SRP
Postdoc
Posts: 4911
Reg: 02-04-06
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01-28-18 03:08 PM - Post#245003
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
Amaker's early teams' best skill was FT shooting. Funny how that is not a program-stable characteristic. Everybody bounces around.
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weinhauers_ghost
Postdoc
Posts: 2138
Age: 64
Loc: New York City
Reg: 12-14-09
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Re: NCAA potential changes
01-28-18 06:41 PM - Post#245024
In response to Cvonvorys
No coincidence. I've never liked the intentional foul at the end of games or the hard foul to prevent an easy basket.
If you hate the hard foul to prevent an easy basket, you must really hate the way teams in international play will foul just to prevent a fast break. It's a tactic I wish would go away.
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dperry
Postdoc
Posts: 2214
Loc: Houston, TX
Reg: 11-24-04
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 01-28-18 07:29 PM - Post#245026
In response to SteveChop
As long as they want to change rules, I'd LOVE to see a rule change to avoid last minute(s) foul shooting contests. Beginning with the 10th foul, let the team who is fouled elect to either retain possession (with 20 seconds to shoot) or shoot the free throws. Stop Hack-a-Shaq/Quaker/etc.
I've got a really radical idea; maybe players could learn to make completely uncontested 15-footers. 
David Perry
Penn '92
"Hail, Alma Mater/Thy sons cheer thee now
To thee, Pennsylvania/All rivals must bow!!!" |
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Cvonvorys
Postdoc
Posts: 4473
Loc: Princeton, New Jersey
Reg: 10-11-06
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01-28-18 08:03 PM - Post#245030
In response to dperry
While we're talking rule changes, I'd like to add a 4-point shot beyond mid-court and a 10-point shot if you can bank the ball off your opponent's head. Forget the end-of-game foul strategy. Teams would instead focus on learning how to fire the ball at the opponent's head.
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dperry
Postdoc
Posts: 2214
Loc: Houston, TX
Reg: 11-24-04
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Re: NCAA potential changes
01-28-18 08:30 PM - Post#245033
In response to weinhauers_ghost
No coincidence. I've never liked the intentional foul at the end of games or the hard foul to prevent an easy basket.
If you hate the hard foul to prevent an easy basket, you must really hate the way teams in international play will foul just to prevent a fast break. It's a tactic I wish would go away.
This I do agree with; breakaway fouls need to get called a lot more often.
David Perry
Penn '92
"Hail, Alma Mater/Thy sons cheer thee now
To thee, Pennsylvania/All rivals must bow!!!" |
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mrjames
Professor
Posts: 6062
Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
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01-28-18 09:18 PM - Post#245039
In response to dperry
Wouldn’t this just lead to an endless set of inbounds plays? If I make a shot to go down 3 with 30 seconds left, rather than being able to send someone to the line, I’m going to try to steal the inbounds. Then foul. Then try to steal the inbounds. Then foul: Essentially the rest of the game becomes a series of inbounds plays rather than a free throw contest.
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penn nation
Professor
Posts: 21193
Reg: 12-02-04
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01-28-18 09:59 PM - Post#245040
In response to mrjames
The Penn women's basketball team found out the hard way about this last year.
Wouldn’t this just lead to an endless set of inbounds plays? If I make a shot to go down 3 with 30 seconds left, rather than being able to send someone to the line, I’m going to try to steal the inbounds. Then foul. Then try to steal the inbounds. Then foul: Essentially the rest of the game becomes a series of inbounds plays rather than a free throw contest.
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13otto
Masters Student
Posts: 779
Loc: Philadelphia, PA
Reg: 11-22-04
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01-28-18 10:23 PM - Post#245042
In response to penn nation
How about if once a team is in the double bonus (10 fouls), the opposition can elect to shoot the first free throw, then inbound the ball in lieu of shooting the second free throw.
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weinhauers_ghost
Postdoc
Posts: 2138
Age: 64
Loc: New York City
Reg: 12-14-09
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01-28-18 10:38 PM - Post#245046
In response to 13otto
How about if once a team is in the double bonus (10 fouls), the opposition can elect to shoot the first free throw, then inbound the ball in lieu of shooting the second free throw.
I think most coaches would rather have the FT opportunity.
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13otto
Masters Student
Posts: 779
Loc: Philadelphia, PA
Reg: 11-22-04
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01-28-18 10:50 PM - Post#245047
In response to weinhauers_ghost
How about if once a team is in the double bonus (10 fouls), the opposition can elect to shoot the first free throw, then inbound the ball in lieu of shooting the second free throw.
I think most coaches would rather have the FT opportunity.
Then those coaches would elect to shoot the second free throw. They’d have the option.
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SRP
Postdoc
Posts: 4911
Reg: 02-04-06
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01-28-18 11:46 PM - Post#245051
In response to 13otto
Solution: Bring back the jump ball after each score in the last two minutes.
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weinhauers_ghost
Postdoc
Posts: 2138
Age: 64
Loc: New York City
Reg: 12-14-09
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01-29-18 01:47 PM - Post#245079
In response to SRP
Solution: Bring back the jump ball after each score in the last two minutes.
I actually hate the alternating possession rule that penalizes the defense for held ball situations. I would love to go back to the jump ball there.
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palestra38
Professor
Posts: 32809
Reg: 11-21-04
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NCAA potential changes
01-29-18 01:56 PM - Post#245081
In response to weinhauers_ghost
You forget the controversy that resulted from 5'6" guys tossing a ball up to 2 guys a foot or more taller--it's never "fair." I suggest a "steal the bacon" play where both guys stand on the baseline and at the whistle, run to the ball on the center stripe--as soon as it is touched the ball is in play.
(just joking--I am fine with alternate possession, but someone will take me seriously here)
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HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2691
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
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01-29-18 02:10 PM - Post#245084
In response to palestra38
My 5'9" grandfather played professionally before the NBA and used to tell me about things like a jump ball after every made basket.
From the way he described the game then, maybe a rugby scrum is an alternative.
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mrjames
Professor
Posts: 6062
Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
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01-29-18 03:09 PM - Post#245087
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
Really depends on what you're trying to solve for here. Usually, it's deemed that variance is exciting, so solutions that tend to turn the end of a basketball game into the end of a football game (up to 2 minutes of kneeling) are generally eschewed.
That kills ideas like a last two-minute bonus override where there can only be one 1-and-1 in the final two mins before two shots for every foul. Or making excess double-bonus fouls in the final two minutes a three-shot foul, etc. Problem is that those have a huge impact on variance and make the end of games less exciting.
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palestra38
Professor
Posts: 32809
Reg: 11-21-04
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01-29-18 03:24 PM - Post#245088
In response to mrjames
What I think everyone wants is an end of game that looks like the rest of the game. Basketball is the only sport which drastically changes in the last minutes to encourage penalties. Football does not allow intentional penalties to stop a clock (there is a runoff of time and the clock starts again), hockey strategy changes but it is still hockey and baseball is always baseball because there is no clock.
But the intentional fouls and foul shooting contest is just not a good ending.
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penn nation
Professor
Posts: 21193
Reg: 12-02-04
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01-29-18 03:46 PM - Post#245095
In response to palestra38
Actually the baseball strategy changes dramatically in the later innings, especially in the NL. Pitchers, batters, fielders and runners are replaced and all kinds of visits to the mound are de rigeur.
It considerably slows the pace of play--if the same pace of play was maintained during the whole game, everyone would be happier.
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palestra38
Professor
Posts: 32809
Reg: 11-21-04
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01-29-18 04:00 PM - Post#245099
In response to penn nation
It's still baseball. No one is throwing at someone's head on purpose--if anything, that decreases at crunch time.
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SteveChop
PhD Student
Posts: 1154
Reg: 07-28-07
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01-29-18 09:40 PM - Post#245118
In response to 13otto
I'd be fine with this as an alternative to my suggestion. It's going to depend on who the defense fouls, a good FT shooter or a poor one. While Mike could be correct that from time to time, a series of inbounds plays would occur, if the leading team is shooting one free throw each time, at some point they will extend their lead and the trailing team may choose to play defense even though they may lose some clock time.
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westphillywarrior
Sophomore
Posts: 196
Age: 43
Reg: 01-08-11
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01-30-18 12:11 AM - Post#245125
In response to mrjames
Really depends on what you're trying to solve for here. Usually, it's deemed that variance is exciting, so solutions that tend to turn the end of a basketball game into the end of a football game (up to 2 minutes of kneeling) are generally eschewed.
That kills ideas like a last two-minute bonus override where there can only be one 1-and-1 in the final two mins before two shots for every foul. Or making excess double-bonus fouls in the final two minutes a three-shot foul, etc. Problem is that those have a huge impact on variance and make the end of games less exciting.
If we really want to pump up the variance and the excitement while cutting down on fouls, start the shot clock at 25 seconds at the 3 minute mark and 20 seconds at 2 minutes and 15 seconds at 1 minute.
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