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Username Post: Yale        (Topic#20114)
Go Green 
Junior
Posts: 261

Age: 46
Reg: 04-22-10
Re: Yale
03-22-17 02:29 PM - Post#227916    
    In response to Tiger69

  • Tiger69 Said:
The NIT bid is not worth potentially depriving the 14 game champ of a field of eight teams the NCAA bid in favor of a two game season winner over a field of four.





Every other one-bid league has lost its regular season champ to the NIT at some point, and survived. So will the Ivy when it happens to us.

You say you want to "improve" the tournament. You don't. Every "improvement" you suggest either:

Devalues the tournament (allow the winner to plead its case with the NIT)

Makes it more inconvenient for teams and fans (play semis on Friday night, and hightailing it to NYC on Saturday in early to mid-March in the Northeast...and you call Saturday a "rest" day).

Makes it more expensive for the league (rent a neutral court in NYC).

Limits "hobnobbing"/social events (breaking up venues).

I'm sorry, but these are not ways to "improve" the tournament. Whatever your suggestions will accomplish, they are aimed at the opposite goal.

Edited by Go Green on 03-22-17 02:30 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
Go Green 
Junior
Posts: 261

Age: 46
Reg: 04-22-10
03-22-17 02:33 PM - Post#227917    
    In response to sparman

  • sparman Said:

Perhaps you did not realize he was asking for OTHER opinions, yours having been stated so often.




Fine, I'll rephrase:

Pot, meet kettle.

 
Go Green 
Junior
Posts: 261

Age: 46
Reg: 04-22-10
03-22-17 02:43 PM - Post#227918    
    In response to Silver Maple

  • Silver Maple Said:


Stop considering the "fairness" factor. It's a nonissue for the decision makers.



Translation: the other seven told Princeton to suck it up and stop being such a chicken about playing at the Palestra.



 
Tiger69 
Postdoc
Posts: 2047

Reg: 11-23-04
03-22-17 02:53 PM - Post#227919    
    In response to Silver Maple

Ooooff. That hurt, SM. I promise not to cherry pick certain unmentionable Whart alums if you will promise the same about Tiger alums with whom some of us would prefer not to be lumped

 
Bill Lewis 
Junior
Posts: 240

Loc: Santa Cruz, CA
Reg: 12-23-04
Re: Yale
03-22-17 02:54 PM - Post#227920    
    In response to Go Green

Add to Go Green's list.

If ESPN doesn't compensate the league for the telecast, please disregard my comment below.

Multiple sites increases ESPN's production costs which decreases the revenue stream to the league.

 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 16045

Reg: 11-21-04
03-22-17 03:00 PM - Post#227921    
    In response to Silver Maple

Actually, SM, I slept well after that tough loss to Princeton in the playoff because I thought fairness won out. In my mind, Howard intentionally missed the FT that would have put away the game because Penn showed it had the game won but fairness dictated that Princeton be the NCAA rep.

Or maybe I dreamed that Joe Restic told me that.

 
Tiger69 
Postdoc
Posts: 2047

Reg: 11-23-04
03-22-17 03:02 PM - Post#227922    
    In response to Go Green

GG Let's just settle our differences on the bball court in a game of 21.

But, no matter how badly I lose (I'm 70, arthritic and clumsy to boot), I get to shoot one foul shot to WIN.

Fair enough?

 
bradley 
Masters Student
Posts: 488

Age: 68
Reg: 01-15-16
03-22-17 03:04 PM - Post#227923    
    In response to PennFan10

I understand that Dartmouth, Brown and Cornell fans might advocate for the IL Tournament even if they know that it is wrong deep down but there is another approach, i.e. like Northwestern -- hire two good coaches in a row and make a meaningful commitment to the basketball program. N/W gets rewarded after 72 years by EARNING IT -- congrats to N/W.

It is sad that Penn has to resort to a gimmick, IL Tournament at the Palestra, to try to get back to the NCAA Tournament. It says a lot about where the program has been for the last decade.

Suggestion: Man Up!

 
Tiger69 
Postdoc
Posts: 2047

Reg: 11-23-04
03-22-17 03:05 PM - Post#227924    
    In response to Go Green

PS. You must live in Philly, since any chance of your teams making, much less winning, either the M or W tourney for the next few years are pretty remote.

 
Go Green 
Junior
Posts: 261

Age: 46
Reg: 04-22-10
Yale
03-22-17 03:15 PM - Post#227925    
    In response to Tiger69

  • Tiger69 Said:
PS. You must live in Philly,



Nope.

I'm just an Ivy sports fan who, along with P38 and SM think that this is about branding and creating the most compelling entertainment product possible for the league. I've been arguing for a tournament ever since these Boards existed. I think the Palestra is a great venue and should be the permanent site for the tournament.

But if the league buys into Princeton's "this is so unfair" argument, and elects to hold it at The Bob, Detrick, or Rose Hill (the most viable neutral sites, IMHO), then I can live with that.

{Should also make clear that I'd be delighted to be wrong about my prediction that the league would go cheap on the neutral venue. If they secure a first-class arena, great! But that's not the way I see it playing out...)

And if this would give me credibility in your book, I own three Ivy League Championship rings.



Edited by Go Green on 03-22-17 03:23 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
westphillywarrior 
Sophomore
Posts: 138

Age: 36
Reg: 01-08-11
03-22-17 03:22 PM - Post#227926    
    In response to Tiger69

  • Tiger69 Said:
PS. You must live in Philly, since any chance of your teams making, much less winning, either the M or W tourney for the next few years are pretty remote.



Not only lives in Philly. Works in the Penn Athletic Department.

Silver Maple says:
"Stop considering the "fairness" factor. It's a nonissue for the decision makers."

It sounds like you you think that Amaker, Jones and Henderson will have no say in the future of the tournament.
And that all they are going to care about is entertainment value.


 
Silver Maple 
Postdoc
Posts: 2872

Loc: Westfield, New Jersey
Reg: 11-23-04
03-22-17 03:43 PM - Post#227927    
    In response to westphillywarrior

I would definitely say that. I seriously doubt the Presidents and ADs give a damn what the coaches think. They've certainly never done anything in the past to indicate otherwise.

 
Silver Maple 
Postdoc
Posts: 2872

Loc: Westfield, New Jersey
Reg: 11-23-04
03-22-17 03:47 PM - Post#227928    
    In response to bradley

  • bradley Said:
It is sad that Penn has to resort to a gimmick, IL Tournament at the Palestra, to try to get back to the NCAA Tournament. It says a lot about where the program has been for the last decade.



Sorry. I must have missed something. Since when has Penn 'resorted' to anything? Do you seriously think having a tournament was Penn's decision? If so, you have no understanding whatsoever as to how our conference works.

 
Old Bear 
Postdoc
Posts: 3274

Reg: 11-23-04
03-22-17 03:51 PM - Post#227929    
    In response to Silver Maple

I doubt the Presidents give a rat's butt about the tournament or the cost. I suspect the ADs and the Coaches think more about fairness than branding.

 
westphillywarrior 
Sophomore
Posts: 138

Age: 36
Reg: 01-08-11
03-22-17 04:42 PM - Post#227930    
    In response to Old Bear

  • Old Bear Said:
I doubt the Presidents give a rat's butt about the tournament or the cost. I suspect the ADs and the Coaches think more about fairness than branding.



I suspect you're right, Old Bear. Call it fairness or as HARVARDDADGRAD calls it, "competitive integrity". It's unfair to Robin Harris to say that she is going to care more about "branding". Let's see what happens. I think they're going to find an appropriate neutral site.



 
mrjames 
Postdoc
Posts: 4730

Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
03-22-17 05:16 PM - Post#227932    
    In response to Silver Maple

The ADs care. And I'd bet that's why the tourney doesn't end up at The Palestra next year.

 
PennFan10 
PhD Student
Posts: 1045

Reg: 02-15-15
03-22-17 05:45 PM - Post#227935    
    In response to mrjames

I bet it is at the Palestra next year. That's what I am hearing. I could be wrong, but I think there is an undercurrent that believes the branding of the IL tourney is most attractive to partners like ESPN and others, at an historic venue like the Palestra

 
SRP 
Postdoc
Posts: 3114

Reg: 02-04-06
03-22-17 07:48 PM - Post#227937    
    In response to PennFan10

Put it on a ship like some of those early-season tourneys. Moor it in the preferred harbor or river based either on rotation, travel convenience to the four teams, or favoring the league champion. If you set up a good sailing schedule to a warm place beforehand, you could get some vacationers to make a holiday of it.

 
Old Bear 
Postdoc
Posts: 3274

Reg: 11-23-04
03-22-17 08:31 PM - Post#227938    
    In response to SRP

Well finally, SRP, you have changes my mind. Let's have the Tourney in Cancun or Daytona Beach during Spring Break! We will have maximum student participation, though may maybe not attendance. Let's add Ft. Lauderdale to the list for the older alums. Better yet, So. Cal. so T69 can host us all.

 
Tiger69 
Postdoc
Posts: 2047

Reg: 11-23-04
03-22-17 08:37 PM - Post#227939    
    In response to SRP

The ILDN ads are about as much institutional "branding" as I can take! Reasonably informative and tasteful, but really repetitive. But, does the Ivy League really need to market itself to a bunch of bracketologists who sound barely bright enough to pack groceries? Ivy sports, I naively believed, were supposed to be for students, not marketing opportunities for the universities. I'm all for tournaments and such if that is what the players (students who play athletics) want. But, cut the snake oil, huckstering and branding talk. Who are these games supposed to be for, anyway? I hope not for the benefit of the ESPNs or John Feinsteins (he's from Dook, no?). They are welcome to watch and write about our sports. But, if they try to set the agenda for us, we need to get them straight on priorities. Otherwise, they can bug off.

 
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