinning from the Penn fans is unbelievable. Penn could have won, and probably should have won but didn't seem to know what to do with a lead. Three pointers going in for them in the first half and it looked like they didn't even try another one in the second half even when they had open looks.
Bell go
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thelaird
Freshman
Posts: 33
Age: 67
Reg: 12-08-15
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01-09-16 09:35 PM - Post#199118
In response to thelaird
crushed on the rebound but didn't look intentional on the replay.
He had an outstanding day. Really exceptional.
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Chip Bayers
Professor
Posts: 7001
Loc: New York
Reg: 11-21-04
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01-09-16 09:38 PM - Post#199119
In response to SRP
Foul count in the first half was 4 on Princeton (1 offensive), 7 on Penn (2 offensive).
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thelaird
Freshman
Posts: 33
Age: 67
Reg: 12-08-15
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01-09-16 09:42 PM - Post#199120
In response to Chip Bayers
It did look like DNH got into The Tigers head. Seemed Princeton was looking for a blocked shot attempt even when he wasn't around the basket. The exception was Bell of course.
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SRP
Postdoc
Posts: 4971
Reg: 02-04-06
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01-09-16 10:39 PM - Post#199134
In response to Chip Bayers
Given the way the game was being played, that was no-call city, as I said. Weisz got hacked on every offensive move. Caruso got knocked down a couple of times without a call. Bell scored and got hit but didn't get and-one a couple of times.
Penn couldn't stay in front of the Princeton dribblers or rotate over in time to legally guard so they did what they could and got away with it for the most part. That was smart adaptation to the officiating. But it sure looked like home cooking from here.
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Chip Bayers
Professor
Posts: 7001
Loc: New York
Reg: 11-21-04
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01-09-16 10:44 PM - Post#199135
In response to SRP
Yeah, no. Only a homer could think there was home cooking.
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Tiger69
Postdoc
Posts: 2833
Reg: 11-23-04
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01-09-16 11:09 PM - Post#199137
In response to Chip Bayers
We can all agree that the level of officiating in Ivy games often leaves something to be desired -- especially Saturday games. So, it seems natural that the losers in a close game will look to blame the officials. However, I don't accept that discrepancy in number of calls against each team indicates anything but the strategic necessity of one team to foul more than the other. There is nothing that says that PFs should be evenly divided. More likely, it is the less talented team that must foul more to neutralize its opponent's advantages. Bad officiating cuts both ways.
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1LotteryPick1969
Postdoc
Posts: 2339
Age: 74
Loc: Sandy, Utah
Reg: 11-21-04
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01-09-16 11:23 PM - Post#199138
In response to Tiger69
There is nothing that says that PFs should be evenly divided.
Looks like an opportunity for Mike James to ride into town on a white horse of statistics and give us the Word on this.
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sparman
PhD Student
Posts: 1369
Reg: 12-08-04
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01-09-16 11:23 PM - Post#199139
In response to puband09
I couldn't find a Fox Sports feed and listened via WPRB. Can someone tell me what actually happened to Amir Bell? To what extent did it look like an intentional foul? Will he probably be back for our next game?
Did not look intentional to me. Just a hard play.
But like someone said, the Penn whining here is out of control. Tough loss for Penn, but it happens to everyone at times. Move on.
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sparman
PhD Student
Posts: 1369
Reg: 12-08-04
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Re: Penn
01-09-16 11:31 PM - Post#199142
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
If the sub could shoot it then teams would have an incentive to fake an injury and substitute a great FT shooter from the bench.
The rule is the rule (if I'm wrong about the rule, feel free to correct). And there's not much incentive if the injured player has to sit out for a while.
Although in this case there was clearly no advantage sought or gained.
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