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Username Post: Lions Trail Tigers by 18 at halftime        (Topic#20974)
Columbia 37P6 
PhD Student
Posts: 1534

Reg: 02-14-06
01-12-18 10:04 PM - Post#243297    

A nightmare start for the Lions in Ivy League play as they trail Princeton by eighteen points at halftime 41-23. Columbia did some incredibly bad things in the first half such as letting their second best player, Lukas Meisner pick up two fouls in the first ninety seconds of action. That resulted, of course, in Coach Engles benching Meisner for the first fifteen minutes of the game. Meisner finally came back on the floor with about five minutes remaining in the half, but looked lost. In fact, the Lions as a team seemed unsure of what to do on both offense and defense. If there was a coaching strategy, I missed it. Unless some of the players step up and give the team some sort of personalty, this is going to be a dreadful season

 
Columbia 37P6 
PhD Student
Posts: 1534

Reg: 02-14-06
Lions Trail Tigers by 18 at halftime
01-12-18 11:40 PM - Post#243351    
    In response to Columbia 37P6

And the Lions ultimately fall 72-56 in a blowout loss to Princeton. This game was over within the first two minutes when Meisner committed two personal fouls and was benched for most of the first half. I'm not saying that the Lions would have defeated Princeton with Meisner on the floor, but that had to be the game plan. Obviously, there was no back up plan. This Columbia squad is still struggling to find an identity. If I were Engles, I would try something altogether different from what he has been doing all season. I would start Patrick Tape at center/low post with Jaron Faulds at forward/high post, and Smith, Adlesh and Castlin at the guards. Having two very talented 6'10" players on the floor simultaneously will give the Lions a huge height advantage over all the teams they will face in the Ivy League this season. Moreover, they both seem to like playing near the basket, which is not the case with Meisner. Engles could devise a nice offense with Smith, Adlesh and Castlin driving to the basket and if defended, passing off to Faulds and Tape. On defense, having two mobile 6'10" players on the floor simultaneously has many clear advantages. Also, I would give that line-up plenty of playing time. Nothing has worked for the Lions so far, so why not try Faulds and Tape together.

Edited by Columbia 37P6 on 01-13-18 12:01 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
Chet Forte 
Postdoc
Posts: 2005

Reg: 03-02-08
01-13-18 08:33 AM - Post#243381    
    In response to Columbia 37P6

So that is going to be the game plan, go after Meisner and get him off the court. Let’s see if Engles can figure this one out. In any event, this feels like Dunkirk at this point. I have a pretty good idea that Kyle Smith would have had a better game plan and that this team would have been a lot better with him.


 
Columbia 37P6 
PhD Student
Posts: 1534

Reg: 02-14-06
01-13-18 10:44 AM - Post#243390    
    In response to Chet Forte

Interesting analogy to Dunkirk and understandable reference to Kyle Smith. However, my suggestion is NOT to get Meisner "off the Court," but rather shift him to the outside where he obviously belongs. Yes, Kyle would certainly have done that by now. And, I DO see Meisner starting along with Tape, Faulds, Castlin and Mike Smith. Meisner is about the same height as Alex Rosenberg, but not as skilled. Alex could drive to the basket and score, I'm not sure about Meisner. If Engles goes with a starting line-up of Faulds, Tape, Mesiner, Castlin and Mike Smith, then Adlesh and Hickman would be the first options off the bench in the backcourt, Brumant and Hanson, the first options off the bench in the frontcourt and Stefanini, Barba and Bibbs (where was he last night?) seeing action behind them. If anyone has a better idea, I would be interested, but Engles must do something now to stop the bleeding.

 
Chet Forte 
Postdoc
Posts: 2005

Reg: 03-02-08
01-13-18 12:36 PM - Post#243400    
    In response to Columbia 37P6

I like the suggestion. And I am high on Meisner, always have been. I just don’t think he is either being coached up or is making mistakes on defense. My concern is that we may have overrated Engles because of his success at NJIT, where he was able to recruit super athletic kids who didn’t need as much coaching since they played a run and gun game. Ever since the midway mark of the Ivy season last year, however, everybody seem to know how to play us.


 
TheLine 
Postdoc
Posts: 3599

Age: 54
Reg: 07-07-09
01-13-18 12:38 PM - Post#243401    
    In response to Columbia 37P6

I think Chet means that the other team is going to target Meisner as part of their offensive strategy.

Which makes sense.

Agree with your starting lineup.


 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 18068

Reg: 11-21-04
01-13-18 12:50 PM - Post#243402    
    In response to Chet Forte

I think you are mistaken that Engles, at a school in Newark with no conference affiliation at the time, was able to recruit "super athletic" athletes. He did work miracles there. Whether that will transpire at CU as well is something you can't tell in year 2, where he has his first class of recruits. In 2 years you can tell if you're on the right or wrong track.

 
TheLine 
Postdoc
Posts: 3599

Age: 54
Reg: 07-07-09
Lions Trail Tigers by 18 at halftime
01-13-18 12:55 PM - Post#243403    
    In response to palestra38

I'd disagree in that you're implying there was some sort of problem with the quality of player Smith was recruiting. There wasn't.

I don't think Engles is the same quality of coach as Smith. Particularly the Smith-Hartman combo. Hartman was a fabulous assistant.


 
Dr. V 
PhD Student
Posts: 1393

Reg: 11-21-04
01-13-18 12:56 PM - Post#243404    
    In response to TheLine

I was at the game and this morning watched part of the tape. As it seems it has forever, Princeton simply has a much larger number of good shooters, so it probably would have won because of that. But then almost everything that could have gone wrong did for us. Meisner is the league's top rebounder and a very good 3-pt shooter. Losing him for almost the entire first half was a killer. Mike's having an off night obviously also hurt.

We played hard, we played smart and we defended. Almost all of the stats, except for shooting, even out: they had a slight rebounding edge 39 to 35, but personal fouls were even 16 to 17, they committed more TOs than we did, 15 to our 9, and we had 9 steals to their 4.

Some of the comments about Kyle and Jim are silly. Kyle recruited the second, third and fourth years on our team. We have far too many players who can't shoot. Princeton outshot us 47.7 to 21.2 in the first half, and 48.4 to 21.4 in three point shooting. Now part of that has to do with that damn hanger Princeton calls a gym, but part of that is simply that we lack enough good shooters. You can recruit but you can't coach shooting.

 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 18068

Reg: 11-21-04
01-13-18 12:59 PM - Post#243406    
    In response to TheLine

I was making no comment about Smith--I was commenting on Engles' job at NJIT and whether it is fair to judge him at this point.

 
Chet Forte 
Postdoc
Posts: 2005

Reg: 03-02-08
01-13-18 01:17 PM - Post#243409    
    In response to palestra38

Yes, to be clear, I meant that everybody we play is going to drive on Meisner and try to get him in early foul trouble. So the coaches have to come up with a scheme to help him out. When we had Colin Hartman, we had somebody who knew how to coach big men.


 
SRP 
Postdoc
Posts: 3494

Reg: 02-04-06
01-13-18 04:37 PM - Post#243414    
    In response to Chet Forte

I don't think anyone expected Meisner to commit those early fouls or ran action to induce them. He's just foul-prone.

 
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