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Username Post: Penn again        (Topic#20069)
mrjames 
Postdoc
Posts: 4619

Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
03-09-17 04:48 PM - Post#225932    
    In response to bradley

Definitely worth nothing that this year could, indeed, be one of those disasters.

There's a ~30% chance that our rep is a 16 (mayyyybe a 15, but probably a 16), and that a 13 (or outside 12) will be sent to the NIT.

Harvard would probably sneak to the 14 line, which would be a non-disastrous outcome, but it's more likely that one of Penn or Yale wins the bid than Harvard.

If Princeton had won a few more NC games, it would be a different story, but this is not the best of scenarios for the Ivy Tourney to be facing in year one.

 
TheLine 
Postdoc
Posts: 3043

Age: 54
Reg: 07-07-09
03-09-17 06:21 PM - Post#225950    
    In response to mrjames

It's a perfect storm.

The 4th seed has a losing record but is dangerous, high variance and playing on its home court. The 3rd seed is also high variance. The 2nd seed might not be as high variance but it's largely made up of Freshmen so who knows. Meanwhile there is an indisputable regular season champion.

Wouldn't it be awful if that regular season champion gets knocked off?


 
SRP 
Postdoc
Posts: 3084

Reg: 02-04-06
03-09-17 08:49 PM - Post#225974    
    In response to TheLine

Well, the league office is just going to have to get out their orange-and-black pompoms for these games. If the PU players actually like the concept of the tourney, they now have even more motivation--two wins and the thing is probably secure for quite some time.

It would be fun if the Tigers got hot from outside this weekend and just blew everybody away. But I have a feeling at least one game is going to be a tense grinder, hopefully still a win.

 
dperry 
Masters Student
Posts: 780
dperry
Loc: Oreland, PA
Reg: 11-24-04
03-09-17 08:55 PM - Post#225977    
    In response to bradley

  • bradley Said:
After a conversation last Saturday after the game, I believe more than ever that the primary reason for the IL Tournament is $$$.



Except that again, Robin Harris publicly disclaimed that last year. Like I said before, I think it's strictly that the other seven schools are afraid they'll never beat Harvard under the previous format.
David Perry
Penn '92
"Hail, Alma Mater/Thy sons cheer thee now
To thee, Pennsylvania/All rivals must bow!!!"


 
dperry 
Masters Student
Posts: 780
dperry
Loc: Oreland, PA
Reg: 11-24-04
03-09-17 09:01 PM - Post#225979    
    In response to SRP

  • SRP Said:
KenPom is offended by the tournament format screwing Princeton:

http://kenpom.com/blog/2017-ivy-league- tournament-...



Are they seriously trying to tell me that a team that went undefeated in the league and won by four games is less than 50-50 to win this thing?

Given the way the stats ended up, how many times out of 1000 would Princeton have won the regular season?
David Perry
Penn '92
"Hail, Alma Mater/Thy sons cheer thee now
To thee, Pennsylvania/All rivals must bow!!!"


 
SRP 
Postdoc
Posts: 3084

Reg: 02-04-06
03-09-17 10:11 PM - Post#225987    
    In response to dperry

Yes. Less than 50-50 (although close). Nipping a pretty good Harvard team twice does not cause the models to be especially optimistic.

 
TigerFan 
Masters Student
Posts: 871

Reg: 11-21-04
03-09-17 10:15 PM - Post#225988    
    In response to dperry

Give me a break. If this wasn't about making money, why are they charging $75 a ticket? Real "family friendly" there Robin!

 
Tiger69 
Postdoc
Posts: 2004

Reg: 11-23-04
03-09-17 10:56 PM - Post#225996    
    In response to TheLine

In your quacker dreams

 
HARVARDDADGRAD 
Masters Student
Posts: 808

Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
03-10-17 12:04 AM - Post#226005    
    In response to Mike Porter

Article extremely critical of playing the tournament at the Palestra:
http://sportzedge.com/2017/03/08/penns-pale stra-is...

"#4 seed Penn, with a losing record, is getting an undeserved home court advantage over the undefeated league champion, Princeton, This is a farce."

"Yes, the Palestra is historic and revered as a building. But if it is also a Cathedral, then it is Penn’s Cathedral, not Princeton’s, Harvard’s, Yale’s, or Brown’s, the other colleges that will be Penn’s guests. Since it is Penn’s Cathedral, then the Penn teams have the advantage in their games. Every team is more comfortable in its own “house of worship.”"


 
TheLine 
Postdoc
Posts: 3043

Age: 54
Reg: 07-07-09
03-10-17 08:58 AM - Post#226018    
    In response to HARVARDDADGRAD

Those critical of the Palestra neglect to point out how much better and bigger it is than any other arena in the league.

And if this amazingly great Princeton team can't beat a team with a losing record - in an arena where it's won over and over again - then how is it going to fare in the dance?

Think of it as a warm up.


 
bradley 
Masters Student
Posts: 479

Age: 68
Reg: 01-15-16
03-10-17 09:30 AM - Post#226019    
    In response to TheLine

Let's hope that it is not a "perfect storm" for the reputation and sake of the league. The introduction of the 4th team to a league tournament format based on past historical performance introduced an element of risk. Throw on top playing the initial game at the Palestra, Robin Wolfe and her merrymen added some further risk.

The good news is that ESPN on their website is showing Princeton as the home team based on their #1 seeding so maybe Weisz, Cook and crew can simply imagine.

Robin -- let's hope that you are getting some honest feedback. You need it.

 
TheLine 
Postdoc
Posts: 3043

Age: 54
Reg: 07-07-09
03-10-17 09:32 AM - Post#226020    
    In response to bradley

Think of the bright side - if you lose then you have a built in excuse that we can talk about for years!


 
bradley 
Masters Student
Posts: 479

Age: 68
Reg: 01-15-16
03-10-17 09:46 AM - Post#226022    
    In response to TheLine

Never thought of looking at it that way. Weisz and Cook can share the story with their grandchildren regarding the inaugural IL Tournament.

Rather than focusing on the negative, just think of the upside if Penn wins the IL Tournament and knocks off Gonzaga in the opening round. Robin and her merrymen will be delirious with joy with a simple "I told you so".

 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 15899

Reg: 11-21-04
Penn again
03-10-17 09:59 AM - Post#226024    
    In response to bradley

That's it! Princeton has nothing to complain about. They get to wear the home uniforms.

 
westphillywarrior 
Sophomore
Posts: 131

Age: 36
Reg: 01-08-11
03-10-17 10:18 AM - Post#226029    
    In response to bradley

You won't get much sympathy from the Penn fans after you lose tomorrow. Most of us have grown to love the tournament and having it at the Palestra.

So if Weisz and Cook never get to play an NCAA tournament game don't blame us. It was your coaches and administration that agreed to play this at the Palestra.

 
Tiger69 
Postdoc
Posts: 2004

Reg: 11-23-04
03-10-17 10:21 AM - Post#226031    
    In response to palestra38

No whining here. This is our "Deal with it!" moment.

But, after this year, whatever happens, never again!

 
TheLine 
Postdoc
Posts: 3043

Age: 54
Reg: 07-07-09
03-10-17 10:25 AM - Post#226033    
    In response to Tiger69

Given my proximity to Princeton I'm OK alternating between the Palestra and Jadwin.

You want the even or odd years?


 
Tiger69 
Postdoc
Posts: 2004

Reg: 11-23-04
03-10-17 10:38 AM - Post#226036    
    In response to TheLine

Neither. As my wife just said to me, "I thought that the Ivy League was supposed to be smart".

(She's worried about her Terps on the Big (how many?).

 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 15899

Reg: 11-21-04
03-10-17 10:42 AM - Post#226039    
    In response to Tiger69

You want a college basketball move done for the money? Maryland to the Big Whatever. Double the money of the ACC with none of the rivalries.

 
bradley 
Masters Student
Posts: 479

Age: 68
Reg: 01-15-16
03-10-17 11:41 AM - Post#226060    
    In response to SRP

I remember at Game #6 at the Palestra (90th Anniversary), the Quakers had difficulty getting off shots without time expiring. That day, it looked like "men against boys". Even in the warm ups, two Penn fans commented the Tigers are taller, stronger and more athletic.

Best strategy for the Tigers is to smother Penn defensively -- do not let them breathe. Gladson played too many minutes that night and Rothschild did exploit him. Penn's defense will probably force the Tigers to make 3 pointers.

Who knows what you get with the Penn team --- the team that beat Harvard or the one that lost to Dartmouth at home the night before. Tigers need to play confident yet incredibly intense and if they get the opportunity close them out as soon as you can unlike the first game at Jadwin.



 
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