jmverlin
Junior
Posts: 218
Age: 35
Reg: 07-18-12
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10-12-18 01:08 PM - Post#262473
Since you guys were so nice and supported my Patreon quite a bit, I figured I'd post the audio from my interview with Donahue the other day:
https://www.patreon.com/posts/22020425
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jmverlin
Junior
Posts: 218
Age: 35
Reg: 07-18-12
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Re: Steve Donahue audio
10-12-18 01:12 PM - Post#262475
In response to jmverlin
Point guard discussion around the 2:00 mark.
Two-bid Ivy talk around the 5:00 mark.
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Penndemonium
PhD Student
Posts: 1903
Reg: 11-29-04
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10-12-18 01:14 PM - Post#262476
In response to jmverlin
Thanks, jmverlin. I am glad you did that. I like and fully support what you are doing through your website and Patreon. That said, everyone is trying to get consumers to pay subscription fees for everything these days. I don't like signing up for anything without knowing what I'm getting. I just don't have time to keep signing up and canceling things. This is a great trial opportunity for me to understand the content and support you as a result.
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Penndemonium
PhD Student
Posts: 1903
Reg: 11-29-04
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Steve Donahue audio
10-12-18 01:19 PM - Post#262477
In response to Penndemonium
Oops. It doesn't seem to be working. It is still requiring login and payment (I think). No problems if I just misunderstood your intent. You deserve Patreon support.
Edited by Penndemonium on 10-12-18 01:22 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
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jmverlin
Junior
Posts: 218
Age: 35
Reg: 07-18-12
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10-12-18 01:21 PM - Post#262478
In response to Penndemonium
Yeah, you still have to pay for it. I mean, are you complaining that people are asking to be paid for their work? I don't know what to tell you there. And yes, you pay for things and then you cancel them if you don't like them. That's kind of how the economy works now. I'm sorry if you don't love it, but...I don't know how to help you out there.
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Penndemonium
PhD Student
Posts: 1903
Reg: 11-29-04
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Steve Donahue audio
10-12-18 01:24 PM - Post#262479
In response to jmverlin
No I get it and you deserve support. I just misunderstood your intent. I am fully a believer that content development should be supported and paid for.
I'm just reluctant to sign up for anything. I won't even sign up for a free service if I have to open an account - unless I know I need/love it. I only signed up for ivy basketball live video last year - reluctantly. Despite loving Penn b-ball, I just had an aversion. I'll check it out sometime. Love your work.
Edited by Penndemonium on 10-12-18 01:38 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
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T.P.F.K.A.D.W.
PhD Student
Posts: 1173
Loc: Our Nation's Capital
Reg: 01-18-05
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10-12-18 01:27 PM - Post#262480
In response to jmverlin
I think the main barrier facing sites like yours is not the money itself. A buck or two a month? I have no problem spending that. Rather, it's the process of registering, creating a login with a secure password (and then remembering that password) and supplying a credit card number with all the security risks that entails.
You—and all journalists—absolutely deserve to be paid for your work. But there's got to be a better, more secure, more streamlined approach to payment.
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Penndemonium
PhD Student
Posts: 1903
Reg: 11-29-04
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10-12-18 01:48 PM - Post#262482
In response to T.P.F.K.A.D.W.
That is exactly what Patreon is intended to be. Patreon was started by a guy who had a Youtube channel and realized there was exactly that need.
As you say, though - the barrier is getting me to give my ID to anyone - even Patreon. Even being as parsimonious about logins as I am, I have about 600 logins in my password manager. Things have just gotten ridiculous.
JMVerlin, I don't hold ANYTHING against you charging for this. I want you to continue doing what you do. A free trial of an episode or two might help us curmudgeons know what we're supporting. This is actually the first time I was aware that you had a Patreon and audio product, so I didn't have time to adapt my thinking. Just a window into my thought process - but I know others think/behave differently.
Again, you are dead right to get some $$$ for what you develop and to make us pay for your efforts. I just thought you were taking a different marketing approach when I saw your first post.
I think the main barrier facing sites like yours is not the money itself. A buck or two a month? I have no problem spending that. Rather, it's the process of registering, creating a login with a secure password (and then remembering that password) and supplying a credit card number with all the security risks that entails.
You—and all journalists—absolutely deserve to be paid for your work. But there's got to be a better, more secure, more streamlined approach to payment.
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jmverlin
Junior
Posts: 218
Age: 35
Reg: 07-18-12
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10-12-18 01:51 PM - Post#262483
In response to Penndemonium
It's not an "audio product," per se, it's just a supplement to CoBL with behind-the-scenes looks and some personal analysis. If you look on my page I've posted my thoughts on the rankings of the City 6, some behind-the-scenes practice thoughts, coach Q&A transcripts, etc. It's all sorts of different content. This particular post happens to be the raw audio of the interview I did with Donahue for our season preview content.
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Jeff2sf
Postdoc
Posts: 4466
Reg: 11-22-04
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10-12-18 02:00 PM - Post#262484
In response to jmverlin
fwiw, i interpreted the same way that Penndemonium did. I just didn't care because I didn't feel like listening to the coach.
Josh, you're coming off more defensive/combative than I've ever seen you on here in several years. well except for the time TheEmpire started posting his/her articles on here.
I'm sure the challenges of building a business and brand are immense and I wish you good luck.
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jmverlin
Junior
Posts: 218
Age: 35
Reg: 07-18-12
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10-12-18 02:23 PM - Post#262486
In response to Jeff2sf
I apologize if that's the case. But you have to understand how frustrating it is for people to say that they like your content but don't want to pay for it, for various reasons. And I'm not saying that's exactly how these folks feel, but I see it all the time with people who suddenly don't want to pay for journalism. And I'm not sure who they expect will be producing content if nobody's getting paid. It's certainly not the perfect model at the moment, but that's where we're at.
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Silver Maple
Postdoc
Posts: 3781
Loc: Westfield, New Jersey
Reg: 11-23-04
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Steve Donahue audio
10-12-18 02:53 PM - Post#262490
In response to jmverlin
Right now we're in the middle of a multi-year, international conversation about how value gets created and how it gets paid for. And Josh, you're right on the sharp end of it. The world is full of people who are trying to get something for nothing. I deal with this professionally as well. I'm a market research consultant, and I'm constantly encountering client companies trying to do themselves for free what I do for money, and then wondering why their results are so sh1tty.
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Jeff2sf
Postdoc
Posts: 4466
Reg: 11-22-04
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10-12-18 03:22 PM - Post#262491
In response to Silver Maple
it never crossed my mind to ask you to give away anything. i merely read this sentence
"Since you guys were so nice and supported my Patreon quite a bit, I figured I'd post the audio from my interview with Donahue the other day"
as "Since you guys were so nice and supported my Patreon quite a bit, I'm giving EVERYONE this no charge". I realize now you were writing it as "I'm giving it to people who supported it at no additional charge".
We were confused, not freeloading.
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Quakers03
Professor
Posts: 12533
Reg: 12-07-04
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10-13-18 11:17 AM - Post#262506
In response to Jeff2sf
Interesting to hear him say that Jelani was indeed going to be the main guy with the ball in his hands. Had we heard that before? Poor kid...
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Streamers
Professor
Posts: 8295
Loc: NW Philadelphia
Reg: 11-21-04
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10-13-18 11:57 AM - Post#262508
In response to Quakers03
Let me chime in on the business model here. Although I agree with what's been said above, I know from my professional experience that 'free samples' above and beyond the free site really help. Speaking for myself, I would be more likely to buy in if there were something other than a monthly option. Either a fixed lifetime fee or a season pass with no automatic renewal would be preferable.
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Mike Porter
Postdoc
Posts: 3619
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
Reg: 11-21-04
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10-13-18 01:19 PM - Post#262511
In response to Streamers
As someone who did just sign up for a monthly option to get additional content from Josh... I’m always happy to pay for good content (just like I had the premium option here when Jake had it).
For those of you mentioning idea to provide free content first to get you hooked, you’re looking at it all wrong. Have you ever gone to the City of Basketball Love website to read an article Josh or his team did on a recruit, preseason, post season, etc.? If so, guess what - you DID see the free content sample and then some. Josh is still doing just that with plenty of free content around Penn, but this subscription is to get additional premium content on Philly college basketball beyond that.
Keep it coming Josh and love your work, escpecially living 3000 miles away.
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jmverlin
Junior
Posts: 218
Age: 35
Reg: 07-18-12
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10-13-18 10:34 PM - Post#262517
In response to Mike Porter
Thanks so much Mike!
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PennFan10
Postdoc
Posts: 3589
Reg: 02-15-15
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10-13-18 10:58 PM - Post#262519
In response to jmverlin
I’d buy it as a one off or annual content. I’m not participating in a recurring subscription scheme. Sorry
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Streamers
Professor
Posts: 8295
Loc: NW Philadelphia
Reg: 11-21-04
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10-14-18 02:19 PM - Post#262544
In response to Mike Porter
For those of you mentioning idea to provide free content first to get you hooked, you’re looking at it all wrong. Have you ever gone to the City of Basketball Love website to read an article Josh or his team did on a recruit, preseason, post season, etc.? If so, guess what - you DID see the free content sample and then some. Josh is still doing just that with plenty of free content around Penn, but this subscription is to get additional premium content on Philly college basketball beyond that.
Mike- as I pointed out in my post, I understand the role of the free site but successful content sites bait you with a taste of premium content as a best practice.
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