mrjames
Professor
Posts: 6062
Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
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08-25-16 04:04 PM - Post#209890
Both are visiting Harvard next month. Wendell will be visiting officially. Mo Bamba will be on an unofficial. Both are consensus Top 5 players in the 2017 class and potentially lottery picks in the 2018 NBA Draft.
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mrjames
Professor
Posts: 6062
Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
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Re: Wendell Carter and Mo Bamba
08-26-16 09:33 AM - Post#209902
In response to mrjames
Some good reads on Wendell Carter and Harvard:
http://www.foxsports.com/college-basketball/st ory/...
https://www.sny.tv/college-recruiting/new s/wendell...
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Local Observer
Junior
Posts: 231
Reg: 03-30-14
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Re: Wendell Carter and Mo Bamba
08-26-16 02:04 PM - Post#209924
In response to mrjames
Not a chance, i'm afraid. I think the Carter application is simply tactical on his part, and the other guy hasn't even been offered. Carter's buddy hasn't been offered by Harvard although he has been by Duke, and they still pledge they're going to the same team. After all the theatrics, I'd guess Duke has them all locked up. Also, do we even want to get involved with "1 and done" guys?
Edited by Local Observer on 08-26-16 02:12 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
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mrjames
Professor
Posts: 6062
Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
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08-26-16 02:14 PM - Post#209926
In response to Local Observer
I mean, there's a TON going on here that I'm not going to get into.
The real story is far more interesting than just "not a chance." The only thing I'll say for sure is that "not a chance" is definitely understating the true odds.
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Local Observer
Junior
Posts: 231
Reg: 03-30-14
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08-26-16 02:37 PM - Post#209929
In response to mrjames
Whatever you say~
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final479
Freshman
Posts: 49
Reg: 01-19-08
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08-26-16 11:15 PM - Post#209962
In response to Local Observer
A longtime Penn fan, but for what's worth I think Messrs. Carter and Bamba attending Harvard would be incredibly exciting. It would represent a turning point for not only Harvard, but for the entire league, both its profile, competitiveness and as a draw to recruits. I'm rooting for this.
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HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2691
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
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08-27-16 01:55 PM - Post#209969
In response to final479
It's been suggested that Amaker is only looking for a 3 or 4 member 2017 recruiting class to follow the monster 7 member Class of 2016. Although Carter or Bamba would be amazing, what if they each go elsewhere? Beyond Haskett, I don't see mention of other prospects. Anyone know more?
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Tiger69
Postdoc
Posts: 2814
Reg: 11-23-04
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Wendell Carter and Mo Bamba
08-28-16 03:02 AM - Post#209988
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
Seriously...Harvard in the one-and-done market? 
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nychoops
Junior
Posts: 240
Reg: 11-23-04
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08-29-16 10:17 AM - Post#210000
In response to Tiger69
Please let me start by saying Mrjames has so much more knowledge about both Harvard and this league than I ever have or ever will...he has most likely forgotten more by his breakfast this morning than I've ever known.....and the details with these kids I'm sure he has knowledge of that i don't....but I do have enough 100% information directly in this case to know these kids will not be at Harvard next year,
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H78
PhD Student
Posts: 1458
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
Reg: 01-06-11
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08-30-16 04:20 AM - Post#210011
In response to final479
A longtime Penn fan, but for what's worth I think Messrs. Carter and Bamba attending Harvard would be incredibly exciting. It would represent a turning point for not only Harvard, but for the entire league, both its profile, competitiveness and as a draw to recruits. I'm rooting for this.
Absolutely. You are onto something very special that I also hope is going on here. The next 5 years will perhaps see more and more really smart achievers, who also play great basketball, come to the Ivies.
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Tiger69
Postdoc
Posts: 2814
Reg: 11-23-04
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 08-30-16 08:49 AM - Post#210013
In response to H78
If they are that good and that bright, they'll do their one-and-done at Kentucky, get drafted, play a few years, and THEN go Ivy where they can focus while playing club ball.
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mrjames
Professor
Posts: 6062
Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
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08-30-16 10:38 AM - Post#210015
In response to Tiger69
That's ridiculous. If you go to Harvard, you can pursue a pro career and come back and complete your degree over time. Why wouldn't you lock the ability to get a Harvard degree in while you can?
Ivies are about affecting the thought of the future leaders of our country and the world. Like it or not, future leaders includes athletes, just as it includes other entertainers. Gone are the days where the Ivies existed to afford patricians a private club to discuss philosophy and the arts. Athletes (and specifically basketball players) are growing increasingly interested in their brand, in business and being educated influencers. This won't be the last time a really smart, really talented player looks hard at the value of an Ivy degree to his or her future.
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Silver Maple
Postdoc
Posts: 3770
Loc: Westfield, New Jersey
Reg: 11-23-04
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08-30-16 11:40 AM - Post#210017
In response to mrjames
I'm just waiting to see how long it takes before somebody gets called a racist here.
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final479
Freshman
Posts: 49
Reg: 01-19-08
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08-30-16 01:56 PM - Post#210020
In response to mrjames
Beautifully said
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H78
PhD Student
Posts: 1458
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
Reg: 01-06-11
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08-30-16 06:31 PM - Post#210023
In response to final479
Beautifully said
Second that!
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Tiger69
Postdoc
Posts: 2814
Reg: 11-23-04
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08-30-16 08:18 PM - Post#210026
In response to mrjames
So, why not pursue your Harvard Degree without the distractions of the draft? Are you suggesting that a bright NBA vet who could be admitted at 18 could not get in at 24 with a wealth of real world experience and maturity?
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mrjames
Professor
Posts: 6062
Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
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08-30-16 09:57 PM - Post#210027
In response to Tiger69
I think you're being deliberately obtuse.
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Silver Maple
Postdoc
Posts: 3770
Loc: Westfield, New Jersey
Reg: 11-23-04
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08-30-16 10:12 PM - Post#210028
In response to mrjames
Disagree. It's a fair question. If a kid is on a track to being a lottery pick, why not go someplace like Kentucky? There he could pretty much focus full time on preparing for a career in pro basketball, while playing at the highest level of the college game and getting the best possible instruction. When his pro career is winding down, he can then turn his attention to getting a top-quality college education.
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PennFan10
Postdoc
Posts: 3584
Reg: 02-15-15
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08-30-16 10:32 PM - Post#210029
In response to Silver Maple
I think the point is that basketball gets you into Harvard and access to an Ivy degree. Once you are in you can finish whenever. Go the Kentucky/NBA route and your application to Harvard is one of 39,000 with a 3% chance of admittance.
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mrjames
Professor
Posts: 6062
Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
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08-30-16 10:41 PM - Post#210030
In response to Silver Maple
Because he's made it clear that academics are a high priority which is why people believe he's down to Harvard and Duke and many have reported that UK has withdrawn from its pursuit. Because he likes doing things a different way. Because he wouldn't get into Harvard when he's in his 20s but can now.
It's a question rooted in a particular stereotype of what a highly talented prospect wants - one that unfair and not applicable in this case. And that's obvious from any of the profiles you read about Wendell.
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Silver Maple
Postdoc
Posts: 3770
Loc: Westfield, New Jersey
Reg: 11-23-04
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08-30-16 11:11 PM - Post#210031
In response to mrjames
Go the Kentucky/NBA route and your application to Harvard is one of 39,000 with a 3% chance of admittance.
Sorry-- I don't buy that. A famous, retired NBA player would not be just another applicant.
Because he wouldn't get into Harvard when he's in his 20s but can now.
See above-- I'm skeptical of this claim, and I seriously doubt it's based on anything factual. And, to be clear, I'm making the assumption that Harvard wouldn't be the only acceptable college choice at this stage in his life.
Because he likes doing things a different way.
That makes sense. I can totally see this one.
It's a question rooted in a particular stereotype of what a highly talented prospect wants.
Here we go again.
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Tiger69
Postdoc
Posts: 2814
Reg: 11-23-04
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08-30-16 11:46 PM - Post#210032
In response to Silver Maple
Thank you.
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Tiger69
Postdoc
Posts: 2814
Reg: 11-23-04
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08-30-16 11:52 PM - Post#210033
In response to PennFan10
If LeBron James decided to apply to Princeton, or Harvard for that matter, after he retires, I expect that he would be accepted with open arms.
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PennFan10
Postdoc
Posts: 3584
Reg: 02-15-15
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08-31-16 09:32 AM - Post#210044
In response to Tiger69
If LeBron James decided to apply to Princeton, or Harvard for that matter, after he retires, I expect that he would be accepted with open arms.
I totally agree Lebron would be a great Harvard addition, though I am not sure he would play over Zena.
The question isn't about 1 superstar who is the 2G.O.A.T
What about Karl Anthony-Towns, Jahlil Okafor, Andrew Wiggins, Jabari Parker, Nerlens Noel, Anthony Davis, Michael-Kidd Gilchrist. Or Kyrie Irving, Enes Kanter, John Wall, Demarcus Cousins, Blake Griffin, Russell Westbrook, Kevin Love or even Carmelo Anthony.
Would all these players be accepted with "open arms" to Harvard today or would any of them have to go through the same application process as anyone else? These were all one and done players who were highly recruited to big name schools as consensus top 50 players out of high school.
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pennhoops
Postdoc
Posts: 2470
Reg: 11-21-04
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08-31-16 11:08 AM - Post#210049
In response to PennFan10
If LeBron James decided to apply to Princeton, or Harvard for that matter, after he retires, I expect that he would be accepted with open arms.
I totally agree Lebron would be a great Harvard addition, though I am not sure he would play over Zena.
The question isn't about 1 superstar who is the 2G.O.A.T
What about Karl Anthony-Towns, Jahlil Okafor, Andrew Wiggins, Jabari Parker, Nerlens Noel, Anthony Davis, Michael-Kidd Gilchrist. Or Kyrie Irving, Enes Kanter, John Wall, Demarcus Cousins, Blake Griffin, Russell Westbrook, Kevin Love or even Carmelo Anthony.
Would all these players be accepted with "open arms" to Harvard today or would any of them have to go through the same application process as anyone else? These were all one and done players who were highly recruited to big name schools as consensus top 50 players out of high school.
Sorry to get way off-topic but just a little fact-checking here: Russell Westbrook was a three star recruit who wound up at UCLA as an afterthought and hardly touched the ball as a frosh.
Now back to your regularly scheduled Questionable Harvard Admissions Practices programming.
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PennFan10
Postdoc
Posts: 3584
Reg: 02-15-15
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Wendell Carter and Mo Bamba
08-31-16 12:33 PM - Post#210054
In response to pennhoops
Right, sorry. And he left after his 2nd year at UCLA as the #4 pick overall. So he was 2 and done. (he was offered a scholarship by Ben Howland after Jordan Farmar declared for the draft in March)
Edited by PennFan10 on 08-31-16 12:41 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
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HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2691
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
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09-06-16 06:48 PM - Post#210237
In response to mrjames
DeAndre Ayton just committed to Arizona. Have to assume that doesn't help the Crimson's chance to land Carter or Bamba. Had Ayton selected Kentucky, and either Bamba/Carter ended up at Duke, I assume the remaining player might have had to consider his options, including Harvard.
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digamma
Masters Student
Posts: 468
Loc: Minneapolis
Reg: 11-27-11
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09-08-16 03:19 PM - Post#210283
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
I'm not sure if this is behind a subscription pay wall or not, but interesting comments from Rivals' national guy Harvard's chances with Carter and Bamba. In sum, he calls them "somewhat legitimate."
https://basketballrecruit ing.rivals.com/news/bossi...
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Tiger69
Postdoc
Posts: 2814
Reg: 11-23-04
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09-09-16 12:49 AM - Post#210300
In response to digamma
Could this be TA's way of proving to Duke that he can recruit with the big guys when Coach K calls it quits. Just sayin' 
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HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2691
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
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09-09-16 08:44 AM - Post#210301
In response to Tiger69
Hope so! Also hope he's successful in proving that point.
Amaker has reportedly received numerous offers to leave Harvard over the past few years. If the only position he would take is head coach of Duke I'd be relieved.
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Tiger69
Postdoc
Posts: 2814
Reg: 11-23-04
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09-09-16 11:24 AM - Post#210304
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
Until then, perhaps Harvard can come up with a "Harvard Lite" one year program to teach prospects the skills they will need to keep from going from riches to rags a few years after receiving hefty bonuses and seven figure salaries. 
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HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2691
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
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09-09-16 11:32 AM - Post#210305
In response to Tiger69
Don't all Harvard grads get hefty bonuses immediately upon graduation?
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iabhoops88
Sophomore
Posts: 107
Loc: Los Angeles
Reg: 01-26-13
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09-20-16 06:37 PM - Post#210629
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
Wendell Carter just tweeted his final four schools: Georgia, Georgia Tech, Duke, and Harvard!
Of note, Duke is the only one on Gary Trent Jr.'s final five schools. Trent and Carter have repeatedly said they will attend the same school. Perhaps that has changed.
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Local Observer
Junior
Posts: 231
Reg: 03-30-14
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Wendell Carter and Mo Bamba
09-21-16 04:20 PM - Post#210674
In response to iabhoops88
I still think this whole "Harvard" thing is a sham, and that the kid has always been headed for Duke. Keeping Harvard on the list makes for a good story and makes some kind of political point for him and his recruiting gurus. Maybe it's: "I may be a one and done, but I'm not dumb. I coulda gone to Harvard."
The experts aren't fooled, as all 31 on the 247 roster see him headed to Duke.
Edited by Local Observer on 09-21-16 04:31 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
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digamma
Masters Student
Posts: 468
Loc: Minneapolis
Reg: 11-27-11
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09-22-16 08:28 AM - Post#210699
In response to Local Observer
Maybe it is a sham but I think the good it does for Harvard basketball greatly outweighs the personal pride he gets for being able to say I coulda gone to Harvard.
BTW, the real window dressing here is the inclusion of the hometown schools in the final four. Pretty sure both Fox and Pastner begged to be in the final four to look relevant in state.
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Tiger69
Postdoc
Posts: 2814
Reg: 11-23-04
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09-22-16 11:19 AM - Post#210709
In response to digamma
He can have his cake and eat it too. He can spend a year at a fine school like Dook honing his bball skills, put aside a chunk of his NBA paychecks for a half dozen years, transfer to Harvard that is so eager to have him now (he will be able to pay full tuition by then!) and he'll have his H degree and several million $ before he's 30! 
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Local Observer
Junior
Posts: 231
Reg: 03-30-14
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09-22-16 11:39 AM - Post#210712
In response to Tiger69
To tiger 69: has that kind of thing ever happened? I doubt that it has or that it ever will. Harvard and the Georgias are all just "political" window dressing, IMHO.
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mrjames
Professor
Posts: 6062
Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
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09-22-16 11:56 AM - Post#210716
In response to Local Observer
I disagree with a lot of what is being said here. I do think he will end up at Duke. Everything else could broadly be categorized into three buckets: off base, ignorant or arrogant/condescending.
Since this borders too closely on territory that falls under my #dayjob, I'll merely say that there has been a tremendous change in the way in which athletes view themselves which prioritizes brand, business and education. To pretend like a person who excels at a sport can't also pursue other interests at a very high level is, at a minimum, an incredibly outmoded way of thinking.
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HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2691
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
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09-22-16 12:20 PM - Post#210719
In response to Local Observer
I'm not aware of Harvard taking many "older" students ab initio. My son is there now. There is a 22 year old orphan in the class of 2018 from Rwanda whose story was so unique that it ended up in the NY Times, but otherwise it doesn't seem to be a path to an undergraduate acceptance. I would think that this would likely be especially true if the candidate matriculated elsewhere, went on to a career, and wanted to go back to school. Maybe Harvard's Extension School would be available, but not the traditional undergraduate program.
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Silver Maple
Postdoc
Posts: 3770
Loc: Westfield, New Jersey
Reg: 11-23-04
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09-22-16 12:22 PM - Post#210720
In response to mrjames
Everything else could broadly be categorized into three buckets: off base, ignorant or arrogant/condescending.
I see we're back to that again.
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Local Observer
Junior
Posts: 231
Reg: 03-30-14
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09-22-16 01:26 PM - Post#210726
In response to Silver Maple
Hillary divides those who disagree into two buckets - MR James seems to put them in three buckets!
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Tiger69
Postdoc
Posts: 2814
Reg: 11-23-04
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09-22-16 06:17 PM - Post#210757
In response to mrjames
I'm all for talented, intelligent young students who are also exceptional athletes using their atleticism to leverage other interests. I do NOT consider myself arrogant or condescending in suggesting that one and done is something of an academic joke for an exceptional basketball prospect headed to the NBA. You tell me which, between a 25 year old with several years of living experience or an 18 year old who has been courted and fawned over as a basketball prodigy since junior high school, is likely to approach educational opportunity more seriously.
In your excitement over recent Harvard basketball success you have fallen victim to the rationalization that Harvard can play the one and done game to the benefit of the athlete. If you think a qualified prospect is serious about wanting a H degree, then why not conditionally accept him, allowing him to play his silly NBA-required year at some bball factory where he can devote his full energy to developing his talent and then, after he has played out his career, admit him as a more worldly and serious student with fewer distractions?
And, to address another poster, what is wrong with having some undergraduates who are a few years older than the norm? We believe in cultural and racial diversity. How about a little age/ experience diversity to season the pot with some real world wisdom and insight?
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mrjames
Professor
Posts: 6062
Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
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09-22-16 06:28 PM - Post#210759
In response to Tiger69
"I do NOT consider myself arrogant or condescending in suggesting that one and done is something of an academic joke for an exceptional basketball prospect headed to the NBA."
Huh. Okay. I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.
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Local Observer
Junior
Posts: 231
Reg: 03-30-14
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09-22-16 07:02 PM - Post#210761
In response to mrjames
I say let Duke and Kentucky etc have the "one and dunners". This practice is unhealthy and should be discouraged.
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Tiger69
Postdoc
Posts: 2814
Reg: 11-23-04
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09-23-16 12:28 AM - Post#210768
In response to mrjames
I guess that you didn't read my full post.
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iabhoops88
Sophomore
Posts: 107
Loc: Los Angeles
Reg: 01-26-13
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09-30-16 07:33 PM - Post#211077
In response to Tiger69
Wendell Carter rates Harvard visit 9 out of 10. He visits Duke October 22nd with Gary Trent Jr.
http://usatodayhss.com/2016/the-wendell-cart er-jr-...
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