rbg
Postdoc
Posts: 3052
Reg: 10-20-14
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12-30-19 10:00 PM - Post#295621
In response to rbg
Good win against one of the weakest teams in Division 1.
Nice to see that Penn has 5 guys that are capable of putting up big points. Hopefully, Dingle's injury is minor and he'll be ready for Princeton on Saturday.
The only issues revolve around the three. On offense, Penn shot only 25% outside of Martz. That problem is smaller than the concern on the defensive end.
Penn came into the game allowing 36.7% from 3 against D-1 opponents. Howard entered with 33.2% from 3, basically the national average, and shot 47%. They'll need to do better against Princeton.
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Quakers03
Professor
Posts: 12530
Reg: 12-07-04
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Re: Howard
12-30-19 10:07 PM - Post#295638
In response to weinhauers_ghost
I’m already having nightmares about AJ picking up cheap fouls vs Yale and getting crushed inside. Not much to take from this other than Max hitting 3s and Ryan shooting himself out of a slump. What has happened to Bryce is a mystery. Dingle jogged off the court ok...hopefully it was rest.
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SomeGuy
Professor
Posts: 6412
Reg: 11-22-04
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12-30-19 11:35 PM - Post#295657
In response to weinhauers_ghost
The thing that continues to surprise me is that Donahue doesn’t try an offense that just lets MLL run the floor and dunk, but basically stay out of the way in the half court offense. Why does he have to play the high post? The answer is probably a combination of that he’ll need to do it eventually, so they want him to learn to do it, and for continuity they don’t want to change the whole offense based on whether or not AJ is in the game. But I’d kind of like to pull out all the stops to win this year with the 3 great seniors, and I think a look that can defend big 4s with MLL or Simmons paired with AJ would at least be useful to have in the bag of tricks.
Watching how things run now, I think Wang is going to be the 5 next year. Maybe he plays too small on the defensive end to do it, but he’s the one guy who can really pass from the high post. Needs to get healthy of course.
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TheLine
Professor
Posts: 5597
Age: 60
Reg: 07-07-09
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12-31-19 09:28 AM - Post#295667
In response to SomeGuy
It's possible the defensive end is the bigger issue. Brodeur is a very good rim defender but doesn't have to defend the outside much. MLL has been used as a stay at home rim defender as well. Can either defend someone quicker? It would have to be MLL, can he do it? We cannot afford to have Brodeur picking up cheap fouls chasing. The defense relies heavily on switching but I don't think it's a good idea to task Brodeur with anything that raises the chances that he's going to pick up more fouls.
Donahue's offense is all about movement and spacing. If Brodeur and MLL are trying to occupy the same space then the offense won't work so well. Another possible issue is that Donahue feels MLL is too turnover prone to give extended minutes to.
Simmons still fouls too much so it's unlikely that using him in a two big set is going to work.
However, it won't surprise me if Donahue springs two big sets against a team like Yale.
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weinhauers_ghost
Postdoc
Posts: 2138
Age: 64
Loc: New York City
Reg: 12-14-09
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12-31-19 10:27 AM - Post#295668
In response to TheLine
However, it won't surprise me if Donahue springs two big sets against a team like Yale.
I wouldn't be surprised, either. I don't see how we defend Atkinson and Bruner successfully while giving up as much size as the lineups we have been using would indicate.
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TheLine
Professor
Posts: 5597
Age: 60
Reg: 07-07-09
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Howard
12-31-19 01:26 PM - Post#295676
In response to weinhauers_ghost
Some other thoughts on the game :
Ordinarily I hate games against weaker opposition, but Kenny Blakeney deserves credit for having his team well prepared. Howard was still outgunned but they played hard throughout. I hope Blakeney is given a long leash because he has a lot of work to do.
I spent most of the game following Monroe and Martz as best as I could given the limitations of the feed. Both are coming along on the defensive end though are still learning - there seems to be fewer missed assignments as the season goes on, which is a good sign. Monroe does pretty much everything well on the offensive end other than shoot from the outside. His cuts to the hoop are hard to stop given his size. Martz plays like a coach's son - high basketball IQ, knows where he should be on the court, drills outside shots with confidence.
The 3 starting seniors all had solid games but other than them, Martz and Monroe, no one else did anything noteworthy. Scott had limited impact, Simmons picked up 2 quick fouls and was yanked, Washington didn't look good at all. Jerome was OK but TBD what he can do against better opposition.
Seems like we have 6 players that SD has confidence in, assuming Dingle's injury is minor.
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penn nation
Professor
Posts: 21193
Reg: 12-02-04
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Re: Howard
12-31-19 02:20 PM - Post#295680
In response to TheLine
Martz is currently tied for 5th in all of DI in 3 point FG%:
http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketba ll/statis...
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PennFan10
Postdoc
Posts: 3585
Reg: 02-15-15
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12-31-19 02:31 PM - Post#295681
In response to penn nation
Bruner isn't really a post player or is about as much of one as Robert Baker from Harvard. He is a rim protector on D but offensively he doesn't play much back to the basket that I have seen. Martz or even Eddie Scott can guard him on that end. The bigger problem is Atkinson. He has really upped his game and is arguably Yale's MVP thus far. He has stretched his range out to the arc on occasion. He behind only Swain in FGA and has taken more FT's than anyone on the team.
AJ will have his hands full guarding him while Yale can alternate Bruner and Atkinson on AJ. Those two are on the floor together roughly 60% of the time for Yale.
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pennsive
Junior
Posts: 200
Reg: 11-21-04
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12-31-19 03:58 PM - Post#295686
In response to PennFan10
Everything we have seen last year and this year would suggest that Simmons plays offense and defense well only in short spurts and generally not both together. The same is true for Scott. When Wang was healthy, he was an offensive machine scoring and dishing, but his rebounding and defense were far from stellar, and now he is not in the mix for us this year. This leaves MLL to give us the extra rebounding and defensive presence to match with AJ in order to play the complimentary role Max the First did for us the past three years. Without that, we are playing hit and miss (pun intended) with our three pointers to take on Harvard and Yale. This may work some of the time but not consistently and likely not for back to back games on Harvard's court come tournament time. I vote for letting MLL play increasing amounts of time at the 4 and let him begin to spell AJ at the 5. When he is playing without AJ, he can be surrounded by three marksmen and one other who can get to the rim (we have several to choose from), and let MLL get the close in points to supplement what he will provide defensively. Next year, as Some Guy observed, a healthy Wang playing together with MLL will be a force in their own right-one especially on the offensive end and the other defensively.
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AsiaSunset
Postdoc
Posts: 4360
Reg: 11-21-04
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12-31-19 05:05 PM - Post#295692
In response to pennsive
I don’t see us going with two bigs or going away from the 3 ball this year. Let’s remember that Yale and Harvard will need to take one big out to the perimeter and chase Martz around. Best guess is Steve likes it that way, at least this year.
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weinhauers_ghost
Postdoc
Posts: 2138
Age: 64
Loc: New York City
Reg: 12-14-09
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12-31-19 05:16 PM - Post#295694
In response to AsiaSunset
I don’t see us going with two bigs or going away from the 3 ball this year. Let’s remember that Yale and Harvard will need to take one big out to the perimeter and chase Martz around. Best guess is Steve likes it that way, at least this year.
This only works if Martz gives us more points than he gives up defensively, and doesn't end up in constant foul trouble after being targeted when defending bigger forwards. He may turn out to be better at this next season, if he can get stronger.
The Ivy season is very different from out of conference play. We shall see if this strategy works.
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TheLine
Professor
Posts: 5597
Age: 60
Reg: 07-07-09
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12-31-19 06:09 PM - Post#295696
In response to weinhauers_ghost
Agree with you.
It's highly likely foul trouble and/or matchup challenges will play a role at some point. Plus those away weekends can be brutal.
Donahue will need to get creative sooner or later. It's likely going to be offense-defense switches at the end of halves on every dead ball, as he's done in past years.
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Old Bear
Postdoc
Posts: 3994
Reg: 11-23-04
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12-31-19 09:10 PM - Post#295703
In response to TheLine
I thought this was about Howard. Is HG returning to this board? Happy New Year!
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weinhauers_ghost
Postdoc
Posts: 2138
Age: 64
Loc: New York City
Reg: 12-14-09
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12-31-19 09:18 PM - Post#295705
In response to Old Bear
Aren't you supposed to be hibernating, Old Bear?
Happy new year to you, too.
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Old Bear
Postdoc
Posts: 3994
Reg: 11-23-04
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Howard
12-31-19 09:40 PM - Post#295706
In response to weinhauers_ghost
I am about 30 minutes away from hibernation for the rest of 2109. After that, I will go back to beat Penn mode.
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palestra38
Professor
Posts: 32809
Reg: 11-21-04
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Re: Howard
12-31-19 09:55 PM - Post#295707
In response to Old Bear
I guess you're hibernating like Rip Van Winkle.
Happy New Year.
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SomeGuy
Professor
Posts: 6412
Reg: 11-22-04
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12-31-19 10:53 PM - Post#295708
In response to weinhauers_ghost
That’s not really how either the Yale or Harvard offense works though. Neither Bruner nor Baker presents a big matchup problem for a smaller defender.
I want to see the look at times because I think it helps us to rebound and defend better, but that is more about having a 2nd potential rim protector when AJ gets drawn away. Overall, though, I think our primary approach works fine.
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Quakers03
Professor
Posts: 12530
Reg: 12-07-04
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Re: Howard
01-01-20 01:45 AM - Post#295709
In response to TheLine
The 3 starting seniors all had solid games but other than them, Martz and Monroe, no one else did anything noteworthy. Scott had limited impact, Simmons picked up 2 quick fouls and was yanked, Washington didn't look good at all. Jerome was OK but TBD what he can do against better opposition.
Seems like we have 6 players that SD has confidence in, assuming Dingle's injury is minor.
This is why getting Jonah Charles back is so important. No offense to anyone, but from what I saw at the red and blue scrimmage, he should immediately replace ten+ lineup minutes from some folks who shouldn't have them.
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weinhauers_ghost
Postdoc
Posts: 2138
Age: 64
Loc: New York City
Reg: 12-14-09
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Re: Howard
01-01-20 02:00 AM - Post#295710
In response to Quakers03
The 3 starting seniors all had solid games but other than them, Martz and Monroe, no one else did anything noteworthy. Scott had limited impact, Simmons picked up 2 quick fouls and was yanked, Washington didn't look good at all. Jerome was OK but TBD what he can do against better opposition.
Seems like we have 6 players that SD has confidence in, assuming Dingle's injury is minor.
This is why getting Jonah Charles back is so important. No offense to anyone, but from what I saw at the red and blue scrimmage, he should immediately replace ten+ lineup minutes from some folks who shouldn't have them.
If he's as good a shooter as I've heard he's supposed to be...
Edited by weinhauers_ghost on 01-01-20 02:01 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
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Charlie Fog
Masters Student
Posts: 586
Age: 55
Loc: Philly
Reg: 11-12-13
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01-01-20 08:02 AM - Post#295711
In response to weinhauers_ghost
anyone know what is ailing Charles?
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