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Username Post: Yale 1        (Topic#23981)
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 32685

Reg: 11-21-04
Re: Yale 1
02-15-20 11:04 PM - Post#300298    
    In response to OldBig5

This was a truly inspirational win. Despite another terrible game from the guards, AJ and Scott hit huge shots down the stretch and pulled out an ominous looking 5 point deficit with 5 to go with an 11 point run. While I still cannot understand why when our switch to a midrange game early was working, we changed back to 3 pointers or bust, we hit them when it mattered. Now we have to beat Dartmouth and win 1 of 3 at Harvard, Yale and Brown , while holding serve at home against the Cs. Should be interesting.

 
penn nation 
Professor
Posts: 21086

Reg: 12-02-04
Re: Yale 1
02-15-20 11:09 PM - Post#300300    
    In response to palestra38

Beating Harvard is the most important of those 3, followed by Brown and then Yale.

If we beat Harvard next week (assuming we can beat D), that is putting Harvard in a very, very tough spot. We will have swept the head to head in addition to being up at least 1 game (depending on how they do against Princeton, who is suddenly our best friend down the stretch).

Edited by penn nation on 02-15-20 11:13 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
PennFan10 
Postdoc
Posts: 3580

Reg: 02-15-15
02-16-20 12:17 AM - Post#300309    
    In response to penn nation

This win is as confounding as last nights loss. None of it makes any sense. But such is the life of this high variance team. Dingle with a 58 oRat and Dev with a 76 oRat. I would have thought that would be the death sentence but AJ showing why he should be the MVP of the league with 19 and 8 with 5 assist, 3 blocks and 4 steals. A monster weekend for him to get us right back into the race. Crazy town for sure.

 
Chip Bayers 
Professor
Posts: 6997
Chip Bayers
Loc: New York
Reg: 11-21-04
Yale 1
02-16-20 12:36 AM - Post#300310    
    In response to PennFan10

Our “mid-range game” consisted of Martz hitting a jumper from the paint with a guy draped all over him, and Dingle hitting a floater from 8 feet. That was in the first 8 points we scored. Horrible low-percentage shots, but we got lucky so cool.

After that, no mid-range. There were always at least three guys within arms length of the paint because they were always ready to double Brodeur. The presence of those three also meant no uncontested mid-range shots. The defense preventing those was that much better because Yale, like Brown, has long-armed guys beyond just Atkinson and Bruner.

Maybe when teams zone there might be some gaps available for jumpers in the 12-15 foot range. But no one zones us because we don’t have a ton of guys who can break down a man-to-man off the dribble.

Dingle did that in November/December but scouting has caught up with his tendencies. Goodman’s speed is great in broken open floor play, or when he’s cutting behind a double on Brodeur, but his handle isn’t solid enough to hurt a defender faced up in the half court.


Edited by Chip Bayers on 02-16-20 12:37 AM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
SomeGuy 
Professor
Posts: 6391

Reg: 11-22-04
Re: Yale 1
02-16-20 02:09 AM - Post#300314    
    In response to palestra38

I didn’t think Goodman was terrible, despite the low ORAT. Thought he outplayed Swain, which is a tough assignment. Great D, no turnovers. He didn’t put the ball in the basket, but still a solid game.

 
AsiaSunset 
Postdoc
Posts: 4350

Reg: 11-21-04
Re: Yale 1
02-16-20 06:40 AM - Post#300318    
    In response to SomeGuy

I totally agree. It would be nice if a few 3’s went in, but he did a good job on Azir and I only saw one of his wild chucks off the backboard on an attempt at the rim. He had another just roll off but it was a legit layup.

 
Quakers03 
Professor
Posts: 12480

Reg: 12-07-04
02-16-20 08:35 AM - Post#300324    
    In response to AsiaSunset

I know Anderson is a different type of player but with what he did Friday, and the way I’ve seen Swain take over games, I was not expecting a great defensive effort. They all stepped it up.

 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 32685

Reg: 11-21-04
Yale 1
02-16-20 08:55 AM - Post#300327    
    In response to Quakers03

Yes, Goodman played better defense against Swain than Anderson, but as noted, he is a different kind of player. Still, 4-12, 0-4 from 3 is a pretty rough line offensively against a guy he could break down off the dribble.

But how about those lines of AJ and Scott (who had his best game as a Quaker, 4 OT games not counting):

AJ: 7-13, 3-4 from 3, 8 reb, 5 ast, 4 steals, 3 blocks, 19 pts

Scott: 6-7, 2-2 from 3,4-5 from the line, 3 reb, 3 assists, 18 points

I think most of us would be shaking their heads if anyone predicted we would beat Yale with our big men firing it up from outside and cutting to the hoop

 
Streamers 
Professor
Posts: 8141
Streamers
Loc: NW Philadelphia
Reg: 11-21-04
02-16-20 10:10 AM - Post#300337    
    In response to palestra38

When I looked up at the board after a Scott baseline 3 (Of the sort he had a numerous occasions on Friday and would not take) and realized he had 16 at that point, all I could think of was that he was the difference between the two games this weekend. I don’t know if he can repeat this, but if he can attract some defensive attention, it will help a lot next weekend.

 
SomeGuy 
Professor
Posts: 6391

Reg: 11-22-04
02-16-20 10:25 AM - Post#300338    
    In response to Streamers

Interestingly, we were only +2 with Scott in the game last night. But in his final stretch in the game, we were +10 as we put Yale away.

Kind of chicken and egg as to whether he played a longer stretch because he was playing well, or whether he played well because he got a longer stretch.

He played a Steve type of game. All 3s and dunks/layups.

 
SomeGuy 
Professor
Posts: 6391

Reg: 11-22-04
02-16-20 10:34 AM - Post#300341    
    In response to SomeGuy

Also, I thought playing Simmons with AJ worked great last night on both offense and defense. We were +7 when they were on court together, I believe.

Atkinson eventually got his, but we made him work.

 
Streamers 
Professor
Posts: 8141
Streamers
Loc: NW Philadelphia
Reg: 11-21-04
Yale 1
02-16-20 11:32 AM - Post#300352    
    In response to SomeGuy

  • SomeGuy Said:
Also, I thought playing Simmons with AJ worked great last night on both offense and defense. We were +7 when they were on court together, I believe.

Atkinson eventually got his, but we made him work.


Once Atkinson figured Simmons out, Jarrod was defenseless and got a quick hook. I agree starting him was effective, but not for long.

Let’s also consider Bruner was clearly limited despite that insane 3 at the end.

 
SomeGuy 
Professor
Posts: 6391

Reg: 11-22-04
Re: Yale 1
02-16-20 11:44 AM - Post#300354    
    In response to Streamers

Weirdly, though, Simmons struggled more defensively when AJ was off the floor.

 
Quakers03 
Professor
Posts: 12480

Reg: 12-07-04
Re: Yale 1
02-16-20 03:37 PM - Post#300377    
    In response to SomeGuy

  • SomeGuy Said:
Weirdly, though, Simmons struggled more defensively when AJ was off the floor.


Atkinson scored a quarter of his points in that one minute spurt where Steve yanked AJ too early. He usually does it at about 12:30-13:00, depending on stoppage, but this one was at 14+. I don’t know if he thought he could steal all those extra minutes through the 12 timeout but that was a frightening stretch when thinking about next year. MLL better work on his offense because he’s going to play a lot.

 
UPIA1968 
PhD Student
Posts: 1117
UPIA1968
Loc: Cornwall, PA
Reg: 11-20-06
02-16-20 05:16 PM - Post#300388    
    In response to Chip Bayers

A.J. is a dream player who started as a star then got better each year. His offensive rating has improved each year, so has his assists, turnovers, and FT shooting.

The real test will be the record of the team when he leaves, like with Russell and the Celts. Given how much he means to a 150 ranked team, Penn will need remarkable improvements from its returning players to do as well next year. As usual it will be fun to spend the Summer fantasizing about how that will happen. Rationality says we are looking at a 200+ year in 2021.

But that is then. Penn just handled Yale on a night when it didn't play all that well on offense. How bout a repeat against Yale in the first game of the tournament then a rematch against the Pussies for a dance ticket. Like I said, it is fun to fantasize.

As to the why this team wins and looses - I looked at all the good wins and bad losses.

In eight of the thirteen games the winner shot better than average from three.

In every case the winner shot better overall.

In two cases Penn had more o boards, both losses. In all but one of the remaining thirteen Penn lost that battle.

The turnover ratios had no overall relationship to winning.

In summary it is about shooting or lack of the same. Put differently, better 3 shooting or better rebounding would have produced a memorable year.

 
Chip Bayers 
Professor
Posts: 6997
Chip Bayers
Loc: New York
Reg: 11-21-04
02-16-20 05:50 PM - Post#300392    
    In response to UPIA1968

Freshmen have already played 1300+ minutes combined this year. Probably get another 4-500 out of them through the end of the regular season. That’s a big positive for next year.


 
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