Tod Howard Hawks
Freshman
Posts: 64
Age: 79
Reg: 03-17-14
|
01-05-19 02:14 AM - Post#271153
I ask, "Why Elmira?"
Elmira is a Division III college. Frankly, I had never heard of the school until I saw that Columbia will be playing them January 12, one week before Columbia takes on Cornell in an away game.
Why is Columbia taking on a Division III team one week before they start Ivy League play? Who sets up the schedule for upcoming seasons?
Even if Columbia scorches Elmira, it will mean nothing. I am personally embarrassed that Columbia scheduled this game. Maybe at the first of the season, but one week before Columbia plays Cornell in Ithaca? Really?
This incredibly dumb decision to play a Division III team at this juncture is just another in a long list of incompetent decisions made by those who control the destiny of Columbia Basketball. That list would include, of course, Coach Engles, who has made innumerable bad decisions in virtually all facets of Columbia Basketball.
As I have said before, "Columbia Basketball, prove me wrong." But sadly, I don't think that will ever happen under the aegis of Engles.
|
westcoast
Senior
Posts: 302
Reg: 03-08-16
|
01-05-19 02:37 AM - Post#271154
In response to Tod Howard Hawks
Almost every Ivy League team scheduled a non-D1 opponent in January:
Yale - Skidmore (Jan 8)
Harvard - McGill (Jan 6, cancelled)
Brown - Johnson & Wales (Jan 14)
Columbia - Elmira (Jan 12)
Cornell - Johnson & Wales (Jan 4)
Princeton - Wesley (Jan 27)
Only Penn, with two Big-5 games this month, and Dartmouth, who has already played two D3 opponents, do not have a D3 game this month.
|
AntiUngvar
Masters Student
Posts: 530
Age: 69
Loc: New York City
Reg: 07-23-18
|
01-05-19 05:10 AM - Post#271155
In response to westcoast
Columbia has so much to do (i.e., closing out close games, particularly at road venues) if they expect to be competing in New Haven nine weeks from now. Viewed in that light, Mr. Hawks does have a point.
|
Chet Forte
Postdoc
Posts: 2967
Reg: 03-02-08
|
01-05-19 09:00 AM - Post#271157
In response to AntiUngvar
In fairness we and every other Ivy have been scheduling one or two such games for years. It is basically a scrimmage in which guys at the end of the bench get a chance to log a few game minutes.
|
AntiUngvar
Masters Student
Posts: 530
Age: 69
Loc: New York City
Reg: 07-23-18
|
Why Elmira?
01-05-19 12:09 PM - Post#271167
In response to Chet Forte
In your day, CU played City College of New York at the beginning of the season, as a good will game involving two schools from the Harlem community- and that was it. Playing Elmira now, when they go weeks without playing, it's natural that an old timer would wonder about it, Chet.
Edited by AntiUngvar on 01-05-19 12:19 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
|
AntiUngvar
Masters Student
Posts: 530
Age: 69
Loc: New York City
Reg: 07-23-18
|
01-05-19 12:18 PM - Post#271169
In response to AntiUngvar
And nobody needs more practice (coaching) 2nd half/end game road situations than you-know-who!
|
westcoast
Senior
Posts: 302
Reg: 03-08-16
|
01-05-19 01:27 PM - Post#271172
In response to AntiUngvar
No Ivy League team wants to play a road game right before league play starts, and no Power-5 or even Mid-Major is going to travel to an Ivy League school in January (if ever).
So the choice is to play a low D-1 team (MEAC, NEC) or play a non-D1 opponent. Playing a low D-1 opponent can actually hurt a team's rating/resume (especially if the game is close), while playing a D3 team doesn't affect the rating at all.
And finally, as pointed out above, it gives the end of the bench (Players #11-15) a chance to play some minutes, which probably won't happen much in league play. These guys work hard all season, and the coaches really do want to give them an opportunity to shine.
|
Columbia 37P6
Postdoc
Posts: 2173
Reg: 02-14-06
|
01-05-19 02:07 PM - Post#271179
In response to westcoast
Yes, that's generally correct, but not in our case, because we use a large 11-man rotation from a small 14-eligible roster. Only three players on the roster haven't seen much action, and one of them may be injured. More important than giving some of the deep reserves playing time, the coaching staff must use the Elmira game to build the confidence of some of players in the 11 rotation who need to get going if the Lions are going to have a successful Ivy League campaign. That starts with the "lotsa" concept which means that Bibbs, Ellis and Hunter each need to take lotsa shots from lotsa places on the floor with the goal of scoring lots of points.
|
Old Bear
Postdoc
Posts: 3992
Reg: 11-23-04
|
01-05-19 03:05 PM - Post#271188
In response to Columbia 37P6
And, most D1 teams have started league play. It's hard to find a game in January.
|
HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2689
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
|
01-05-19 03:06 PM - Post#271189
In response to Columbia 37P6
Also, most conferences are starting their schedules in early January and would have no interest in another OOC game.
First half of January for Ivies is a time to get healthy, practice, and - essentially - scrimmage. You just had 2 months of games.
|
AntiUngvar
Masters Student
Posts: 530
Age: 69
Loc: New York City
Reg: 07-23-18
|
01-05-19 03:47 PM - Post#271207
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
Harvard's played just a dozen games from the beginning of November till today. If you see that as two months of games. then I guess you do.
|
HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2689
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
|
01-05-19 07:26 PM - Post#271347
In response to AntiUngvar
Sure, with exams I do.
Not the point though. Almost everyone in the league plays these quasi scrimmages for the reason stated.
Vilify your coach if you choose, but not for this reason.
|
AntiUngvar
Masters Student
Posts: 530
Age: 69
Loc: New York City
Reg: 07-23-18
|
Why Elmira?
01-05-19 08:24 PM - Post#271455
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
12 games in 70 days isn't 2 months of games. The man who initiated this thread (not I) is an alumnus of 53 years ago; and if he wishes to express himself on the Columbia page and on this matter, that's his prerogative, and your grandstanding as such is plainly non-essential.
Edited by AntiUngvar on 01-05-19 08:25 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
|
HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2689
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
|
01-05-19 09:02 PM - Post#271467
In response to AntiUngvar
Good Luck to him, and to you.
|
AntiUngvar
Masters Student
Posts: 530
Age: 69
Loc: New York City
Reg: 07-23-18
|
01-06-19 03:44 PM - Post#271541
In response to westcoast
No Ivy League team wants to play a road game right before league play starts, and no Power-5 or even Mid-Major is going to travel to an Ivy League school in January (if ever).
I'd say the Princeton people were looking forward to playing at ASU on December 29, and experienced no downside to having made the trip. And last I checked, ASU plays in a Power-5, and will be making the trip East to play at Princeton, next January.
|
westcoast
Senior
Posts: 302
Reg: 03-08-16
|
Why Elmira?
01-06-19 04:37 PM - Post#271547
In response to AntiUngvar
Has the date for next year's game actually been set? With Princeton's exam schedule in January, there aren't many game opportunities. But yes, the first weekend around New Year's is a possibility (before Pac-12 or Ivy League conference play). If ASU does come in January, I think they will be the first Power-5 team to visit Jadwin in January in at least 20 years. I am sure you will correct me if I am wrong.
Regardless, the original poster was criticizing Columbia's coach for scheduling a D3 game in January. And the truth is that almost every Ivy team does the same. And it is also true that once conference play starts, teams rarely take long non-conference road trips.
Edited by westcoast on 01-06-19 04:38 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
|
Old Bear
Postdoc
Posts: 3992
Reg: 11-23-04
|
Why Elmira?
01-06-19 07:38 PM - Post#271566
In response to westcoast
Apparently Elmira was the only girl left at the post-New Years dance . Brown found a game ay Canisius which seems to be as close as the could get to home for Obie Okolie.
|
AntiUngvar
Masters Student
Posts: 530
Age: 69
Loc: New York City
Reg: 07-23-18
|
Re: Why Elmira?
01-06-19 08:51 PM - Post#271573
In response to Old Bear
Yes, sir! As I had to point out to the Spin Doctor some time ago- just another case of slim pickings!
|
Tod Howard Hawks
Freshman
Posts: 64
Age: 79
Reg: 03-17-14
|
01-06-19 10:58 PM - Post#271585
In response to AntiUngvar
HARVARDDADGRAD, there are presently 351 Division I basketball teams in the country, and Columbia, as well as the other Ivy teams that have chosen to schedule Division III teams this late in their seasons, still makes me embarrassed for all the Ivy teams that do this.
Regrettably. there is a plethora of reasons, including the one I posted earlier, to "villify" Coach Engles.
As you apparently (pun intended) have some relationship to Harvard (exactly what it is I do not know), I invite you to read my answer to the Quora.com question: "Why is Columbia College a better educational experience than Harvard College?"
|
HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2689
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
|
01-07-19 12:51 AM - Post#271590
In response to Tod Howard Hawks
Thanks, but my education has suited me well. Not sure why you feel a need to re-evaluate yours.
As for your initial post, I can only again refer you to the response provided to your initial post by "Westcoast." No less than six of the eight Ivy league squads have scheduled non-Division 1 contests in January. The other two (Penn and Dartmouth), have already completed such scheduled games. As I and others have pointed out, there are a plethora of reasons for this scheduling. Apparently, you don't accept that. But you have to acknowledge that successful coaches like Mssrs. Henderson, Jones and Amaker do. They may have not completed Columbia's Core Curriculum, but they are generally accepted as experienced experts in what they do.
|
