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Username Post: Lions Lose Again Down The Stretch        (Topic#23902)
Columbia 37P6 
Postdoc
Posts: 2163

Reg: 02-14-06
02-01-20 09:17 PM - Post#298310    

"Unlucky" Coach Engles, does it again as the Lions lose still another close game in the last few minutes, this time by a 72-66 score to Brown. Engles, who could probably write the book on the subject, somehow pushed all the wrong buttons for the umpteenth time in the last four years as the Lions allowed Brown to go on a 10-0 run in the final minutes of the game. This time the losing combination included(a) taking Ike Nweke off the floor with about three minutes left to play which enabled Brown's powerful frontcourt player ,Gainey ,to score and then coming up with an offensive set that included a jump shot from NBA land. Not winning almost every close game in four years is difficult to do, but Engles somehow does it again and again.

 
Old Bear 
Postdoc
Posts: 3988

Reg: 11-23-04
02-01-20 10:40 PM - Post#298321    
    In response to Columbia 37P6

I ma not an Engles basher, but there must be something available besides giving Smith the ball in the last 5 minutes and clearing out everyone else.

 
Tod Howard Hawks 
Freshman
Posts: 64

Age: 79
Reg: 03-17-14
02-01-20 11:02 PM - Post#298328    
    In response to Old Bear

I feel sorry for the players.


 
Chet Forte 
Postdoc
Posts: 2958

Reg: 03-02-08
02-02-20 08:26 AM - Post#298346    
    In response to Tod Howard Hawks

This is a team which never misses an opportunity to miss an opportunity. Again we snatched defeat from the jaws of victory. And yes, I blame Engles. He cannot win on the road and cannot win close games. It just isn’t working. Smith is not being used properly. Bibbs should be a all Ivy player if properly coached—he can be another N Agho. And Nweke can be a monster up front. Forrest should be taking more shots. And even if the shots are not falling defense can still be tight. How about calling Sydney Johnson and seeing if he is ready to return to coaching.


 
internetter 
Postdoc
Posts: 3399

Loc: Los Angeles
Reg: 11-21-04
02-02-20 10:46 PM - Post#298434    
    In response to Chet Forte

See Penn, Yale, Brown away last year for JE's record of games on the road.
Nonetheless, the Smith situation is less than explainable.
west coast fan


 
Dr. V 
PhD Student
Posts: 1536

Reg: 11-21-04
02-03-20 01:45 PM - Post#298477    
    In response to internetter

Clearly the critics are right. We missed our last 10 shots in the Brown game. It's just indefensible that neither Engles nor Sears nor Czech could hit their respective corner jumpers or drives to the bucket!

More seriously, why didn't our coaches put in that player who won on a last second shot at Penn last year? You mean Ellis? He's out with injury or illness. Well, why didn't they put in that player who in overtime almost singlehandedly beat Harvard at Harvard last year??? You mean Stefanini? He's been out the entire season post surgery. Well, for Pete's sake, why wasn't that tall player who played so well the second half of the season for us in the game? You mean Tape? He's decided to enjoy being wined and dined by high majors looking for a transfer this season, so he bailed on the team. Well, what about that very quick guard from Washington, how come he isn't playing or playing more? You mean Turner? He's been hurt and is just now beginning to start playing again.

For anyone even mildly interested in reality: we are trying to operate while firing on only 2 out of 4 cylinders. Given that fact, what is surprising is that we have been as close as we have in so many games, not that we have failed to cross the finish line. The coaches have tried everything towards the end of games: holding the ball, playing straight up, an open jumper and Smith drives. In many instances, none of those have worked because we don't have enough experienced horses. It's really that simple.

Step away from our team for a minute. Michigan began the season by beating everyone in sight. Then it lost a key player and went into a swoon, and that's just one player. Harvard, which on paper has by far more talent than anyone in the league just got swept by the Ps. Why? It is missing several key players.

Now unless you want to blame our coaches for the injuries and illnesses our players have suffered and/or for Tape deciding to chase some NBA fantasy,or whatever, and/or Faulds becoming home sick, then yes, our coaches have had an unusually bad run of luck.

From all indications, the players on our team, including the walking wounded, have all along manifested a strong sense of team solidarity. They have played pretty good D, and they are giving their all. First years are being brought along. The incoming class has some good players and it appears we are in on some good players who are currently juniors. Those are all of the factors on which to judge a staff. And with the facts, the facts on the ground and not some imaginings, being what they are in terms of player availability, we are doing well.

 
Chet Forte 
Postdoc
Posts: 2958

Reg: 03-02-08
02-03-20 03:13 PM - Post#298482    
    In response to Dr. V

Dr. V, I think all of us share the same passion for Columbia basketball (and in my case Columbia football as well). And for sure, we have had some horrific breaks this year. But the simple fact is that we have had three losing seasons in a row and appear to be on our way to a fourth. I am not saying that JE is another Mangurian, far from it. He seems like a very decent, and fair minded guy despite his rather dour personality and apparent inability to do any outreach to the fan/alumni base. All I am saying is that successive losing seasons have a way of raising legitimate questions about the direction of the program. I hope your optimism is rewarded and that I have to eat my words.


 
HARVARDDADGRAD 
Postdoc
Posts: 2685

Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
02-03-20 03:33 PM - Post#298484    
    In response to Chet Forte

Did you ever have Smith, Stefanini and Tape on the court together? That team would absolutely make the Ivy Tournament.

 
Chet Forte 
Postdoc
Posts: 2958

Reg: 03-02-08
02-03-20 04:36 PM - Post#298488    
    In response to HARVARDDADGRAD

Last year we never got a chance to see Smith play with Tape and Stef; but the latter two were all Ivy second team and HM, and by the end of the season were playing lights out. If we had them this year we would have had our best team since the Kyle Smith CIT team, and perhaps even better. Stef’s injury was a shame, but I really have no words which can adequately express my feelings for what Tape did to his teammates, his coaches, and his school on the eve of the season.


 
HARVARDDADGRAD 
Postdoc
Posts: 2685

Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
02-03-20 04:51 PM - Post#298489    
    In response to Chet Forte

It's a shame that the 3 of them never played together. Last year with Adlesh and this year the Lions would have been a real contender. You may have problems with your coach, but he had things set up well. Regardless, last year's team without Smith gave the Crimson all they could handle.

I certainly understand your pain as Amaker had things set up for this year and last but the Gods intervened.

Yale had the same issue once Mason went down.

I feel your pain.

 
PeteD 
Masters Student
Posts: 553
PeteD
Loc: California
Reg: 03-13-07
02-04-20 02:37 PM - Post#298539    
    In response to HARVARDDADGRAD

If memory serves correctly, a few people wanted to run Kyle Smith out of town. With the loss of Stefanini and Tape, if you expected this team to finish better than 4-10 this season, I’d say your expectations are too high.

 
Columbia 37P6 
Postdoc
Posts: 2163

Reg: 02-14-06
02-04-20 06:22 PM - Post#298556    
    In response to PeteD

Pete, I was not one of them.

In my opinion, Kyle Smith was a terrific coach at Columbia where he compiled a 101-82 record and led the team to a CIF Tournament Championship in 2015-16, his last season Smith was successful at Columbia despite a number of injuries to key players like Alex Rosenberg and Grant Mullins. No one has ever questioned Smith's tremendous skills as a game coach, recruiter, teacher, motivator, and communicator with the players and alumni. Somehow, Columbia let Smith get away to the University of San Francisco where he enjoyed three successful seasons before Washington State came after him and hired him as its head coach this season. In his first year at Washington State, Smith has improved Washington State's record from 11-21 overall to 13-10 thus far. Two of his assistant coaches at Columbia are assistants at Washington State. Compare Smith's record with that of his successor, Jim Engles whose record at Columbia is something like 35-67 with ten more games remaining this season, all of which are likely to be projected as losses. Yes, "Jim Engles has had his share of player illnesses, injuries and defections, but with the graduation of senior star point guard, Mike Smith in June, next year looks very challenging. Frankly, based upon what I have seen of "Unlucky" Jim Engles the past four years, I am just mystified how he has survived thus far. I know Columbia is not Syracuse, Ohio State, Princeton Harvard or Penn, but doesn't anyone including President Bollinger care at all. Is a 35-67 record with abundant player defections what Bollinger wanted when he hired Engles?

 
Billy Hoyle 
Freshman
Posts: 82

Age: 50
Loc: Roar-ee's Lair
Reg: 12-17-14
02-05-20 03:27 PM - Post#298632    
    In response to Columbia 37P6

I love Kyle and you cannot deny the success he had here, but he also had his share of recruiting mistakes (and Rosenberg was a Jones recruit) and his best players graduated at the end of Smith's tenure. He didn't leave Engles with much. Voss, Eberle, Hunter, McComber, Panayiotou, Sica, Barba, all guys who contributed very little to nothing. And who knows how this season goes if Tape doesn't bail and others are healthy.

Not to say that Engles should stay after this season, but let's face it, based on CU's history Smith was an outlier when it comes to his success.
I can hear Jimi!


 
Chet Forte 
Postdoc
Posts: 2958

Reg: 03-02-08
02-05-20 04:28 PM - Post#298637    
    In response to Billy Hoyle

I think we have done our fair share of shooting at a stationary target up to this point: It isn’t as if the players have quit on the coach (see, e.g., Mangurian), or that they have not played hard, or even that they have been out coached (except perhaps for crunch time). But to me Coach Engles, admittedly from my vantage point, simply has lacked enough success on the recruiting trail to permit us to put a better product on the court. I am sure that he is a decent and honorable man who knows the game, but he does seem to be rather dour and joyless, which may spill over to recruiting. I am a firm believer that a HC should live around campus and not be a commuter so as to be a larger part of his players’ lives.


 
Dr. V 
PhD Student
Posts: 1536

Reg: 11-21-04
02-06-20 11:26 AM - Post#298683    
    In response to Chet Forte

I see that a Trumpean post-fact attitude and a relevance-shmelevance approach are now gaining on our board.

For the tenth time, the facts are that Kyle Smith left a most empty cupboard when he left and Lo, Mullins and Rosie graduated. And the facts are that over the last several years, we've had an unusually bad run of luck with injuries and unexpected transfers. Yes, Mullins did get hurt, but not Mullins and Lo. And in the best Kyle season, the '15-'16 season, none of our major contributors got hurt. Do facts matter any more?

Yes, Kyle is a good coach, but what is the relevance of that to the fact that we are currently hobbled by player absences? None. But if we do want to talk about Kyle, let's recall that as a matter of fact and record he was, altogether without basis, attacked on this board by people who accused him of racism because one of his black players transferred out, and he was criticized for being too annoying and aggressive with refs during games. And, of course, even during his best season, the '15-'16 season, we only came in third in the league. But what does any of this have to do with Stefanini and Ellis being hurt or ill or Tape having left?

I think we've demonstrated that we have the wackiest batch of "fans" in the league. Maybe it's time to give it a rest.

 
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