HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2691
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
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02-22-20 12:22 PM - Post#301206
Penn will be desperate. We better be ready this time.
Observation: Broduer likes to take 2 or 3 three's a game but is shooting 24.5%. He's make more than 1 such shot in a game only twice all season. Value is more to open up the lane when he gets the ball away from the hoop. I say let him shoot and watch the passing from the high post.
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mobrien
Masters Student
Posts: 402
Loc: New York
Reg: 04-18-17
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Penn II
02-22-20 02:20 PM - Post#301225
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
Kenpom has us as 7 point favorites, but, again, I’m expecting a close, close game. This team seems incapable of playing anything other than a one possession game.
Penn is going to be desperate, but so should we. This game is just as important for us. The big thing defensively is just making Penn earn everything by finishing over our length; no backdoors. Will be interesting if Forbes is able to hold up against Brodeur like he did against Aririguzoh last night. In any case, we’re probably going to need another big defensive game from Lewis, and hopefully some offense out of him too.
We were able to punish Penn on the offensive glass at the Palestra; it’d be huge if we could get some easy buckets that way again given our difficulties at times scoring in the half court without Aiken. Need Juzang and Kirkwood to both be aggressive attacking the basket too. And Baker is always the X-factor for us. He didn’t get lost on any back cuts last night, made some big threes, and got some big blocks. We’ll need more of that tonight.
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HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2691
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
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02-22-20 02:27 PM - Post#301228
In response to mobrien
Bassey was key at the Palestra, he owned the boards.
Maybe a Djuricic sighting? Bad matchup for him last night. Glad to see Rio start to hit some 3's - important.
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mobrien
Masters Student
Posts: 402
Loc: New York
Reg: 04-18-17
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02-22-20 04:16 PM - Post#301241
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
Good point. This should set up as a good game for both Bassey and Ledlum. They’re the kind of big, physical wings that Penn has tended to struggle with.
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PennFan10
Postdoc
Posts: 3585
Reg: 02-15-15
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02-22-20 04:45 PM - Post#301242
In response to mobrien
Bassey has been a Penn Killer. Ledlum, after 1 game as a datapoint, not so much. Kirkwood has struggled at times and killed us at times.
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HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2691
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
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02-22-20 08:27 PM - Post#301294
In response to PennFan10
After missing 4 at the hoop, starting to control the boards and looking better.
Kirkwood and Goodman with 2 fouls
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HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2691
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
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02-22-20 08:54 PM - Post#301338
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
Offense looks awful without Noah. Hopefully he avoids more foul trouble.
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mobrien
Masters Student
Posts: 402
Loc: New York
Reg: 04-18-17
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02-22-20 09:07 PM - Post#301357
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
For some reason, Penn is trying to guard our best player with their worst defender. Thank you for not coaching. Noah is lighting Martz up.
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HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2691
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
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02-22-20 09:09 PM - Post#301358
In response to mobrien
Harvard should be fresher down the stretch.
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HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2691
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
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02-22-20 09:25 PM - Post#301397
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
Really impressed with contributions deep off the bench. Tretout with two effective drives. Bassey misses a 3 from the corner and rifles in for rebound and put back.
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mobrien
Masters Student
Posts: 402
Loc: New York
Reg: 04-18-17
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02-22-20 09:49 PM - Post#301444
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
Up 4 and we didn’t foul! Great win. Given our track record, a four point margin feels like a blowout.
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HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2691
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
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02-22-20 09:50 PM - Post#301446
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
Nice weekend sweep of the P’s!
Followed the script. A well rested Harvard team outlasted a tired Brodeur and company.
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digamma
Masters Student
Posts: 468
Loc: Minneapolis
Reg: 11-27-11
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02-22-20 09:53 PM - Post#301447
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
Great win and weekend! Defense controlled all weekend.
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84grad
Junior
Posts: 277
Age: 64
Reg: 11-09-17
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02-22-20 11:32 PM - Post#301463
In response to digamma
Kirkwood. Nothing more need be said.
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mobrien
Masters Student
Posts: 402
Loc: New York
Reg: 04-18-17
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02-22-20 11:41 PM - Post#301465
In response to digamma
Pretty impressive that we won despite Penn shooting 40% from three. The reason was we absolutely crushed them on the offensive glass again; we had a 42% offensive rebound rate tonight, which even more impressively was a real collective effort.
Steve Donohue also deserves some credit for our win. He had Martz on Kirkwood and Simmons on Lewis — almost free baskets for us — for long stretches of the game, even when their better defenders weren’t in foul trouble. I get that he was trying to buy Brodeur some rest on the defensive end, but they just couldn’t afford to do that.
Tretout is emerging as an intriguing option off the bench. He has an unflappability about him, and a good sense for when to attack off the dribble. Missed a couple of threes, but otherwise gave us great minutes.
And finally, Bassey continued his ownage of Penn. Great work on the offensive glass, great hustle, and made a big three to give us our first lead in forever in that second half. He was the Kenpom MVP of the game.
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whitakk
Masters Student
Posts: 523
Age: 32
Reg: 11-11-14
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02-23-20 12:23 PM - Post#301512
In response to mobrien
11 of last 12 games have been decided by five points or less, what an absurd season.
The record for most close games (<=5 points or OT) in an Ivy season is 10, by Penn in 1984. Harvard is already at 9 (tied with several others, including Columbia last year and in 2012) with two weekends to go.
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HARVARDDADGRAD
Postdoc
Posts: 2691
Loc: New Jersey
Reg: 01-21-14
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02-23-20 12:32 PM - Post#301516
In response to whitakk
Moving this here and repeating for discussion.
There is more to Harvard's depth. Harvard has been weathering weak first halves, wearing down opponents, adjusting when necessary at halftime, then battling back in the second half. Been the formula vs Penn and other teams that rely on a few key starters for years. Players like Brodeur, Llewellyn and Smith are examples in just the past 3 games. I have been hard on Amaker for weak starts, but his genius is in the adjustments, stretching out his lineup and having the confidence to go with guys like Tretout (vs Penn) and Forbes (vs Princeton) late in games when circumstances call for a change in plans.
Here's the thing about Amaker that sets him apart. Amaker put together a 2019-20 team for the Ivy ages. Had everyone been healthy, the expectation of some professional prognosticators was to enter the Ivy season with 2 or less losses, coming only in the Orlando Tournament. An undefeated Ivy campaign was more than possible. Scoff if you want, but this team could have been 23-2 and in the top 25. Here's where Amaker is different. This rarified opportunity comes around once a decade in this league, or less frequently. Unfortunately, this opportunity was lost - but only due to injuries.
Without Aiken and Towns, Amaker and Harvard has pivoted. It's not easy, nor pretty, but this team is a few calls or shots away from being 10-0 at this point. That's impressive.
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mrjames
Professor
Posts: 6062
Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
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02-23-20 06:02 PM - Post#301570
In response to HARVARDDADGRAD
Amaker is an elite program builder and recruiter. Great at keeping the team focused and motivated. Talent development has been okay, but sort of a mixed bag. In-game coaching and strategy has been... no bueno.
As someone who started following Harvard under a coach who was exactly the opposite, it seems pretty obvious which combination is more important.
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iogyhufi
Masters Student
Posts: 681
Age: 27
Reg: 10-10-17
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02-23-20 06:52 PM - Post#301583
In response to mrjames
As a coach once remarked to me: "You know what makes you look like a genius? Good players."
I think Amaker's weakness in the tactical department puts an upper limit on how good Harvard can ever be, but look at where they were before! 100% of Harvard's IL titles came under Amaker! If this is their upper bound, then Harvard should be absolutely thrilled with it. Lotta worse things to be than "perennial Ivy League contender."
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whitakk
Masters Student
Posts: 523
Age: 32
Reg: 11-11-14
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02-24-20 01:08 AM - Post#301606
In response to whitakk
11 of last 12 games have been decided by five points or less, what an absurd season.
The record for most close games (<=5 points or OT) in an Ivy season is 10, by Penn in 1984. Harvard is already at 9 (tied with several others, including Columbia last year and in 2012) with two weekends to go.
One more: Harvard's streak of eight straight games decided by five points or fewer (before the Cornell game) was tied for the third-longest in DI since 2002 (Delaware went nine in 2013 and South Carolina State went 11 last year)
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mrjames
Professor
Posts: 6062
Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
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02-24-20 09:10 AM - Post#301610
In response to whitakk
Before we get too far down the road of the narrative that Harvard is barely surviving in Ivy games, I think the issue of final score and "control" are different.
For instance, here were some of the leads Harvard has held in Ivy play (we could expand this to some of the games just prior to Ivy play as well):
vs. Dartmouth +12 with 2 to play
at Dartmouth +13 with 1 to play
at Yale +13 with 5 to play
vs. Columbia +6 with 3 to play
vs. Princeton +4 with 2 to play
vs. Penn +8 with 2:30 to play
Harvard never trailed in the final five minutes of any of its Ivy wins (NOTE: it did trail Columbia at times in OT).
Its free throw percentage in Ivy play has been appalling, or else some of those games that ended up close might not have. Everyone kind of joked hyperbolically about where Harvard would miss Bryce the most as "being the closer," but I'd argue it's been worse than anyone could have feared.
And I don't think that's going to change much down the stretch. Harvard might not be a double-digit favorite the rest of the way, so if it can get the wins necessary to make the Ivy Tourney, I'd expect they'll continue to be close.
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Noah Friedman
Freshman
Posts: 34
Age: 25
Reg: 01-19-20
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02-24-20 01:49 PM - Post#301631
In response to mrjames
Does anybody know if aikien has a chance to come back this year or what is going on with Spencer freedman. Aikien could be the key going forwards and could be the difference of going on a run in the ncaa tournament
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mrjames
Professor
Posts: 6062
Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
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02-24-20 02:26 PM - Post#301635
In response to Noah Friedman
My guess is the next time we see Aiken it’ll be in a suit on Senior Night.
No question he’s an insane fit for what Harvard is lacking right now, more than even Towns would be, but I don’t see it. If he was coming back this year, it would have been for that Dartmouth game where he was expected back but wasn’t cleared morning of. When that happened, it was pretty clear it was over.
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PennFan10
Postdoc
Posts: 3585
Reg: 02-15-15
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02-24-20 03:00 PM - Post#301646
In response to mrjames
Another bizarre, mystery injury for Harvard. If you are supposed to be cleared for a game, and subsequently are not, that usually means you aren't quite ready and then come back a week later. So either he re-injured it (or worse) in shoot around, which shut him down, or the original info was inaccurate. Either way, its in the Harvard blackhole now where all reasonable communications go to die.
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84grad
Junior
Posts: 277
Age: 64
Reg: 11-09-17
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02-24-20 03:08 PM - Post#301649
In response to PennFan10
Aiken will NOT be playing this year.
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welcometothejungle
Masters Student
Posts: 788
Age: 27
Reg: 07-31-19
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Penn II
02-24-20 03:36 PM - Post#301655
In response to PennFan10
Either way, its in the Harvard blackhole now where all reasonable communications go to die.
I’m not really sure this is unique to Harvard. Wasn’t Stefanini supposed to be back by now? Has Engles said anything on his status? Will Gladson hasn’t suited up for Princeton for a year and a half, and there hasn’t been anything on him. Injury news around the league is pretty tough to find. If anything at least Aiken and Towns have had tweets from Jon Rothstein when they’re out which is more info than most players in the league get
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mrjames
Professor
Posts: 6062
Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
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Re: Penn II
02-24-20 03:43 PM - Post#301658
In response to welcometothejungle
That doesn't advance the narrative that Harvard is being secretive which benefits it in some way no one has identified yet.
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PennFan10
Postdoc
Posts: 3585
Reg: 02-15-15
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02-24-20 04:31 PM - Post#301659
In response to mrjames
It was public within a day that Stefanini had a season ending lisfranc foot injury and subsequently had surgery.
Gladson's situation was documented 2 years ago if I recall but he wasn't a significant enough contributor for anyone to care.
It doesn't benefit Harvard at all, which is why it's strange they don't release any information. Mike, your post makes the assumption that what Harvard does is normal. I don't think it is. People aren't targeting the Crimson's communication strategy, most are simply noting it is strange relative to most others. You guys don't think so. So be it.
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welcometothejungle
Masters Student
Posts: 788
Age: 27
Reg: 07-31-19
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Penn II
02-24-20 04:45 PM - Post#301661
In response to PennFan10
http://ivyhoopsonline.com/2019/11/14/columbia-n abs...
An IHO article dated November 14 quotes Jim Engles as being optimistic Stefanini would return in January. We are now in the last week of February so most people have now just assumed he’s done for the year, but that’s the last public statement on his status and the timeline was never a season ending injury. My point is more that concrete injury news is severely lacking in the Ivy League. Gladson’s had a knee injury, but we have no idea what injury/what surgeries he’s had in the time he’s missed. Aiken is out with a foot injury and Towns was out with a knee injury that we now know more about thanks to the long article about his status recently. In general I don’t think that’s far off from what we know about injuries around the league
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PennFan10
Postdoc
Posts: 3585
Reg: 02-15-15
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02-24-20 05:07 PM - Post#301664
In response to welcometothejungle
Stefanini had lisfranc surgery. It's 3-5 months to get the hardware removed (usually a plate has to be inserted). That's not a return to D1 Basketball timerframe.
Every Lisfranc inury I have seen is season ending.
There is a big difference between return to play information and actual injury information. Harvard gives neither. Contrast that with Penn and Donahue talks openly about injuries in the press. Very different philosophies. Until the article on Towns, no one publicly knew anything about the injury. Jelani Williams, Betley 2x, Bryce Washington, etc, are all known almost since inception.
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digamma
Masters Student
Posts: 468
Loc: Minneapolis
Reg: 11-27-11
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02-24-20 05:18 PM - Post#301668
In response to mrjames
Its free throw percentage in Ivy play has been appalling, or else some of those games that ended up close might not have. Everyone kind of joked hyperbolically about where Harvard would miss Bryce the most as "being the closer," but I'd argue it's been worse than anyone could have feared.
The appalling FT percentage plus the fact that we're still -29 on FTA for the conference season is quite a hole in the freebie department. We're basically -4 points a game when you factor in FT percentage as well, which is really something when we've played so many tight ones.
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Naismith
Sophomore
Posts: 149
Loc: RI
Reg: 11-11-18
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02-24-20 05:20 PM - Post#301669
In response to PennFan10
I may be wrong, but I believe in this brave new world that all college students have the right to approve or block any medical information from being released by the college. Yes, it's frustrating (especially to gamblers!) but may simply be out of any college's control.
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SomeGuy
Professor
Posts: 6412
Reg: 11-22-04
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02-24-20 11:15 PM - Post#301697
In response to Naismith
I apologize if we’ve gone around this circle before, but if I were a coach, I wouldn’t say a word about injuries unless a rule said I had to (like the NFL). I don’t really understand why fans feel they are entitled to know. And I find that personally I don’t care. Ryan Betley will be my guy if he comes back this year. But right now, my guys are Simmons, Martz, Scott, and Monroe.
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Noah Friedman
Freshman
Posts: 34
Age: 25
Reg: 01-19-20
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02-25-20 12:16 AM - Post#301700
In response to SomeGuy
How far do you think Harvard can go if they make the ncaa tournament? Also what is going on with Spencer freedman and why not play Sakota more he can shoot
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