dperry
Postdoc
Posts: 2214
Loc: Houston, TX
Reg: 11-24-04
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03-03-19 04:45 AM - Post#279083
So trying to figure out the possbilities; please remind me. . .say there is a tie for fourth, and the head-to-head is even; the next step is record against the first-place team. If two teams are tied for first, you would take the record against both teams combined, regardless of which one of those teams actually got the #1 seed, correct? e.g., if Cornell and Penn tied, their H-H is even. If Harvard and Princeton tied for first, you would compare Cr and Pa's record against both H and Pr, no matter who the #1 seed was, right?
David Perry
Penn '92
"Hail, Alma Mater/Thy sons cheer thee now
To thee, Pennsylvania/All rivals must bow!!!" |
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Bryan
Junior
Posts: 231
Loc: Philadelphia
Reg: 11-21-04
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Re: Tiebreaker Question
03-03-19 10:06 AM - Post#279101
In response to dperry
David, the tiebreaker rules are shown in the link below. You are correct if 2 or more teams ahead of you (or behind you) are tied it's the record against all the tied teams that is considered.
https://www.ncaa.com/news/basketball-men/2 019-03-0...
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TigerFan
PhD Student
Posts: 1885
Reg: 11-21-04
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03-03-19 01:38 PM - Post#279141
In response to Bryan
Just for giggles, what happens if Columbia sweeps again next weekend, Brown gets swept, and Penn and Cornell split? Four way tie for fourth and a lot of splits between the teams. Computer rankings at that point?
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mrjames
Professor
Posts: 6062
Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
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03-03-19 01:49 PM - Post#279144
In response to TigerFan
It would be Penn due to its (then) sweep of Brown. Only sweep of the group, so it would put Penn at the top of the four.
Columbia was eliminated when both Brown and Penn won last night.
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SRP
Postdoc
Posts: 4910
Reg: 02-04-06
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03-03-19 02:02 PM - Post#279147
In response to mrjames
It appears that the oh-so-thrilling race for fourth is going to be dominated each year by these NFL-wildcard-like discussions. Maybe there should be a pre-tournament playoff among those tied for fourth instead.
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bradley
PhD Student
Posts: 1842
Age: 74
Reg: 01-15-16
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03-03-19 04:15 PM - Post#279164
In response to SRP
Tie breaker rules decide who gets the 4th seed and I assume the tie breaker rules make good sense although I do not want to know the answer.
After reading all of the various permutations for 4th seed, I may now be a convert of all teams qualifying for this silly tournament and let the actual games at IvyMadness decide who goes to the big dance. Of course, that's the way it used to work in the IL prior to IvyMadeness but it was called the regular season.
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HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2691
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
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03-03-19 04:16 PM - Post#279165
In response to bradley
Where would the pre tournament, tournament be held?
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SomeGuy
Professor
Posts: 6404
Reg: 11-22-04
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03-03-19 04:31 PM - Post#279168
In response to SRP
I know you are making fun of the whole tournament concept with this, but it really isn’t a bad idea. Could even view it as a little bit of a nod to the old system (where a tie results in a playoff no matter what). Use tiebreakers for seeding, but never send a team home just based on a tiebreaker. Once we are past simple head to head, the tiebreakers are ridiculous anyway (is best win really a good criteria, when the team with the best win in a tie must also have a worse loss somewhere?). Let the teams tied for fourth play a playoff to get in. If you want to help the top Seed a bit, have the play in the night before Ivy Madness.
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PennFan10
Postdoc
Posts: 3584
Reg: 02-15-15
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03-03-19 08:39 PM - Post#279194
In response to SomeGuy
Some people would prefer that 90% of the board go quiet so the 10% could chat about what seed they will be in the NCAA’s and how recruiting is going.
The discussion on the 4th seed doesn’t displace other discussion or interest, it adds to it. The players absolutely love it.
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HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2691
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
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03-03-19 08:55 PM - Post#279197
In response to PennFan10
Unless they're from Harvard, Yale or Princeton. In which case the only talk you'll hear is about winning the league.
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Bruno
PhD Student
Posts: 1419
Loc: Brooklyn, NY
Reg: 11-21-04
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Tiebreaker Question
03-03-19 09:33 PM - Post#279200
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
What I personally like best about this thread is that I wanted a tournament for years and got one. And that those who didn’t want one also got one.
Make all the arguments you want. It is a medical fact that more players, more fans, more schools are engaged at this point in the year in what happens in the upcoming weekend than at any point pre-tournament. Ever.
HashtagIvyMadness
| LET'S go BRU-no (duh. nuh. nuh-nuh-nuh) |
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westphillywarrior
Sophomore
Posts: 196
Age: 43
Reg: 01-08-11
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Re: Tiebreaker Question
03-03-19 10:20 PM - Post#279202
In response to Bruno
Dear Bruno,
I've always been against the tournament. I'm pretty simple minded - just always thought playing 14 games, home and away against each opponent, was a better way to award the wonderful prize of a berth in the NCAA tournament.
You've always seemed like a good guy and a great fan. I'm honestly very happy for you now that you can get excited about Brown possibly finishing fourth every year. I hope you make it some year soon.
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westphillywarrior
Sophomore
Posts: 196
Age: 43
Reg: 01-08-11
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Re: Tiebreaker Question
03-03-19 10:36 PM - Post#279203
In response to westphillywarrior
I should have added another thought. If there has to be a tournament, I sure wish that it could have been with six or seven teams so that almost everyone could have been happy and felt like winners.
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Go Green
PhD Student
Posts: 1145
Age: 52
Reg: 04-22-10
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Re: Tiebreaker Question
03-03-19 11:31 PM - Post#279212
In response to westphillywarrior
I'm pretty simple minded - just always thought playing 14 games, home and away against each opponent, was a better way to award the wonderful prize of a berth in the NCAA tournament.
*Give* *the* *regular* *season* *champs* *a* *ring*.
Problem solved.
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PennFan10
Postdoc
Posts: 3584
Reg: 02-15-15
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03-03-19 11:35 PM - Post#279213
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
Unless they're from Harvard, Yale or Princeton. In which case the only talk you'll hear is about winning the league.
Penn won the league last year.
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sparman
PhD Student
Posts: 1345
Reg: 12-08-04
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Re: Tiebreaker Question
03-03-19 11:50 PM - Post#279217
In response to Bruno
It is a medical fact that more players, more fans, more schools are engaged at this point in the year in what happens in the upcoming weekend than at any point pre-tournament. Ever. HashtagIvyMadness
Seems to me Columbia and Dartmouth, despite having been out of the running for a while, were highly engaged this past weekend.
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SomeGuy
Professor
Posts: 6404
Reg: 11-22-04
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Re: Tiebreaker Question
03-03-19 11:54 PM - Post#279219
In response to sparman
Columbia was just eliminated on Saturday.
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HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2691
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
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03-04-19 12:06 AM - Post#279220
In response to PennFan10
No, the tournament - at home.
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Mike Porter
Postdoc
Posts: 3618
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
Reg: 11-21-04
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03-04-19 12:21 AM - Post#279221
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
No, the championship. Harvard and Penn were co-champions. Tie breaker madness was only for seeding purposes.
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dperry
Postdoc
Posts: 2214
Loc: Houston, TX
Reg: 11-24-04
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03-04-19 12:25 AM - Post#279222
In response to PennFan10
Some people would prefer that 90% of the board go quiet so the 10% could chat about what seed they will be in the NCAA’s and how recruiting is going.
Some people remember that when the shoe was on the other foot, the pro-tournament people were not told to go away and be quiet.
Some people will realize that in a forum which seems to have a strong free speech orientation and a light touch with moderation, no topic that enough people are interested in will ever really die.
Some people are wise enough to know that when a significant portion of a group is very unhappy about a decision, telling them to shut up about it is unlikely to make them feel better or to lessen the controversy. From a personal standpoint, it makes me more ornery, not less.
Some people are aware that there are several subjects on this board that have been hotly debated since the beginning regardless of what the reality of the situation with the league is or the likelihood that anything will ever change about them.
Some people will point out that those who don't enjoy participating in discussions about the value of the abomination can ignore them.
Some people will note that there are plenty of threads going on about seeding, recruiting, quality of various players, teams, etc., with little or no interruption by opinions on the tourney.
Finally, some people are wondering exactly who died and made you board enforcer.
David Perry
Penn '92
"Hail, Alma Mater/Thy sons cheer thee now
To thee, Pennsylvania/All rivals must bow!!!" |
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