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Username Post: Post-Game at Baby Blues        (Topic#19914)
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 32685

Reg: 11-21-04
02-11-17 12:23 AM - Post#221313    

In walks Sam Jones. We congratulate him and say "First of 8 in a row." Sam: "That's what we're going to do."

Bob Weinhauer at a table: "Nice to see the team---they need some more athletic players." He'll be there on Sunday in Section 103 if people want to say hello. He was surprised he was not invited to the 90th birthday of the Palestra after he learned so many players from his '79 team were there. Penn really blew that event.

As for the game, finally, Steve D. went with a rotation and stuck with it. Everyone but Jackson D. played well--Howard particularly well and saved the game with his 2 YUGE blocks in the last minute. Sam is back to top form and Goodman is a revelation. If Foreman could use his right hand, he would be really really good. As it is, he is solid, albeit he made 2 or 3 terrible mistakes.

But man, did we own the boards. I do not recall a Penn team ever dominating the boards like we did tonight.

Let's stick with this lineup and let them play. Great to see the energy tonight and great to see a win. One game at a time.

 
westphillywarrior 
Sophomore
Posts: 196

Age: 43
Reg: 01-08-11
Re: Post-Game at Baby Blues
02-11-17 11:44 AM - Post#221342    
    In response to palestra38

So you said "First of 8 in a row". That's great.

I hope he didn't know it was you who said a day earlier:
"The odds of them winning 6 of their 8 remaining games is about as good as Trump offering Hillary the next Supreme Court opening."

 
SomeGuy 
Professor
Posts: 6391

Reg: 11-22-04
Re: Post-Game at Baby Blues
02-11-17 11:50 AM - Post#221344    
    In response to palestra38

Even in victory, I have to defend Jackson Donahue! He actually produced a 111 ORAT for the game. Only Jones, AJ, and Dev were better. Obviously 2 for 8 isn't ideal(!), but 3 assists and 0 turnovers in 16 minutes covers over a lot.

 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 32685

Reg: 11-21-04
Re: Post-Game at Baby Blues
02-11-17 11:57 AM - Post#221351    
    In response to westphillywarrior

Don't think that I'm not rooting for it to happen. No matter what, I'm a diehard to the last moment--do you think I've kept my season tickets over the last 10 years because I root against Penn?

My opinion about the likelihood of making the playoff has not changed---but I would love to be wrong.

 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 32685

Reg: 11-21-04
Re: Post-Game at Baby Blues
02-11-17 12:00 PM - Post#221353    
    In response to SomeGuy

He couldn't cover anyone----Columbia guards flew by him as if it were the autobahn. But here's where the Twin Towers arrangement may have helped.

And 2-8, 1-6 from 3 while doing virtually nothing else? Come on--if ORAT says that's good, it's a useless stat for an individual game.

 
SomeGuy 
Professor
Posts: 6391

Reg: 11-22-04
Re: Post-Game at Baby Blues
02-11-17 12:58 PM - Post#221357    
    In response to palestra38

The last time you made this claim about the defense, I went back and catalogued how he wasn't even guarding the guys who were blowing by people, and how he only had a handful of plays (in 30 plus minutes) where a guy even tried to take him off the dribble.

Last night was the same -- he wasn't guarding the guys who blow by people. To the extent he struggled defensively, it was just that he failed to get around screens.

Why don't you watch a little video and tell me who precisely was blowing by him and when?

 
SomeGuy 
Professor
Posts: 6391

Reg: 11-22-04
Re: Post-Game at Baby Blues
02-11-17 01:25 PM - Post#221359    
    In response to SomeGuy

Ok, first half, times guys "flew" by him: zero.

Hickman tried off the dribble 3 times. Donahue stayed with him each time, resulting in a block, one cutoff and pass, and a turnover. As I mentioned before, he did go under two Voss screens, which gave Hickman space to hit 2 threes. Mostly covered Hickman, but a couple of possessions on Killingsworth, and one each on Adlesh and Hunter. None of those guys ever touched the ball in those possessions.

On offense, not sure what to say about "not doing anything." He got 8 shots and 3 assists in 16 minutes. He was all over what they were doing. He was missing shots. But he was involved the whole time.

 
SomeGuy 
Professor
Posts: 6391

Reg: 11-22-04
Re: Post-Game at Baby Blues
02-11-17 02:09 PM - Post#221365    
    In response to SomeGuy

Second half, about the 12 minute mark, Hickman did get by a backpedaling Donahue on a fast break to score.

And he did get away from Donahue on a drive with about 2 minutes left, but that was because Howard for some reason screened Donahue.

So there you go, one instance where anybody blew by Donahue.



 
SRP 
Postdoc
Posts: 4894

Reg: 02-04-06
02-11-17 02:49 PM - Post#221374    
    In response to SomeGuy

In general it seemed like Smith could penetrate but not finish plays that well last night. A lot of errant floaters and less-than-useful passes from the lane. Brodeur and Howard and Rothschild were really working on defense,

 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 32685

Reg: 11-21-04
Re: Post-Game at Baby Blues
02-11-17 03:10 PM - Post#221380    
    In response to SomeGuy

All I can tell you is that I commented twice on how he played matador defense after a play right in front of me. But since I am not going back to watch the game, I will stand corrected. So what you are saying is that a guy who really does nothing but shoot (feel free to analyze the 3 assists--he doesn't hold the ball for long) is contributing when he shoots 2 for 8.

 
SomeGuy 
Professor
Posts: 6391

Reg: 11-22-04
Re: Post-Game at Baby Blues
02-11-17 06:45 PM - Post#221406    
    In response to palestra38

All I'm really saying is that it seemed to me rather odd to pick him out as not having had a good game (particularly when it was rather obvious that one other player for Penn had a much tougher night on both ends).





 
13otto 
Masters Student
Posts: 779
13otto
Loc: Philadelphia, PA
Reg: 11-22-04
02-11-17 07:05 PM - Post#221411    
    In response to SomeGuy

I agree that JD did not have a bad game. And while you're obviously referring to Darnell when you mention the rather obvious Penn player who had a tougher night, the offense looked more in sync because Darnell didn't look to lead the team in scoring or shots taken. Because of that, we had 18 assists on 24 made field goals. That's the first time in Ivy play this year, and the first time since the LaSalle game, that we've had that high an assist rate. That and the rebounding advantage are the reasons we won this game. I've been critical of Darnell for leading our team in shot attempts in Ivy play, so I'll give him credit for not looking to do so last night.
http://www.letsgoquakers.com/


 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 32685

Reg: 11-21-04
Re: Post-Game at Baby Blues
02-11-17 07:08 PM - Post#221412    
    In response to SomeGuy

Darnell was the only guard who played defense and could stop their freshman phenom. That's not just my opinion---it's obviously that of the coach. Goodman had trouble with him and they didn't try Donahue on him for obvious reasons. That's why he was out there despite making too many mistakes on offense---without him, we lose. Without Donahue, we don't lose.

 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 32685

Reg: 11-21-04
02-11-17 07:10 PM - Post#221413    
    In response to 13otto

Oh please. Comparing what Donahue brought last night to that of Foreman is trolling.

 
SomeGuy 
Professor
Posts: 6391

Reg: 11-22-04
Re: Post-Game at Baby Blues
02-11-17 10:34 PM - Post#221445    
    In response to palestra38

Except that isn't what happened. Watch the tape, and just watch Foreman on Smith. He gets beaten more times in the first four minutes than Donahue does the whole game. When Goodman comes in, initially they have Foreman on Smith. But that continues to not work, and they eventually switch to Goodman on him. It was almost exactly the opposite of what you describe.

Edited by SomeGuy on 02-11-17 10:45 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
SomeGuy 
Professor
Posts: 6391

Reg: 11-22-04
02-11-17 10:39 PM - Post#221447    
    In response to palestra38

Agreed that it isn't a totally fair comparison -- Foreman was asked to do a lot more in this game. Smith is the toughest job.

That said, Hickman is a tough assignment, and like Brodeur, he seems to have struggled more as teams actually prepare for him. So it is true that in this one Donahue was guarding their 2nd best guard, while Sam or Betley would generally take the guy who isn't an offensive threat (Hunter). As the game went on though, Betley was the guy who was asked to take Hickman late.

 
SomeGuy 
Professor
Posts: 6391

Reg: 11-22-04
02-11-17 10:45 PM - Post#221449    
    In response to 13otto

One caveat on this -- my impression is that whether or not Darnell is driving aggressively is the coach's decision. I don't literally mean that he is told possession by possession whether to drive, but I do think whether or not they play that style varies based on matchups and game flow, and the call comes from the bench. So I don't think we should be blaming Darnell. It may be the wrong decision/approach, but I don't think Foreman is saying "the heck with these other guys, I'm taking it to the hoop."

 
13otto 
Masters Student
Posts: 779
13otto
Loc: Philadelphia, PA
Reg: 11-22-04
02-12-17 12:12 AM - Post#221463    
    In response to SomeGuy

Not saying it's Darnell's decision. Just saying that when they play that style with Darnell driving with his head down and taking too many shots, as they did in 5 of the first 6 Ivy games, the offense looks out of sync and we don't (and won't) win. If we pass the ball around instead and have a high assist rate, the offense looks better and we can actually win league games. While that wouldn't be enough to beat Princeton, it gives us a chance to beat the Ivy teams with whom we're battling for the final spot in the Ivy Tournament.
http://www.letsgoquakers.com/


 
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