penn nation
Professor
Posts: 21086
Reg: 12-02-04
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03-21-19 03:06 PM - Post#282413
In response to Chip Bayers
Maloney stat line, 2nd round vs Florida in 1994:
4 for 21. 2 for 16 from 3.
Oni (currently 1-13) going to be haunted by this game a long time.
Matt Maloney says hi.
Yup. Channneled him.
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Mike Porter
Postdoc
Posts: 3615
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
Reg: 11-21-04
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03-21-19 03:19 PM - Post#282415
In response to mobrien
Yeah that part is a shame, and the whole team missed a lot of open 3's.
They lost by 5 after shooting 8 for 37 from 3. If they hit just 2 more 3's to go a still miserable 10 for 37, they win it.
Ah well, still a good rep for the league and hell of a second half effort.
Yale is losing a lot of key pieces here... top penetrator in Copeland, top defender in Phils, and sneaky good PF in Reynolds who could stretch the floor. Swain and Atkinson step right into the starting 5, but that 5 doesn't penetrate as well or defend at guard as well (shooting is prob a push and Atkinson is a better post defender so they get better inside defense and worse at guard).
Will be interesting to see who steps up for them from the bench/frosh and if it will be enough to get back to this level next year.
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PennFan10
Postdoc
Posts: 3580
Reg: 02-15-15
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03-21-19 03:26 PM - Post#282416
In response to mobrien
Man, Yale would have had a great chance to win if Oni just didn't have his 2nd worst game of the year, 2 of 16 from the field. A bunch of his misses were open looks too. The one from the top of the key when they were down six with a minute to go was the most painful.
Copeland was great, the bigs mostly held their own. Everything was there for the upset.
Fixed this for you. Point is the same, Oni wasn't Oni.
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bradley
PhD Student
Posts: 1842
Age: 74
Reg: 01-15-16
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03-21-19 03:48 PM - Post#282419
In response to Mike Porter
It is always a good barometer to take a look at the LSU/Yale game to see how far away the Ivies are to have a top 50 team let alone a top 25 team in addition to when the league will be a legitimate two bid league.
The obvious question is how good will Harvard be next year if Towns is back and the players are healthy similar to Yale this year. My gut tells me that they should be very good although there are some questions as to the Center and PG positions. Can Lewis and some other legitimate big play against a team with the two LSU bigs? -- I am not sure about that. Lewis is strong and can jump but he is probably two inches shorter than ideal plus he obviously gets in foul trouble. As to the other big, who would that legitimately be -- Baker??? Aiken is great but he is not a distributor of the ball like the LSU PG.
If Harvard is good enough next year to get a bid regardless of IvyMadness and they lose against another Ivy team in the IvyMadness final, the league could get two bids for one year with a lot of ifs -- also, does Harvard lose in having IvyMadness homecourt?. Is it probably unlikely that there will be two IL teams good enough next year to get NCAA bids on their own next year based on non-conference and IL play, but you never know. Time will tell.
There are a lot of really good college basketball teams out there including LSU thus year and I doubt that they will make the sweet 16.
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HGA
Sophomore
Posts: 106
Loc: New York
Reg: 10-16-18
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03-21-19 04:19 PM - Post#282423
In response to bradley
I've said this in an earlier post (but slightly differently) that it will be difficult for an Ivy team to be top 50 solely because they can't provide athletic scholarships and because of the higher academic standards. Additionally, and on a separate note around "bigs", there is an abundance of guard talent in the league, more so than at the 4/5 position. This is reflected in the postseason awards. Its hard for the Ivys to attract 3+ star big men, as there are fewer of them out there. Without them, it is harder to compete against the top 50 teams.
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penn nation
Professor
Posts: 21086
Reg: 12-02-04
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03-21-19 04:25 PM - Post#282424
In response to HGA
LSU has big men with guardlike moves, and then some. Tough to beat teams like that.
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Dr. V
PhD Student
Posts: 1536
Reg: 11-21-04
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03-21-19 04:27 PM - Post#282425
In response to HGA
Yale played well, but the game reminded me of my initial puzzlement when Oni won POY over Matt Morgan. The League has the second highest scorer in its history, Cornell outperforms expectations both a year ago and this last year, and Morgan doesn’t get POY?
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sparman
PhD Student
Posts: 1339
Reg: 12-08-04
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03-21-19 04:34 PM - Post#282428
In response to penn nation
There is always room for one more in the Pit of Misery.
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Old Bear
Postdoc
Posts: 3988
Reg: 11-23-04
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03-21-19 04:39 PM - Post#282430
In response to sparman
Or in the Fireswamp.
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bradley
PhD Student
Posts: 1842
Age: 74
Reg: 01-15-16
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03-21-19 04:50 PM - Post#282432
In response to HGA
he bigs are getting better in the Ivies including larger and more athletic, i.e. Tape and Arirguzoh, but they are simply not at the level of top major tier teams as you suggest.
Watching the freshmen bigs from LSU is simply a reality check. Understandably, we want to believe that we are getting better and closer to the best conferences but there is a long way to go and it will be difficult to ever get there.
To be a top 50 and especially top 25 team requires a brutal non-conference schedule and you need to win games as well.
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mrjames
Professor
Posts: 6062
Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
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03-21-19 06:14 PM - Post#282439
In response to HGA
We have had four Top 50 teams this decade. Three won a game in the tournament. One won two games.
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HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2685
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
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03-21-19 06:49 PM - Post#282440
In response to mrjames
To be an at large team you likely need to be a top 30-35 team. I'd love for Harvard to be that good, but that could be a stretch. I'm hearing top 50-60. 2 bid Ivy is tough.
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bradley
PhD Student
Posts: 1842
Age: 74
Reg: 01-15-16
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03-21-19 07:26 PM - Post#282441
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
Although several years back, the great Crimson 2013-14 team had a final KenPom ranking of #32 and next year's Harvard team certainly appears to have a very strong upside. For two IL teams to get a bid next year would probably require the Crimson to tank in the IvyMadness finale.
Are two IL teams going to finish in the top 50 in one season????? Let's hope but .....
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HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2685
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
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03-21-19 09:58 PM - Post#282446
In response to bradley
You need one team in the top #30 to #35 (likely the regular season champion). That team, however, needs to lose in the tournament. That loss can't be to a team ranked so los that it destroys the ranking necessary for the defeated regular season champion to qualify as an at large selection.
I'm not sure this is possible. Remember, teams like Clemson and NC State were around #35 and didn't make it as at large selections this year.
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mrjames
Professor
Posts: 6062
Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
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03-21-19 10:48 PM - Post#282452
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
While the RPI is a terrible formula, the NCAA used it for ages, and just stopped doing so this year. Both Yale and Harvard are just inside the Top 50 in the RPI are were hovering around there for most of league play.
The league has already had qualified at large teams from a KenPom perspective and a resume (WAB or Strength of Record) perspective. We can argue about the selection committee, and how overly qualified an Ivy team would have to be an at large. And hopefully next year the league can stay healthy and provide a real test case for the theory.
But this year is a weird one to pick as evidentiary of a gap between the Ivies and the top tier of college basketball. A 6 played an 11 tonight and an Ivy team had beaten each of them. Ivy teams had two more wins over different 11 seeds. As a league I can’t remember a year with more outright Tier A and B wins, leaving aside the myriad games against that caliber of competition that were close losses.
As for Clemson and NC St... NC St committed scheduling suicide or else would have been in the tourney. Clemson went 1-for-like-50 in Q1 games.
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SRP
Postdoc
Posts: 4894
Reg: 02-04-06
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03-22-19 02:35 AM - Post#282462
In response to mrjames
I saw that it took Yale a while to get used to the LSU bigs, but once they did, the athletic difference was not large. Copeland again looked the most like an NBA player to me, although I know his chances are slim. LSU's point guard Waters is very good, but his second half was not that great except for foul shooting. Yale had more good shots in total than LSU over the course of the game, they just couldn't hit anything from deep.
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james
Masters Student
Posts: 779
Age: 48
Reg: 03-18-19
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03-25-19 11:40 AM - Post#282660
In response to SRP
Bruner played great.
Atkinson was solid. Reynolds, Oni, etc just didnt hit outside shots.
Tos were controlled well. Also rebounded very solidly. if you hit more shots rebounding probably looks -3 which is incredible against them.
again, you have to make shots, particularly Open ones!
as noted BEFORE the game by ME...Lsu is top 5 talent in the US of A. They cheat, after all.
They were more impressive in person. and i have watched a handful of games being in SEC country.
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