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Username Post: Pennsylvania        (Topic#21111)
Eric Von Zipper 
Freshman
Posts: 69

Age: 65
Reg: 11-11-17
02-05-18 10:46 PM - Post#246320    

Opens Princeton -5

 
SRP 
Postdoc
Posts: 3500

Reg: 02-04-06
02-06-18 02:36 AM - Post#246323    
    In response to Eric Von Zipper

This Penn team is kind of balanced with no single glaring weakness or single overwhelming strength, so the key (besides playing hard the whole time) is going to be making good decisions on both sides of the ball. Got to make the wrong guys take shots from the wrong places for Penn, which I think will require enough ball pressure and overplaying to break up their passing combinations. If no zoning up, make them go one on one against Bell and Stephens and don't let Rothschild be a distributor like he was last time.

 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 18283

Reg: 11-21-04
02-06-18 07:15 AM - Post#246325    
    In response to SRP

In game one, the two Penn big men were a significant strength vis-a-vis Princeton. Penn has been more guard oriented recently, but in terms of matchups, I look for Penn again to take it consistently inside until Princeton stops it.

 
bradley 
Masters Student
Posts: 779

Age: 69
Reg: 01-15-16
02-06-18 10:53 AM - Post#246351    
    In response to SRP

Penn is certainly a better defensive team and the Tigers are a better shooting team in all areas. Defense normally beats offense unless you are Brown/Cambridge. As stated prior tothe game at the Palestra, the Penn match ups by position is an issue for the Tigers with two bigs that are reasonably good. It would be surprising if Coach Donahue changes his strategy with Rothschild on Stepens which was the key to the first game. I believe that Penn presents more issues than Harvard based on the balance of the team on offense. Penn is a good, well coached team, but not a great team.

With that being said, the Tigers have the opportunity to get right back into the race tonight by increasing the quality and intensity on the defensive end. Burden is on Henderson to alter the strategy from the first game although the last 10 minutes at the Palestra suggested how to attack Penn's defense.

Odds makers obviously think that the Tigers will step even factoring the impact of home court. I would imagine that the big 3 and others will play very hard this evening -- let's hope.



 
Tiger69 
Postdoc
Posts: 2254

Reg: 11-23-04
02-06-18 11:33 AM - Post#246356    
    In response to bradley

No matter who wins, this game signifies the return to the old order of Ps dominance. Penn is finally stable, well-coached and luring better talent again. Princeton over the past few years has upped its level of recruits as its image has changed. The big difference from 20 years ago is that most of the other Ivies have also lured enough good coaches and blue chippers to threaten Ps dominance. Key will be if teams like Brown will be able to hang on to good coaches after they have proved themselves.

 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 18283

Reg: 11-21-04
02-06-18 11:35 AM - Post#246357    
    In response to Tiger69

There is no sure win in the League anymore---you have to give your best effort every night to win.

 
T.P.F.K.A.D.W. 
Masters Student
Posts: 817

Loc: Our Nation's Capital
Reg: 01-18-05
Re: Pennsylvania
02-06-18 12:18 PM - Post#246364    
    In response to Eric Von Zipper

  • Eric Von Zipper Said:
Opens Princeton -5


By the way, props to you for referring to us by the right and proper moniker "Pennsylvania."



 
penn nation 
Professor
Posts: 11225

Reg: 12-02-04
Re: Pennsylvania
02-06-18 12:28 PM - Post#246365    
    In response to T.P.F.K.A.D.W.

Next step: Let's work on the jerseys.

  • T.P.F.K.A.D.W. Said:
  • Eric Von Zipper Said:
Opens Princeton -5


By the way, props to you for referring to us by the right and proper moniker "Pennsylvania."






 
10Q 
Professor
Posts: 14038

Loc: Suburban Philly
Reg: 11-21-04
02-06-18 05:23 PM - Post#246429    
    In response to penn nation

I'm thinking Caleb and Sam hold the key to this game. Princeton is going to tighten up down low and tempt our 3 shooters in the Hangar. If we can hit the 3 at a decent rate, we should be good. Maybe Jackson gets a good look too.

 
penn nation 
Professor
Posts: 11225

Reg: 12-02-04
02-06-18 05:27 PM - Post#246430    
    In response to 10Q

  • 10Q Said:
I'm thinking Caleb and Sam hold the key to this game. Princeton is going to tighten up down low and tempt our 3 shooters in the Hangar. If we can hit the 3 at a decent rate, we should be good. Maybe Jackson gets a good look too.



Then Betley is the key. He did great in the first half when Princeton tightened up down low. Then when Princeton shifted gears our bigs came through. Princeton can't concentrate on all 3 players at the same time. Our depth and balance is our greatest strength this year.


 
10Q 
Professor
Posts: 14038

Loc: Suburban Philly
Reg: 11-21-04
02-06-18 05:41 PM - Post#246433    
    In response to penn nation

Betley is going to get his usual looks. It's the other guys who will be open an unusual amount.

 
Silver Maple 
Postdoc
Posts: 3202

Loc: Westfield, New Jersey
Reg: 11-23-04
02-06-18 06:03 PM - Post#246438    
    In response to 10Q

One of the big reasons Penn has been winning games this year (including the Princeton game at the Palestra) that last year's team would have lost, is that they've finally learned to exploit opportunities created when opposing defenses key on Brodeur and Betley. If they can continue to do that tonight, Penn has an excellent shot at winning this thing.

 
bradley 
Masters Student
Posts: 779

Age: 69
Reg: 01-15-16
02-06-18 06:37 PM - Post#246443    
    In response to Tiger69

Brennan has returned and may be needed. Morales in warm ups - getting close to be playing. As a group Tigers are taller and more athletic than Penn. Should be a good one. Xanadu and Stephens have on their game faces.

 
jeromelh 
Freshman
Posts: 37

Age: 75
Reg: 03-30-17
02-06-18 07:19 PM - Post#246477    
    In response to bradley

The problem for Princeton has been and continues to be Defense and lack of movement resulting in a lot of 1 on 1 moves.

 
Vonsid 
Freshman
Posts: 58

Age: 50
Reg: 03-12-16
02-06-18 07:37 PM - Post#246504    
    In response to jeromelh

I am not liking Gladson in the rotation personally. He isn't improving as I would expect.

 
TigerFan 
PhD Student
Posts: 1130

Reg: 11-21-04
02-06-18 07:40 PM - Post#246508    
    In response to Vonsid

Bad switch by Penn has 6-10 Gladson against 6-1 Foreman. What does he do? Fade away hook! Come on Will!

 
Vonsid 
Freshman
Posts: 58

Age: 50
Reg: 03-12-16
02-06-18 07:47 PM - Post#246531    
    In response to TigerFan

Princeton defense looks pretty bad.

 
Vonsid 
Freshman
Posts: 58

Age: 50
Reg: 03-12-16
02-06-18 07:50 PM - Post#246537    
    In response to Vonsid

Mentally not in the game. Some really dumb fouls.

 
TigerFan 
PhD Student
Posts: 1130

Reg: 11-21-04
02-06-18 07:52 PM - Post#246541    
    In response to Vonsid

Sorry but that’s one of the dumbest plays I have ever seen: 1 sec on the shot clock with Penn pinned to half court line and Devon fouls him. What the? Tigers are playing like they all have the flu or something.

 
bradley 
Masters Student
Posts: 779

Age: 69
Reg: 01-15-16
02-06-18 07:55 PM - Post#246545    
    In response to TigerFan

Played poorly but came back from the dead. Defense did improve but rebounding is Achilles. Let Bell take it to the hoop.

 
Tiger84 
Freshman
Posts: 31

Age: 55
Reg: 03-06-17
02-06-18 08:06 PM - Post#246549    
    In response to bradley

Penn +2 on offensive boards at the half. Feels like more.

 
TigerFan 
PhD Student
Posts: 1130

Reg: 11-21-04
Pennsylvania
02-06-18 08:18 PM - Post#246562    
    In response to Tiger84

Princeton continues to be sievelike on defense and all hero ball on offense. Really hard for this 40+ year Tiger fan to like this team. So much potential, so little performance. And little effort tonight. At the his point, I hope they have the flu and it’s not just a complete lack of basketball fundamentals.

Edited by TigerFan on 02-06-18 08:19 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
TigerFan 
PhD Student
Posts: 1130

Reg: 11-21-04
02-06-18 08:21 PM - Post#246569    
    In response to TigerFan

Mitch being thoroughly out-coached tonight. Penn has a nice team but this is ugly basketball

 
TigerFan 
PhD Student
Posts: 1130

Reg: 11-21-04
02-06-18 08:47 PM - Post#246608    
    In response to TigerFan

Tigers need to try something different on D. 1-3-1? Full court trap? They just can’t guard well enough playing straight up.

 
1LotteryPick1969 
PhD Student
Posts: 1477
1LotteryPick1969
Age: 67
Loc: Baltimore, Maryland
Reg: 11-21-04
02-06-18 09:11 PM - Post#246649    
    In response to TigerFan

Total beat down. They had better conceived and better executed offensive and defensive schemes.

But the ultimate weak link is our interior defense.

 
Chip Bayers 
Postdoc
Posts: 4680
Chip Bayers
Loc: New York
Reg: 11-21-04
02-06-18 09:17 PM - Post#246657    
    In response to TigerFan

  • TigerFan Said:
Tigers need to try something different on D. 1-3-1? Full court trap? They just can’t guard well enough playing straight up.



They did try a 1-3-1 on a couple possessions late in the first half, got burned on the second of those, and never went back to it.


 
bradley 
Masters Student
Posts: 779

Age: 69
Reg: 01-15-16
02-06-18 09:32 PM - Post#246662    
    In response to TigerFan

Penn obviously deserved to win. Other than Bell, they got almost every loose ball. They kept their offense going by keeping the ball alive with tap outs. Their offense kept moving the ball for open men while Tigers offense was stagnant.

Cannady was riding the bike at half time and looked like he was in discomfort.

At this point, I might simply play Arirguzoh, Much and DesRosiers rather than Gladson, Brennan and LeBlanc. Maybe, take some lumps but let the young guys get action. Arirguzoh and DesRosiers bring energy to the court and they need it badly.

Last year, there was a debate as to which IL team is the best team based on some type of statistical measurement vs. wins/losses. Answer is always the same and Penn right now is 6-0.

 
Eric Von Zipper 
Freshman
Posts: 69

Age: 65
Reg: 11-11-17
02-06-18 09:46 PM - Post#246665    
    In response to bradley

"You are what your record says you are."

 
penn nation 
Professor
Posts: 11225

Reg: 12-02-04
02-06-18 09:47 PM - Post#246666    
    In response to bradley

I had wondered how Cannady would fare tonight. He looked hurt on Saturday night and was also riding the bike (although later played exceptionally well down the stretch).

He had an off game tonight although darned if he didn't give it his all--making some huge tap outs over bigger defenders to keep possessions alive.

 
gokinsmen 
Postdoc
Posts: 2602

Reg: 02-06-10
Pennsylvania
02-06-18 10:16 PM - Post#246675    
    In response to penn nation

Thank God for the Ivy Tourney. Season would be over otherwise. Just get it together and show up for that big weekend. The talent is there...the energy and polish are not right now. They got rusty and/or complacent over the break.

Hope Cannady is alright...lord knows we need him. I think riding a bike between stints is a remedy for back tightness, but I could be wrong about that.

 
TigerFan 
PhD Student
Posts: 1130

Reg: 11-21-04
02-06-18 10:20 PM - Post#246677    
    In response to penn nation

We’ll have to see how they do next weekend but Penn is earning home court for the you know what.

Tigers have some serious soul searching to do.

 
SRP 
Postdoc
Posts: 3500

Reg: 02-04-06
02-07-18 05:28 AM - Post#246688    
    In response to TigerFan

Just had a chance to watch it on replay after shielding myself from information about the score. That sucked.

Everybody on the team got backed down in the post, and there was no help because of the fear of outside shooting. Slightly baffled that Aririguzoh didn't get a turn in the barrel. Why do the Tigers not play to force turnovers? Opponents are already shooting the lights out, so there is little to lose from gambling a bit to get them out of rhythm. The 1-3-1 did okay, but it disappeared quickly.

Stephens, Bell, and Cannady played hard, but not always well, committing a lot of mental mistakes. Way too many offensive turnovers from dribbling into traffic, not enough passing to move the defense. I wouldn't mind some stagger screens being run for Cannady to free him up off the ball, like they used to run for Clay Wilson. Much was a mixed bag, getting abused defensively, committing some offensive mistakes, but making a few timely shots along the way.

But this game was not really about the Xs and Os. The Tigers started off looking rattled in the first five minutes, calmed down a bit through the middle of the game, then came unglued again late in the second half. They got beat to a lot of 50-50 balls, they got pushed around, they were a beat slow on play after play. Confidence and aggressiveness just weren't there.

This group needs to have a team meeting or something to figure out how they are going to salvage their season and make it one they enjoy looking back on.

 
1LotteryPick1969 
PhD Student
Posts: 1477
1LotteryPick1969
Age: 67
Loc: Baltimore, Maryland
Reg: 11-21-04
02-07-18 06:59 AM - Post#246689    
    In response to SRP

The offense consists of:

Receive the ball on the perimeter.
Pump fake.
Peer inside, think about dribble penetration.
Then pass to the next open man, even if he has to back-pedal to get open.
Repeat.
Randomly dribble into the lane after the pump fake.
Generally lose the ball when a helping defender swipes at it, or make a bad pass. Unless you are Amir Bell or Myles Stephens, who occasionally make it to the rim.

The ball movement on the perimeter seems to occur without a goal.

I guess this is what happens when you don't run "plays"; just read and react.

 
Streamers 
Postdoc
Posts: 2327
Streamers
Loc: NW Philadelphia
Reg: 11-21-04
Re: Pennsylvania
02-07-18 10:12 AM - Post#246701    
    In response to penn nation

  • penn nation Said:
Next step: Let's work on the jerseys.

  • T.P.F.K.A.D.W. Said:
  • Eric Von Zipper Said:
Opens Princeton -5


By the way, props to you for referring to us by the right and proper moniker "Pennsylvania."







Hurrah, Hurrah, PENNSYLVANIA!


 
bradley 
Masters Student
Posts: 779

Age: 69
Reg: 01-15-16
02-07-18 03:15 PM - Post#246763    
    In response to SRP

Major Differences last year to this year.
1. Spencer Weisz passing to open 3 pt shooters.
2. Spencer and Steven Cook -- Leadership
3. Cook's defense
4. Miller's interior defense when needed

No matter had talented the freshmen are or no matter what the stats say, the Tigers are a work-in-progress. I feel bad for Bell as he has given it his all but it is tough to compensate for losing two first team IL players.



 
Cvonvorys 
PhD Student
Posts: 1996

Loc: Princeton, New Jersey
Reg: 10-11-06
02-07-18 03:35 PM - Post#246765    
    In response to bradley

Major differences last year vs. this year:

1) Last year when Princeton needed a defensive stop, they would shut down the other team.

2) Last year when Princeton needed to score, they would score.

Bottom line... It really didn't matter what the score was early on, because come crunch time, Princeton would ratchet up the D and hit the big shots and win the game.


 
SRP 
Postdoc
Posts: 3500

Reg: 02-04-06
02-07-18 03:39 PM - Post#246766    
    In response to bradley

Cannady looking a bit nicked up isn't helping either.

Having watched every game but one this year, I have to say that regardless of the numbers I've felt best about this team when Aririguzoh is on the floor. He gives the best post defense (often staying a foot away from the offensive player's body while keeping his arms up and threatening a block) and I like his passing out of the post and offensive rebounding.

I generally don't understand why the lineups and style that were successful on the West Coast swing have disappeared. Young has been OK, but Schweiger is the only guy who consistently cuts to the rim with authority. Leblanc has been OK, but we hardly see the red-hot Desrosiers.

And last night confirmed my feelings about the extreme one-on-one offensive style. It can work against a Brown, but not consistently against good defensive teams. Harvard may be even better on D than Penn (although with an aggressive style that may allow one-on-one drives a bit more), so the Tigers might want to think about playing more through the post, kicking the ball to the weak side, etc.

 
Silver Maple 
Postdoc
Posts: 3202

Loc: Westfield, New Jersey
Reg: 11-23-04
02-07-18 04:10 PM - Post#246773    
    In response to Cvonvorys

  • Cvonvorys Said:
Major differences last year vs. this year:

1) Last year when Princeton needed a defensive stop, they would shut down the other team.

2) Last year when Princeton needed to score, they would score.

Bottom line... It really didn't matter what the score was early on, because come crunch time, Princeton would ratchet up the D and hit the big shots and win the game.




Here's a nice little add: you can substitute "Penn" for "Princeton" in the above passage, and it totally describes this year's Penn team.

 
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