Streamers
Professor
Posts: 8141
Loc: NW Philadelphia
Reg: 11-21-04
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02-10-20 09:30 AM - Post#299358
In response to palestra38
When I think about this, I suspect the ‘trade’ is Betley’s minutes to Martz and Scott. Shooting, ball handling and passing suffer a bit, but rebounds, defense and inside points gain, especially as Martz improves in these areas. What suffers most is the experience needed when playing league games. It is also bit worrisome that there are now only 8 guys SD is comfortable putting out there. I still think they get to 8 wins, but that’s one less than I was projecting going into the weekend.
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weinhauers_ghost
Postdoc
Posts: 2125
Age: 64
Loc: New York City
Reg: 12-14-09
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Re: @Cornell 02-10-20 10:20 AM - Post#299361
In response to palestra38
Betley was not getting to the line, though. Fewer than 2 FT per game. I think the new guys will draw a lot more fouls. But our FT shooting appears to have been improving as the season goes on. Playing these close games allows the guys to experience and overcome pressure.
I'm pretty sure that most of Betley's FT attempts came as the result of late-game, must foul situations in close games. P38 is correct in that he wasn't getting to the line very often earlier in games.
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penn nation
Professor
Posts: 21086
Reg: 12-02-04
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Re: @Cornell 02-10-20 10:34 AM - Post#299362
In response to weinhauers_ghost
I'm pretty sure that most of Betley's FT attempts came as the result of late-game, must foul situations in close games.
Exactly. That is what worries me most going forward. No one on the floor who is a decent bet out there.
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10Q
Professor
Posts: 23199
Loc: Suburban Philly
Reg: 11-21-04
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02-10-20 10:44 AM - Post#299363
In response to penn nation
Maybe they can tape Ryan up and put him in there at the end of games. He can probably pivot on the good leg.
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palestra38
Professor
Posts: 32685
Reg: 11-21-04
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Re: @Cornell 02-10-20 10:44 AM - Post#299364
In response to penn nation
We've been hitting most of our shots down the stretch in recent games. Even Dingle, who was missing earlier, was missing. As I said, Betley was only averaging 1.7 FTs per game. It is not as though he was getting the ball on the inbounds scrums anyway.
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TheLine
Professor
Posts: 5597
Age: 60
Reg: 07-07-09
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02-10-20 10:50 AM - Post#299365
In response to 10Q
Maybe they can tape Ryan up and put him in there at the end of games. He can probably pivot on the good leg.
No.
Have you ever had a bad ankle sprain?
The season depends on AJ/Dev continuing what they've been doing, Martz/Dingle progressing (which can be a tough to do for Frosh going thru the league the 2nd time), and Scott proving this weekend is a new baseline for his play and not a mirage.
Who is going to be the 6th man now? Not sure.
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penn nation
Professor
Posts: 21086
Reg: 12-02-04
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@Cornell 02-10-20 10:54 AM - Post#299367
In response to TheLine
Who is going to be the 6th man now? Not sure.
Probably depends on match ups. The only guys SD has been putting out there are Jerome, Simmons and Monroe (what ever did happen to Washington, anyways?). Against a Yale, Simmons is going to have to see more court time against their bigs. Unless SD thinks Penn can be a Houston Rockets and go small (not likely considering we have no outside threat other than Martz).
Edited by penn nation on 02-10-20 10:54 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
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PennFan10
Postdoc
Posts: 3580
Reg: 02-15-15
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02-10-20 11:00 AM - Post#299369
In response to penn nation
Washington was dressed and on the bench this weekend. Not sure his status but would be great to see him have a resurgence.
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palestra38
Professor
Posts: 32685
Reg: 11-21-04
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Re: @Cornell 02-10-20 11:10 AM - Post#299370
In response to penn nation
Dingle is an outside threat---and Goodman has taken his game up a notch.
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penn nation
Professor
Posts: 21086
Reg: 12-02-04
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Re: @Cornell 02-10-20 11:14 AM - Post#299371
In response to palestra38
Dingle is an outside threat---and Goodman has taken his game up a notch.
We weren't a good 3 pt shooting team even with Betley in the lineup. Current 32.1% rate ranks tied for 246th.
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10Q
Professor
Posts: 23199
Loc: Suburban Philly
Reg: 11-21-04
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02-10-20 11:27 AM - Post#299373
In response to TheLine
I wasn't being serious. I know all about ankle injuries.
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palestra38
Professor
Posts: 32685
Reg: 11-21-04
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Re: @Cornell 02-10-20 11:40 AM - Post#299374
In response to penn nation
It's not horrible given how good we are inside.
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Chip Bayers
Professor
Posts: 6997
Loc: New York
Reg: 11-21-04
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@Cornell 02-10-20 12:41 PM - Post#299391
In response to palestra38
Let’s see how teams adjust their defenses now that they’re down to only 1 reliable 3-point shooter in Martz, who until Saturday hadn’t even been able to get perimeter shots up in league play. His effectiveness in the paint yesterday was encouraging, and it was good to see multiple guys attack the rim and score, but Cornell is a terrible defensive team across the board, so a little expectation tempering is in order.
It’s going to start getting a lot harder to get quality 2-point shots this coming weekend, especially Saturday. Teams have spent most of the year trying to deny Penn the perimeter—that may change in a hurry now that the most successful volume shooter they had is gone, and everyone left apart from Martz has ranged from at best mediocre (Dingle) to bad (Goodman, Jerome, Scott) to outright terrible (Brodeur, Washington, Simmons, Monroe). Don’t be surprised if we start seeing some heavy sagging into the paint come Friday.
Edited by Chip Bayers on 02-10-20 12:43 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
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penn nation
Professor
Posts: 21086
Reg: 12-02-04
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02-10-20 12:43 PM - Post#299393
In response to Chip Bayers
I was going to write pretty much the same thing, Chip. I think teams will be more than happy to let Goodman and Dingle fire away from deep.
Let’s see how teams adjust their defenses now that they’re down to only 1 reliable 3-point shooter in Martz, who until Saturday hadn’t even been able to get perimeter shots up in league play. His effectiveness in the paint yesterday was encouraging, and it was good to see multiple guys attack the rim and score, but Cornell is a terrible defensive team across the board.
It’s going to start getting a lot harder to get quality 2-point shots this coming weekend, especially Saturday. Teams have spent most of the year trying to deny Penn the perimeter—that may change in a hurry now that the most successful volume shooter they had is gone, and everyone left apart from Martz has been ranged from at best mediocre (Dingle) to bad (Goodman, Jerome, Scott) to outright terrible (Brodeur, Washington, Simmons, Monroe). Don’t be surprised if we start seeing some heavy sagging into the paint come Friday.
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SomeGuy
Professor
Posts: 6391
Reg: 11-22-04
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02-10-20 01:20 PM - Post#299407
In response to Streamers
I agree that defense will improve with Martz/Scott playing instead of Betley. Rebounding, however, will not, particularly on the defensive end. Betley’s defensive rebounding percentage is 18.4%, which is a close second to AJ among the guys in the rotation. Martz is 8.8% (only Jerome gets fewer defensive rebounds). Even with continued improvement, he’s not going to make us better in that regard. Scott is right in between, at 13.3%. Both guys are better offensive rebounders than Betley (who basically just turns and goes back to play defense on every shot).
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SteveChop
PhD Student
Posts: 1150
Reg: 07-28-07
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Re: @Cornell 02-10-20 04:06 PM - Post#299439
In response to penn nation
PN - as to your question about Bryce Washington, he has been wearing a bandage/brace on his right wrist and (shooting) hand and still had it on yesterday. Not sure of the type or extent of his injury but that may make him unlikely to get much PT until there is more healing.
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Streamers
Professor
Posts: 8141
Loc: NW Philadelphia
Reg: 11-21-04
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02-10-20 06:17 PM - Post#299460
In response to SteveChop
This is really unfortunate as last year's version of Bryce could fill the shooting and even some of the rebounding void that SG mentions that Betley leaves. The latter was a surprise to me when I looked it up. My eyes did not see Betley as a significant rebounding asset - I still think Dev is better for a guard - but then I remembered Betley has an uncanny knack for tracking down the longer rebounds.
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penn nation
Professor
Posts: 21086
Reg: 12-02-04
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02-10-20 08:28 PM - Post#299475
In response to Streamers
Well, at least the first portion of last year's Bryce. His shooting touch did not last the whole season but, yes, this team could definitely use more of what he provided in the early going.
This is really unfortunate as last year's version of Bryce could fill the shooting and even some of the rebounding void that SG mentions that Betley leaves. The latter was a surprise to me when I looked it up. My eyes did not see Betley as a significant rebounding asset - I still think Dev is better for a guard - but then I remembered Betley has an uncanny knack for tracking down the longer rebounds.
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Penndemonium
PhD Student
Posts: 1878
Reg: 11-29-04
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02-11-20 12:37 AM - Post#299497
In response to penn nation
I hate losing Betley. He is a guy who plays well under pressure and has always been composed. He is our only real shooter. I have not watched Martz a lot recently, but early in the season he looked very slow on defense. Hoping he has improved in the meantime. Hopefully this is the time when Goodman decides he is a senior and is going to play like this is his last stand. This is around the time when Foreman came to life his senior year. It's fine with me if one of the underclassman takes control too!
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LyleGold
PhD Student
Posts: 1712
Reg: 11-22-04
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02-11-20 07:49 AM - Post#299505
In response to Penndemonium
It seems like both of those things are happening. Martz has come back to life and shown he can do more than just shoot 3s. Dev has asserted himself like this is his last stand. Nobody is glad that Betley is injured, but this does accelerate our transition to the future. So far, the guys who are likely to inherit his minutes, including Eddie Scott, have responded. Frankly, Ryan's return had very mixed results this year.
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