palestra38
Professor
Posts: 32683
Reg: 11-21-04
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02-09-17 11:22 AM - Post#221100
I wish..... anyway, a great piece on a great coach who appreciates the Palestra
http://philadelphia.cbslocal.com/2017/02/09/gregg-...
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TheLine
Professor
Posts: 5597
Age: 60
Reg: 07-07-09
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02-09-17 11:32 AM - Post#221103
In response to palestra38
Popovich loves it..said would be great to play in a place like that often...
That can be arranged.
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10Q
Professor
Posts: 23199
Loc: Suburban Philly
Reg: 11-21-04
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02-09-17 01:23 PM - Post#221120
In response to TheLine
Maybe Dunphy will come back. They don't love him at Temple.
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bradley
PhD Student
Posts: 1842
Age: 74
Reg: 01-15-16
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Re: Help is On the Way 02-09-17 01:44 PM - Post#221125
In response to palestra38
The best thing about the Ivy League Tournament is the Palestra -- hands down -- magnificent landmark. Part of the tradition of Penn and the Ivy League unlike the concept of the tournament.
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Buckeye Quake
PhD Student
Posts: 1601
Reg: 11-21-04
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02-09-17 02:29 PM - Post#221133
In response to 10Q
You're kidding right? How about some new, young blood. Someone with no connection to anyone or anything at the university. I know we blew it with Miller but this program needs a total transformation.
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pennsive
Junior
Posts: 200
Reg: 11-21-04
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02-09-17 03:05 PM - Post#221140
In response to Buckeye Quake
Penn Pal, This discussion is either two years to early or two years too late. Steve D inherited a mess, and all the tall, athletic players who accepted admission to Penn who are not part of our team today would vex even the best high profile coaches. With what we had in the tank, I advocated for a triangle and 2 defense; Steve went with a 1-3-1. I still think that mine works better for rebounding purposes and for not giving up as many uncontested threes, but I concede that the coaches know more than I or we do, and they see the players in practice. What Steve, or any other coach you might suggest would have to do to turn this around is to bring in tall athletic players who can match up with HYP in a man defense, and that is exactly what we has done with our recruits. It seems that it takes multiple years to recruit a coveted player, so with 2 years in, Steve has done a great job to bring in AJ, Williams, Simmons, and Scott, along with the shooters that we do have. The next problem, is that HYP have 3-4 years of those players, and we will only have one year of that level recruit, plus AJ. That means that Steve, or any other coach has to double down on the recruiting and has to start teaching the defense and offense that he intends to use next year and years going forward. As many have said, and this is no knock on Steve, we may have underestimated how far the other teams were along, and over estimated the ability of our shorter, and less athletic players to match up with them. FWIIW, I would playWood and Matt H as my guards, Max as my center on offense, and as the 4 on defense, AJ as the 4 on offense and the 5 on defense, and Sam J as the 3, now that he has found his stroke again. I think that such a lineup, with Devon, Darnell and Jake backing up Wood, depending on what catalyst was needed at the moment, Betleyl backing up Matt and Sam, and a mixing and matching to back up Max and AJ would work best. We need players to play for whom the moment is not too big. W,hen it is too big, that can contribute to a bunch of missed foul shots, and that is where we are now.
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Penndemonium
PhD Student
Posts: 1877
Reg: 11-29-04
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Help is On the Way 02-09-17 04:06 PM - Post#221141
In response to Buckeye Quake
All, let's put this in perspective. The team was better than we all expected in the out-of-conference schedule, both in terms of record and watchability. That raised our expectations.
The team has been worse than expected in-conference. Winless and not passing the eye test at all.
This does suggest that we have an easy team to scout and prepare for. This is not at all surprising to me. Our talent is not up to par. You can't win the ivy league these days with two good players. That's where we are. The rest of the players such as Goodman, Macdonald, Wood, Silpe, Donahue, Betley, Rothschild, etc. are capable. We keep getting fooled by a good game from each of them. We are all guilty of picking our favorites from that tier of players. But we have to remember that none of them are above average players at their position.
That is something that people miss from the Dunphy teams. The younger role players on those teams eventually had real talent relative to the rest of the league and eventually became all-ivy players. Moore, Trice, Krug, Romanczuk, Schiffner, Begley, and more. An even better sign of the depth is that Donald Moxley came up from the JV and didn't see much playing time until his senior year - and was instantly an all-ivy performer. Those teams were just far deeper relative to the league.
Today, the rest of the league is far better than before. And I don't think any of us think that players other than Howard or Brodeur will even sniff at all-ivy in the future. So we will have to rely on Donahue's recruiting and wait a few years to see how it turns out. Until then, we will have head-scratching rotations and gimmick defenses to make up for our talent.
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westphillywarrior
Sophomore
Posts: 196
Age: 43
Reg: 01-08-11
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02-09-17 05:28 PM - Post#221145
In response to Buckeye Quake
I can't believe everyone is talking about 2 or 3 years away. All we have to do is finish fourth in the league. Six wins should do it. Four games with Cornell and Columbia. A game with Brown. A game with Dartmouth. A home game with Harvard.
COME ON! WE'RE PENN!
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Buckeye Quake
PhD Student
Posts: 1601
Reg: 11-21-04
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Help is On the Way 02-09-17 05:40 PM - Post#221146
In response to pennsive
I can't speak for 10Q Pennsive, but my comments were merely hypothetical. Wishful thinking maybe but Donahue isn't going anywhere anytime soon unless he resigns and that ain't happening.
All the speculating about lineups has become like peeing in the wind for me. There's no good outcome. Just get it over with. This program as it's constructed now is a group of JV level talent masquerading as a Division One team. I don't say that to demean anyone's optimism it's just that my optimism like this program has hit rock bottom.
Edited by Penn pal on 02-09-17 05:40 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
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palestra38
Professor
Posts: 32683
Reg: 11-21-04
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02-09-17 05:49 PM - Post#221147
In response to westphillywarrior
Have you watched the team this year? The odds of them winning 6 of their 8 remaining games is about as good as Trump offering Hillary the next Supreme Court opening.
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SteveChop
PhD Student
Posts: 1150
Reg: 07-28-07
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02-09-17 06:15 PM - Post#221153
In response to palestra38
That would be a great improvement to SCOTUS!
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Penn7277
PhD Student
Posts: 1365
Loc: Lancaster, PA
Reg: 11-21-04
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02-09-17 06:27 PM - Post#221154
In response to SteveChop
It would be even better if it were POTUS.
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TheLine
Professor
Posts: 5597
Age: 60
Reg: 07-07-09
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02-09-17 07:26 PM - Post#221162
In response to westphillywarrior
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q7vtWB4owdE
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westphillywarrior
Sophomore
Posts: 196
Age: 43
Reg: 01-08-11
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02-09-17 09:51 PM - Post#221175
In response to palestra38
Have you watched the team this year? The odds of them winning 6 of their 8 remaining games is about as good as Trump offering Hillary the next Supreme Court opening.
I'd say that the odds of them winning at least 6 of the next 8 are better than the odds that they would lose all of the first 6.
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palestra38
Professor
Posts: 32683
Reg: 11-21-04
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02-09-17 09:53 PM - Post#221176
In response to westphillywarrior
Well, considering that it has happened, I would venture the odds of losing Penn's first 6 games is 100%. Get serious--they have been terrible, this isn't bad luck. We will be lucky to win half of our remaining games.
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Buckeye Quake
PhD Student
Posts: 1601
Reg: 11-21-04
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02-09-17 11:22 PM - Post#221181
In response to palestra38
Maybe denial IS a river in Egypt.
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Tiger69
Postdoc
Posts: 2801
Reg: 11-23-04
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02-10-17 01:20 AM - Post#221187
In response to Penn7277
It would even be better if it were Bernie. Miss Hillary didn't learn a d@mn thing from Trump and Bernie's primary successes. Her campaign staff was clueless. Therefore, we got Trump.
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Mike Porter
Postdoc
Posts: 3615
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
Reg: 11-21-04
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Re: Help is On the Way 02-10-17 04:32 AM - Post#221189
In response to Penndemonium
All, let's put this in perspective. The team was better than we all expected in the out-of-conference schedule, both in terms of record and watchability. That raised our expectations.
The team has been worse than expected in-conference. Winless and not passing the eye test at all.
This does suggest that we have an easy team to scout and prepare for. This is not at all surprising to me. Our talent is not up to par. You can't win the ivy league these days with two good players. That's where we are. The rest of the players such as Goodman, Macdonald, Wood, Silpe, Donahue, Betley, Rothschild, etc. are capable. We keep getting fooled by a good game from each of them. We are all guilty of picking our favorites from that tier of players. But we have to remember that none of them are above average players at their position.
That is something that people miss from the Dunphy teams. The younger role players on those teams eventually had real talent relative to the rest of the league and eventually became all-ivy players. Moore, Trice, Krug, Romanczuk, Schiffner, Begley, and more. An even better sign of the depth is that Donald Moxley came up from the JV and didn't see much playing time until his senior year - and was instantly an all-ivy performer. Those teams were just far deeper relative to the league.
Today, the rest of the league is far better than before. And I don't think any of us think that players other than Howard or Brodeur will even sniff at all-ivy in the future. So we will have to rely on Donahue's recruiting and wait a few years to see how it turns out. Until then, we will have head-scratching rotations and gimmick defenses to make up for our talent.
Betley missed time early due to injury, so he's only played 9 games, but his ORAT is 104, he is 54% on 2's 37% 3's and 91% on FTs. He's also shown unexpected athleticism and defensive value in a zone. We'll see how his year ends but count me as someone that thinks he is part of the future solution. If Donahue can develop him I also do think he has All Ivy potential (a Schiffner or Wittman type).
Let's see what happens the rest of the season, but since its basically over I think he is a player that should play as much as possible (it's not like other guys are world beater defenders if that's the concern).
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AsiaSunset
Postdoc
Posts: 4350
Reg: 11-21-04
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02-10-17 10:02 AM - Post#221194
In response to Mike Porter
This has been a difficult year for everyone and I've hesitated to be that vocal on this site because we do need a little patience; however, as much as I like SD, I believe his inability to settle on a stable rotation is very unsettling and he must bear the blame for a team that appears to be under-performing and, even worse, regressing.
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10Q
Professor
Posts: 23199
Loc: Suburban Philly
Reg: 11-21-04
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02-10-17 10:11 AM - Post#221195
In response to AsiaSunset
He gets one more year.
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