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Username Post: Penn again        (Topic#20069)
1LotteryPick1969 
PhD Student
Posts: 1360
1LotteryPick1969
Age: 66
Loc: Baltimore, Maryland
Reg: 11-21-04
Re: Penn again
03-06-17 08:15 AM - Post#225202    
    In response to SRP

  • SRP Said:
a good question to ask coaches or players



There is not really a forum to ask questions like this. In a way, I like the way college ball shields the players--they are students, not professional athletes.

I guess the reason I keep bringing up Kittles is that I really like the idea of having fresh blood on the coaching staff, someone with success in a different college system, and at the professional level, so I keep looking for characteristics of this team that I have not previously seen.

I would suspect Kittles is a candidate to move up the coaching ladder. Even an assistant coaching job at a power conference would look better on his resume.

 
bradley 
Masters Student
Posts: 476

Age: 68
Reg: 01-15-16
Re: Penn again
03-06-17 10:14 AM - Post#225216    
    In response to 1LotteryPick1969

I was interested in the players' reaction when the coaches were cutting down the nets Saturday night. There was a fair amount of chaos going on so the players' reaction may have been altered by the chaos. Kittles got players' clapping and yelling similar to the other two assistant coaches -- nothing more or less. The players went crazy when Henderson cut down the nets. If Henderson leaves, which I suspect, it seems unlikely that Kittles will get the job but who knows.

I have my non-IL Philadelphia co-workers giving me a hard time that the Tigers will be playing a road game at the Palestra this weekend. They are trying to have such good fun with the optics of it all. I inform them if the Quakers lose, it will be either due to refs, Chip Kelly or Andy Reid not running the football.

Updated odds on one of the web sites: Tigers 47%, Harvard 21%, Yale 14%, Penn 18%.

 
SRP 
Postdoc
Posts: 3076

Reg: 02-04-06
03-06-17 02:53 PM - Post#225257    
    In response to bradley

If Mike is correct, MH would be leaving behind a very strong recruiting class. But a salary doubling or more could be an inducement, even though Sydney Johnson may not be the model to follow. (It's been a tough year for PU expat coaches--Thompson's seat is getting hot, Brennan had a terrible offense and a bad record, Johnson still hasn't broken through, Carmody had a weak season. Only Mooney seems to glide along year after year.)

 
Chip Bayers 
Postdoc
Posts: 3731
Chip Bayers
Loc: New York
Reg: 11-21-04
03-06-17 03:20 PM - Post#225261    
    In response to SRP

  • SRP Said:
I tend to overrate lightening-fast PGs so perhaps my concern about Goodman is unwarranted, but Penn has generally looked better when fast-breaking, so Goodman could have some effect there. My older concerns about half-court blow-bys have diminished as the Tigers have improved a lot at on-ball defense.



I'd focus on the fast break part of this - Penn is going to need a fair share of cheap baskets in transition to have a shot at the upset because the quality of Princeton's D in the half court is going to make it hard to score efficiently there.

Since Princeton rarely turns the ball over, adding Goodman and his 2.7 steal % to that of Howard and Betley increases the odds that they can get the Tigers above their season average and create scoring opportunities before the Princeton D can rotate back, while keeping their own TOs at a minimum. Penn only forced 10 and 12 T0s in the first two matchups without Goodman, good for 15.7 and 21.1% of PU possessions on offense, and compounded that by turning it over at 23 and 24% themselves.


 
bradley 
Masters Student
Posts: 476

Age: 68
Reg: 01-15-16
03-06-17 10:17 PM - Post#225336    
    In response to TigerFan

I like your positive attitude and let's hope that you got it right. Monmouth for the second straight year lost in the conference playoffs despite their outstanding regular season performance. They lost in the conference semifinal the other night to Siena (16-16) at a neutral court ending a 17 game winning streak. Monmouth was a projected #13 seed.

Let's hope that we do not see them in the NIT Tournament. If so, we should do just fine against them based on Tigers improved play since losing to them by six at Monmouth.

Bottom line for this weekend is that the Tigers need to be on their game -- focused and intense defense.

 
Go Green 
Junior
Posts: 261

Age: 46
Reg: 04-22-10
Penn again
03-07-17 11:23 AM - Post#225384    
    In response to SRP

  • SRP Said:
Thompson's seat is getting hot,



A Wash Post columnist predicted that JTIII will get one more year.

But we will see soon enough.

Edited by Go Green on 03-07-17 11:23 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
SRP 
Postdoc
Posts: 3076

Reg: 02-04-06
03-08-17 09:41 PM - Post#225766    
    In response to Go Green

KenPom is offended by the tournament format screwing Princeton:

http://kenpom.com/blog/2017-ivy-league- tournament-...

 
bradley 
Masters Student
Posts: 476

Age: 68
Reg: 01-15-16
03-08-17 10:10 PM - Post#225783    
    In response to SRP

ACC with 9 or 10 bids gives their best teams an incredible and justified competitive advantage but not the IL geniuses - had no foresight -- sad but true. Kenpom good job of calling them out.

 
HARVARDDADGRAD 
Masters Student
Posts: 806

Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
03-08-17 10:47 PM - Post#225794    
    In response to bradley

ESPN Commentators describing Bucknell (3) beating Lehigh (1) for the Patriot Title at Bucknell:

"We have to be able to fix this folks, a 1 Seed should never be playing on the road."

 
mrjames 
Postdoc
Posts: 4602

Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
03-08-17 11:04 PM - Post#225802    
    In response to HARVARDDADGRAD

Bucknell was the one seed - it won the league going away. Lehigh was the 3.

Not sure what those commentators were talking about...

 
HARVARDDADGRAD 
Masters Student
Posts: 806

Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
03-08-17 11:38 PM - Post#225811    
    In response to mrjames

They said it! Confused I guess.



 
bradley 
Masters Student
Posts: 476

Age: 68
Reg: 01-15-16
03-08-17 11:53 PM - Post#225815    
    In response to HARVARDDADGRAD

Maybe they were thinking about the IL Tournament??

 
SRP 
Postdoc
Posts: 3076

Reg: 02-04-06
03-09-17 04:25 AM - Post#225830    
    In response to bradley

So Bucknell, the highest-rated OOC win for the Tigers, punched its ticket, plus I saw a bubble watch for Cal where their win over Princeton was listed as one of their two top-50 wins. Moving up in the world.

 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 15751

Reg: 11-21-04
03-09-17 07:03 AM - Post#225833    
    In response to HARVARDDADGRAD

I saw that too---they had the seeding wrong and went off on the unfairness of it based on their own mistake. I guess those budget cuts at ESPN are having their effects.

 
Charlie Fog 
Junior
Posts: 291

Age: 48
Loc: Philly
Reg: 11-12-13
03-09-17 07:51 AM - Post#225837    
    In response to mrjames

  • mrjames Said:
Bucknell was the one seed - it won the league going away. Lehigh was the 3.

Not sure what those commentators were talking about...



Alternative facts

 
whitakk 
Sophomore
Posts: 144

Age: 26
Reg: 11-11-14
03-09-17 10:36 AM - Post#225851    
    In response to Charlie Fog

Game preview: http://www.nycbuckets.com/2017/03/ivy-league-to urn...

 
bradley 
Masters Student
Posts: 476

Age: 68
Reg: 01-15-16
03-09-17 11:32 AM - Post#225871    
    In response to SRP

The motto "Be careful what you wish for" is something to consider regarding the IL Tournament. I remember prior to Saturday night's game how the Dartmouth faithful were hoping for an upset win over Princeton with Penn and Columbia losing in order to give them the "opportunity" to participate at the NCAA Tournament. Their excitement was understandable especially in light of their amazing road win at Penn the night before and their long drought as to playing at the Big Dance.

When Dartmouth was down 41 pts with 15 minutes to go against a very good but not dominant Tiger team, I was thinking what it would have been like for them to play Kentucky, Gonzaga or North Carolina in round one and what would be the story line after the game regarding the IL.

The notion that it really does not make that much of a difference as to which one of the 4 IL teams getting an automatic bid is at best wishful thinking. It may be true in a given year but over time, the math simply does not add up. After a conversation last Saturday after the game, I believe more than ever that the primary reason for the IL Tournament is $$$.

 
PennFan10 
Masters Student
Posts: 963

Reg: 02-15-15
03-09-17 12:32 PM - Post#225896    
    In response to bradley

Yes but that same math will have our best team in the NCAA tournament most of the time and I would argue either Princeton or Harvard would show well in the NCAA's this year. There is a 70% chance we get one of those two I believe. Over time, our best teams will win the regular season and the tournament and will show well in the NCAA's.

 
mrjames 
Postdoc
Posts: 4602

Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
03-09-17 01:18 PM - Post#225899    
    In response to bradley

  • Quote:
It may be true in a given year but over time, the math simply does not add up.



Take it from someone that has done the math. It can add up. Depends on a lot of factors, but there are very plausible worlds in which it ends up being a good thing for the league.

In general, I think it'll be a slight, net loser over time (whereas annual MTEs would be a noticeable plus), but it's unlikely to be the disaster over time that many seem to think.

Also, I'd expect the short run to really be the issue not the long run. I think there will be some bad beats some years. But over a longer look, we'll be closer to even.

 
bradley 
Masters Student
Posts: 476

Age: 68
Reg: 01-15-16
03-09-17 03:34 PM - Post#225924    
    In response to mrjames

Time will tell based on results as to what is the proper descriptive term. I have never used or suggested disastrous difference in results between the IL Tournament winner and IL regular season winner but I would also not use the word none or slight.

It is somewhat ironic that in year 1 of the IL Tournament, the 4th seed has roughly a 1 out of 5 chance to play a #2 or #1 seed in the NCAA Tournament.

 
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