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Username Post: Attendance for Abomination Finally Revealed        (Topic#21405)
dperry 
PhD Student
Posts: 1036
dperry
Loc: Oreland, PA
Reg: 11-24-04
03-21-18 10:27 PM - Post#254045    

5,419 for the semis, 5,564 for the finals:

Semifinal Attendance

Final Attendance

Last year it was 6,209 and 3,833, respectively:

Semifinals Attendance

Final Attendance

So grand totals are 10,983 this year, 10,042 this year, up less than 1,000 despite Penn being in both sessions this year, and with neither session drawing as well as the semis last year.

I got to the ticket office ten minutes before tipoff of the men's final and got a seat in the fourth row of the upper bowl in one of the two center sections, behind the benches.

In comparison, the Harvard-Yale playoff three years ago got 5,256, only about 300 less than this year's final despite much shorter prep time and no Penn or Princeton.
David Perry
Penn '92
"Hail, Alma Mater/Thy sons cheer thee now
To thee, Pennsylvania/All rivals must bow!!!"


 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 18825

Reg: 11-21-04
Re: Attendance for Abomination Finally Revealed
03-22-18 08:22 AM - Post#254055    
    In response to dperry

Yes, but it looked pretty full on TV and had great sound and atmosphere for the TV show. BTW, don't you think the fact that any of the fans of Yale, Harvard and Cornell could watch it on ESPN2 depressed the live attendance?

BTW, the reason there was not a dropoff for the final was that Penn actually got student attendance with classes set to resume the next day. Almost none of them were there on Saturday.

 
sparman 
Masters Student
Posts: 881
sparman
Reg: 12-08-04
Re: Attendance for Abomination Finally Revealed
03-22-18 09:57 AM - Post#254069    
    In response to palestra38

But it's always the case that other students will be able to watch instead of attend, so you are saying there will always be depressed attendance for schools not close to the site.

In fact I thought one of the arguments made for a tournament is that it increases likelihood of getting TV exposure, which suggests the attendance dynamic you identify will never change.

 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 18825

Reg: 11-21-04
Re: Attendance for Abomination Finally Revealed
03-22-18 10:34 AM - Post#254072    
    In response to sparman

Agreed. I don't think that, other than a potential Penn-Princeton matchup, the tournament will ever approach a sellout, unless the schools start busing students to the tournament, give them a place to stay and free beer.

 
Cvonvorys 
Postdoc
Posts: 2191

Loc: Princeton, New Jersey
Reg: 10-11-06
Re: Attendance for Abomination Finally Revealed
03-22-18 10:39 AM - Post#254074    
    In response to palestra38

  • palestra38 Said:
The tournament will never approach a sellout, unless the schools start busing students to the tournament, give them a place to stay and free beer.



Students??? How about doing this for the alum?? Add vodka and bourbon and a sellout will be a sure thing!!


 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 18825

Reg: 11-21-04
Re: Attendance for Abomination Finally Revealed
03-22-18 10:42 AM - Post#254076    
    In response to Cvonvorys

The alumni who care already were there. What's lacking is students, and of course, the tournament coincides with Spring Break, which is mandatory travel these days, it seems.

 
Jeff2sf 
Postdoc
Posts: 3777

Reg: 11-22-04
03-22-18 12:23 PM - Post#254087    
    In response to palestra38

despite penn being in both sessions... but Princeton, who clearly is good for about 1K fans, in neither.

Maybe if the players attend your kids' bday party you'll forgive their insolence for wanting a tournament?

 
Jeff2sf 
Postdoc
Posts: 3777

Reg: 11-22-04
03-22-18 12:24 PM - Post#254088    
    In response to Jeff2sf

btw - lame it took that long for the Ivies to release the attendance figures.

 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 18825

Reg: 11-21-04
03-22-18 12:29 PM - Post#254089    
    In response to Jeff2sf

Me? I haven't criticized the tournament, although I think we'd be better off without it. I enjoyed it. But the students don't care.

 
Jeff2sf 
Postdoc
Posts: 3777

Reg: 11-22-04
03-22-18 12:34 PM - Post#254091    
    In response to palestra38

nah i just didn't feel like quoting dp's post.

it was fun, people had fun. It wasn't "fair", and if penn isn't involved, which will be fair, it won't do great numbers at the Palestra. We know all this. still fun.

 
TheLine 
Postdoc
Posts: 3644

Age: 54
Reg: 07-07-09
03-22-18 12:40 PM - Post#254092    
    In response to palestra38

ESPN played up the Penn student section in the telecast - you're saying it wasn't all that?

If attendance is being driven primary by Penn fans and secondarily by Princeton fans, which is how I'm reading the numbers for the past 2 years, then there's a good argument to rotate the venue.

My sense is that the tournament is here to stay.


 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 18825

Reg: 11-21-04
03-22-18 12:57 PM - Post#254095    
    In response to Jeff2sf

Agreed that it was fun, but not really fair.

As for the attendance, there were Penn students at the final, but very few at the semis.

 
Go Green 
Masters Student
Posts: 428

Age: 47
Reg: 04-22-10
03-22-18 01:20 PM - Post#254099    
    In response to TheLine

  • TheLine Said:


If attendance is being driven primary by Penn fans and secondarily by Princeton fans, which is how I'm reading the numbers for the past 2 years, then there's a good argument to rotate the venue.




Harvard v. Yale drew pretty much the same numbers in 2015 for the playoff.

 
Go Green 
Masters Student
Posts: 428

Age: 47
Reg: 04-22-10
03-22-18 01:21 PM - Post#254100    
    In response to TheLine

  • TheLine Said:
.

My sense is that the tournament is here to stay.




Agreed.

The only "debate" is what changes (if any) to make to the format.

 
TheLine 
Postdoc
Posts: 3644

Age: 54
Reg: 07-07-09
03-22-18 01:28 PM - Post#254101    
    In response to Go Green

The same numbers as this year's final?

As much as I like The Palestra as a venue, the attendance from the past 2 years are saying that a Penn v Princeton matchup will draw the best and that Penn vs. anybody is a better draw than if Penn isn't playing. That's compelling. The only question is how attendance changes if the venue is different - will fans of other schools attend in greater numbers if they don't have to travel as far?


 
rbg 
Masters Student
Posts: 841

Reg: 10-20-14
03-22-18 01:29 PM - Post#254102    
    In response to TheLine

Interesting information on the men's attendance. While not close to a sellout, I would have thought that there were more than 5,500 for the Penn semifinal and final.

It does not appear that any attendance figures have been released for the 3 women's games.

With regards to non-students, the Penn (men and women) and Princeton women seemed to bring the largest groups with the Yale and Harvard groups lagging. Although, Jill Glessner on last week's Inside Ivy Hoops podcast felt that those two groups showed up in good numbers.

After 2 years of the tournament, the Penn and Princeton groups have been the largest. It will be interesting to see if they show up if/when the tournament is played in a more northern location. I would think that they would show up in good numbers if it is in, or near, NYC, but less sure if it was north of NYC.

In that same podcast, Columbia's AD Peter Pilling was interviewed. I believe he mentioned that he would like the tournament to be held in a 5,000 or so seat neutral site in, or around, NYC, but did not have a definite location in mind. If it was not in NYC, then he felt it should be at an neutral arena along the eastern seaboard.

With regards to the NYC area, the Carneseca Arena at St.John's (Queens) is the only NYC area venue of that size, but dperry exposed some problems with that location when commenting on the Penn-St. John's NIT threat last Monday.

Jill Glessner also mentioned having it in the Boston Area. I cannot remember if she mentioned Matthews Arena at Northeastern, but it is a 6,000 seat capacity with a bit of history.

http://gonu.com/sports/2010/1/28/matt hewsarena.asp...

Perhaps that will be considered as an alternative option to Bridgeport or Uncasville.

 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 18825

Reg: 11-21-04
03-22-18 01:34 PM - Post#254104    
    In response to rbg

Tournament tickets were for both men's and women's---there were no separate tickets for the women. So the figures you see are for all games.

 
HARVARDDADGRAD 
PhD Student
Posts: 1112

Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
03-22-18 02:43 PM - Post#254126    
    In response to palestra38

I believe Penn students returned from break the Sunday of the final game. Similarly, most other schools started break the Friday before the tournament. If attending a game on campus on Saturday didn't happen for Penn at home, it couldn't possibly happen for students of Harvard, Yale and Cornell who would not only be on break, but would have to travel and find/afford lodging.

Wonder how Penn and Princeton fans would travel if the tournament was in Boston. I know that Harvard games attract university employees and others who are locals. They don't travel.



 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 18825

Reg: 11-21-04
03-22-18 02:56 PM - Post#254127    
    In response to HARVARDDADGRAD

You'd get only Penn alums to go up to Boston. Students would not go.

 
Go Green 
Masters Student
Posts: 428

Age: 47
Reg: 04-22-10
03-22-18 03:04 PM - Post#254130    
    In response to TheLine

  • TheLine Said:
The same numbers as this year's final?





Pretty much--5,256

http://www.gocrimson.com/sports/mbkb/2014-15/b oxsc...

Here's some Happy Harvard fans:


http://www.gocrimson.com/sports/mbkb/2014-15/p hoto...

I would venture that finals involving any combination of HYPP would draw above 5,000 at the Palestra. Any finals involving a combination of BCCD would draw half that at the Palestra.

Anything else in terms of matchups and venue--I couldn't even guess.


 
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