Bison137
Professor
Posts: 16147
Reg: 01-23-06
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07-27-18 03:15 PM - Post#259555
In response to HuskyColonial
Zach just signed with Okapi Aalstar of the top Belgium league. They finished 4th out of 10 last year. Had five Americans, including ones from Butler and UTEP.
https://twitter.com/Sportando/status/1022 820627462...
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Bison137
Professor
Posts: 16147
Reg: 01-23-06
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08-02-18 04:56 PM - Post#259875
In response to Bison137
Stephen Brown has signed with Yalova Group Belediyespor, a team in the top division of Turkey's pro league. They were a 2nd division squad, but Turkey has very good basketball - ranked as high as #2 of the world's leagues (other than the NBA and EuroLeague, which features the top European teams from all of the different leagues).
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jkrun80
Postdoc
Posts: 3305
Age: 65
Reg: 05-07-12
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08-02-18 06:35 PM - Post#259880
In response to Bison137
Great news! I think he'll do well professionally.
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MrPhillie
Postdoc
Posts: 2757
Loc: NE PA
Reg: 07-14-08
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08-02-18 09:27 PM - Post#259889
In response to jkrun80
Happy for Stephen!
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HuskyColonial
PhD Student
Posts: 1976
Age: 50
Reg: 02-17-12
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08-02-18 09:50 PM - Post#259892
In response to MrPhillie
One of the greatest classes in history. Well done.
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Bison137
Professor
Posts: 16147
Reg: 01-23-06
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Zach & Nana NBA Workouts
08-02-18 10:08 PM - Post#259893
In response to HuskyColonial
One of the greatest classes in history. Well done.
I'd go one step further and say THE greatest class in Bison history. And remember that another really good player, JC Show, was also a part of it. Show battle dinjuries his first year but still had many games in double figures, including a 20-pointer at AU which led the Bison to a crucial OT victory.
Without doing any research, I think these are the other top classes in the scholarship era - listed in chronological order:
- McNaughton, D. Brown, J. Clark, Badmus
- Shazier, Boon, T. O'Brien (based on O'Brien's ability and not on what he did for his brief Bison tenure)
- Muscala, Willman, B. Johnson, Klebon
- Haas, Hoffman, R. Frazier, Banas
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bison63
Postdoc
Posts: 3857
Reg: 01-23-06
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08-02-18 10:50 PM - Post#259895
In response to Bison137
It’s the dog days of August, and still a long way to go before we really get into it for the new season. For now, I can’t let the chance to debate the “best class†to go by.
Going on the basis of results there is clearly one best class...McN, Brown, Badmus and Clark and a case could also be made for the class of Bettencourt and Lee. These classes went to the Dance, and won....twice. IMO, end of story.
Next, I’d go with this years class. 4 PL titles and two close games in the Dance edges out Muscala, Willman and BJ who got to the dance twice but suffered a blowout loss one time (albeit to the eventual champ) and a loss to a beatable Butler team when Muscala arguably played his career worst game. Those ‘06 and ‘07 classes have got to be the two best.
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Bison137
Professor
Posts: 16147
Reg: 01-23-06
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08-02-18 10:57 PM - Post#259896
In response to bison63
Those ‘06 and ‘07 classes have got to be the two best.
Note that I said "scholarship" classes, so the Lee/Bettencourt class is not in play. And I think if this year's graduating class had also had a Lee and a Bettencourt on the same team that they might well have won an NCAA game or two. A team of Foulland, Thomas, Lee, Bettencourt, and Brown would look pretty formidable. I wouldn't say McNaughton, Brown, and Badmus were better than Foulland, Thomas, and Brown - they just had a much better supporting cast from the class before them.
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mcapodee
Sophomore
Posts: 156
Reg: 01-29-06
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08-03-18 11:28 AM - Post#259915
In response to Bison137
I'll have to go with Muscala's class slightly edging out McNaughton's class. Muscala's team didn't have the same success in the NCAA tourney that McNaughton's team did, but a great deal of that success in '05 and '06 was in great part to the Class of '06.
Class of '13 didn't make the NCAA their junior year but did beat a storied Power Conference team in the NIT.
I feel like the league was softer for the 4 year run for Class of '18. Zach and Nana ruled the PL, but never really had that signature win (maybe @Vandy?). They were damn close but never could get over the hump against the Power Conference squads.
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Bison89
Professor
Posts: 5370
Loc: Philadelphia
Reg: 11-14-07
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08-03-18 02:16 PM - Post#259931
In response to mcapodee
mcapodee, I agree about not having a signature win. That is what leads me to lean toward the class of McNaughton, D. Brown, J. Clark, Badmus.
Pitt, Kansas, Arkansas, Syracuse, etc. That is an impressive list.
| New season, new team, new dream . . . |
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Bison137
Professor
Posts: 16147
Reg: 01-23-06
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08-03-18 02:38 PM - Post#259933
In response to Bison89
mcapodee, I agree about not having a signature win. That is what leads me to lean toward the class of McNaughton, D. Brown, J. Clark, Badmus.
Pitt, Kansas, Arkansas, Syracuse, etc. That is an impressive list.
Impressive for sure. But at least half the credit goes to the preceding class of Lee and Bettencourt. Also some credit to Griffin and Mastro. That class got more help than the Muscala class and the Foulland class.
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bison63
Postdoc
Posts: 3857
Reg: 01-23-06
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08-03-18 10:41 PM - Post#259941
In response to Bison137
Those ‘06 and ‘07 classes have got to be the two best.
Note that I said "scholarship" classes, so the Lee/Bettencourt class is not in play. And I think if this year's graduating class had also had a Lee and a Bettencourt on the same team that they might well have won an NCAA game or two. A team of Foulland, Thomas, Lee, Bettencourt, and Brown would look pretty formidable. I wouldn't say McNaughton, Brown, and Badmus were better than Foulland, Thomas, and Brown - they just had a much better supporting cast from the class before them.
I think we were talking about the “greatest class ever,†so I did not, and do not feel bound by the scholarship qualifier. (And was Badmus also non scholy?)
No getting around the point that the class of ‘06 made the class of ‘07 better, as well Griff and Mastro. Still, i’ll take the class with the Dance wins over the others. The lack of that signature win, takes this years class out of it. Yes, Vandy, but signature win? Don’t think so. Too many “ nice tries†for the class of ‘18 to be the best ever, IMO. Shoulda beat MD, coulda beat WVU, etc, etc.
As we all know we can go round and round on this and nobody will ever win the argument because of its subjective nature, which is what makes it a great “dog day†topic. But maybe what we are proving is that Pat Flannery did Bucknell’s greatest ever recruiting over a period of years there. None of our other very good coaches ever had multiple all time greatest class candidates on the same team as did PF. Would not be surprised to see Nate do it as well before he is done.
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MrPhillie
Postdoc
Posts: 2757
Loc: NE PA
Reg: 07-14-08
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08-04-18 12:05 PM - Post#259942
In response to bison63
So three Bucknell graduates sign to play professional basketball the following year. How often, if ever, has his happened in the PL? I can’t remember if Bryson played professionally.
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jkrun80
Postdoc
Posts: 3305
Age: 65
Reg: 05-07-12
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08-04-18 06:10 PM - Post#259949
In response to MrPhillie
If you're talking about the best team, 2006 is clearly #1 followed closely by 2005. But if you're talking about the best class, individual accomplishments need to be weighted more heavily. Based on that, I agree with 137 that 2018 is the best class in recent memory. I'd put 2013 next followed by 2007. As for 2006, Lee and Bettencourt were great players, but McClymont and Mack were not major contributors.
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JimK_LU72
Freshman
Posts: 41
Loc: Allentown
Reg: 02-03-18
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Zach & Nana NBA Workouts
08-05-18 09:51 AM - Post#259950
In response to MrPhillie
Just a quick note on three pro signings from a class in The Patriot League...
Lehigh class of 2013: Holden Greiner, Gabe Knutson, & that other guy all signed and played (are playing) pro the following years. C.J. had a very good supporting cast. And he needed it to hold off Muscala & Co.
Edited by JimK_LU72 on 08-05-18 09:52 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
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Bison137
Professor
Posts: 16147
Reg: 01-23-06
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Re: Zach & Nana NBA Workouts
08-05-18 01:25 PM - Post#259951
In response to JimK_LU72
Lehigh class of 2013: Holden Greiner, Gabe Knutson, & that other guy all signed and played (are playing) pro the following years. C.J. had a very good supporting cast. And he needed it to hold off Muscala & Co.
Yes, that was a very good class. I'm happy to say that in the games CJ played, the Bison won four out of seven.
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bison63
Postdoc
Posts: 3857
Reg: 01-23-06
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08-05-18 07:36 PM - Post#259953
In response to jkrun80
If you're talking about the best team, 2006 is clearly #1 followed closely by 2005. But if you're talking about the best class, individual accomplishments need to be weighted more heavily. Based on that, I agree with 137 that 2018 is the best class in recent memory. I'd put 2013 next followed by 2007. As for 2006, Lee and Bettencourt were great players, but McClymont and Mack were not major contributors.
Excellent points, and totally defensible re: best class. But just to be the devils advocate, it could be argued that on the basis of Lee and Beetrncourt alone, 2006 was the best class. It IS a slippery slope, but the argument could be made. I could also argue that Holland Mack was an extremely valuable member of the team, although not in the box score. That is going off on a bit of a tangent, in a direction that is probably not within the parameters of this discussion, but Mack was not just and end of the bench player off the court. Great guy by the way!
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bison63
Postdoc
Posts: 3857
Reg: 01-23-06
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Re: Zach & Nana NBA Workouts
08-05-18 07:39 PM - Post#259954
In response to Bison137
Lehigh class of 2013: Holden Greiner, Gabe Knutson, & that other guy all signed and played (are playing) pro the following years. C.J. had a very good supporting cast. And he needed it to hold off Muscala & Co.
Yes, that was a very good class. I'm happy to say that in the games CJ played, the Bison won four out of seven.
Yes, but one of those 3 losses kind of trumps our wins. You know the one I mean. And CJ did rub our noses in it!
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jkrun80
Postdoc
Posts: 3305
Age: 65
Reg: 05-07-12
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08-05-18 08:15 PM - Post#259955
In response to bison63
Excellent points, and totally defensible re: best class. But just to be the devils advocate, it could be argued that on the basis of Lee and Beetrncourt alone, 2006 was the best class. It IS a slippery slope, but the argument could be made. I could also argue that Holland Mack was an extremely valuable member of the team, although not in the box score. That is going off on a bit of a tangent, in a direction that is probably not within the parameters of this discussion, but Mack was not just and end of the bench player off the court. Great guy by the way!
I'll be the first to acknowledge that every player on the team can contribute is some significant way. But assuming we're talking about on-court accomplishments, I stand by my choices. That's why it's great having these debates. There is no right answer - it depends on your perspective.
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Bison137
Professor
Posts: 16147
Reg: 01-23-06
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Re: Zach & Nana NBA Workouts
08-05-18 09:32 PM - Post#259956
In response to bison63
Lehigh class of 2013: Holden Greiner, Gabe Knutson, & that other guy all signed and played (are playing) pro the following years. C.J. had a very good supporting cast. And he needed it to hold off Muscala & Co.
Yes, that was a very good class. I'm happy to say that in the games CJ played, the Bison won four out of seven.
Yes, but one of those 3 losses kind of trumps our wins. You know the one I mean. And CJ did rub our noses in it!
To some extent. But the Bison did beat Lehigh and CJ in the 2011 tournament, which kind of offsets it. In that game, CJ had a crucial turnover with 35 seconds left and then missed a tying shot with 8 seconds left. He was 6-17 from the field and only hit one 3-pointer.
The Bison loss to Lehigh in 2012 actually turned out somewhat OK as well, as it led to a Bison NIT win at Arizona.
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