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Username Post: Kevin Ollie wins arbitration with UConn        (Topic#25901)
Old Bear 
Postdoc
Posts: 3988

Reg: 11-23-04
01-27-22 05:28 PM - Post#334395    
    In response to final479

You can say what you want about Miller, but he is a good recruiter and a very good coach.

 
Jeff2sf 
Postdoc
Posts: 4466

Reg: 11-22-04
01-27-22 05:53 PM - Post#334396    
    In response to Old Bear

  • Old Bear Said:
You can say what you want about Miller, but he is a good recruiter and a very good coach.



a good recruiter and a good coach wouldn't have torn down a program like Penn in the space of about 4 years.

 
Silver Maple 
Postdoc
Posts: 3765

Loc: Westfield, New Jersey
Reg: 11-23-04
01-27-22 07:49 PM - Post#334404    
    In response to Jeff2sf

I wouldn't say that Miller is a bad recruiter or coach. But he clearly was the wrong coach for Penn. Whether or not that could have been foreseen is debatable.

 
Old Bear 
Postdoc
Posts: 3988

Reg: 11-23-04
01-27-22 08:51 PM - Post#334407    
    In response to Silver Maple

Agreed, SM.

 
Penndemonium 
PhD Student
Posts: 1878

Reg: 11-29-04
01-28-22 02:32 AM - Post#334415    
    In response to Old Bear

He did well for Brown. Not so good for Penn. I think he broke the team culture. He inherited a very good team with a great team dynamic. Pretty soon thereafter, he lost the locker room. It is hard to get it back, as players pass their attitudes towards coaches down to the following classes. I spoke to one of his (potentially good) players who said playing for Miller was just miserable - he felt Miller didn't give the players any respect.

 
Streamers 
Professor
Posts: 8141
Streamers
Loc: NW Philadelphia
Reg: 11-21-04
01-28-22 09:12 AM - Post#334418    
    In response to Penndemonium

I have heard several stories from a player in that time frame that confirm this. He was especially disrespectful of players with injuries expecting them to play before they were sufficiently healed. Really undermined at least one career that way.

 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 32685

Reg: 11-21-04
01-28-22 10:24 AM - Post#334422    
    In response to Streamers

"Really" or "Reilly"?

 
Jeff2sf 
Postdoc
Posts: 4466

Reg: 11-22-04
Kevin Ollie wins arbitration with UConn
01-28-22 10:53 AM - Post#334423    
    In response to palestra38

you all seem to separate "coaching" from "demeaning players". I don't give two craps if a guy has a bag of the most genius ATO plays ever. If his players quit on him, he is, by definition, a terrible coach.

He came into Penn and won a title in his first year that was handed to him on a platter. A very poorly trained chimp could have won with that team. As soon as those seniors were gone, the team disintegrated. He sucked. He flat out sucked. The poorly trained chimp, who likely would have thrown excrement at his players probably couldn't have done worse at alienating these players. The only good thing that can be said about him is that he didn't accept several hundred thousand dollars to recruit bad players but even that may well be due to him urinating off parents and alumni enough that no one wanted to offer him that bribe.

 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 32685

Reg: 11-21-04
Re: Kevin Ollie wins arbitration with UConn
01-28-22 11:32 AM - Post#334424    
    In response to Jeff2sf

Let's try and reply to the person whose comments are the subject of your opinion.

That being said, I think it's pretty clear from everything that has happened that Miller has a personality that ill-prepares him for a head coaching job despite the fact that he can (1) recruit and (2) really knows the game inside out. He was left with virtually nothing in the cupboard by Dunphy after that senior dominated team a chimp could have coached to a title, but over a 2 year period, recruited players we would love to have today (Rosen, Bernardini, Eggleston, Belcore, Gaines, Reilly, Votel, Monckton, D. Smith, Schreiber). Obviously, not all of them worked out, but when in a very short period when that core was healthy, the worst coach Penn ever had went down to the last game of the season with a title on the line. Steve's point about the health of the team and Miller's impatience with injury (not to mention personality) drove Miller insane. But he then was responsible for recruiting and providing the game coaching for a national title team in Connecticut. There, the same lack of personal control led to a bitter falling out with Ollie, as had occurred at Penn with the players and fans and was exhibited in his bitter tirade over a loss at the Palestra while at Brown. Bilsky, a truly terrible AD responsible more than any single person for where we are today, completely overlooked his personality issues in his zeal not to hire anyone affiliated with Dunphy (such as O'Hanlon) --which is really Miller's downfall. He did other things very well.

 
Jeff2sf 
Postdoc
Posts: 4466

Reg: 11-22-04
01-28-22 11:41 AM - Post#334425    
    In response to palestra38

can you take a screenshot of what you all see, because i swear i'm using this wrong. i just type at the bottom of the page. why would i reply when you can't tell which reply it is if you have multiple posts in the same topic.

anyway, i'm more than a little skeptical that miller did any recruiting at uconn. the guy has the personality of "Jeff2sf on a message board"... BUT IN REAL LIFE.

To the extent he landed players at Penn, I'd attribute it to a then sterling Penn reputation. As for the cupboard being bare, sure, so what, that happened all the time for Dunphy at the end of a cycle. the time at the end of a cycle. Miller couldn't build it up, he just made it worse.

I wish we could hire him today just to fire him again tomorrow.

 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 32685

Reg: 11-21-04
01-28-22 11:56 AM - Post#334427    
    In response to Jeff2sf

Miller actually can be very charming. At Lexington in 2007, he spoke with Penn fans at the hotel (myself included) and not only convinced me that Harrison Gaines was the next coming, but that the future was very bright. And yes, he recruited the players I mention above (what we would do today for Rosen, Bernardini or any number of the big men he recruited) as well as was Calhoun's leading recruiter at UConn, which continued into the Ollie era.

It was all his personality that when faced with problems, it caused him to wilt under stress that did him in. Look what he did as an associate head coach/lead assistant at UConn and his work before Brown at Connecticut College (had an undefeated season and got them into the Div III final four) and now at St Joseph's. The guy can coach---just not as a Div 1 head coach.

 
penn nation 
Professor
Posts: 21086

Reg: 12-02-04
01-28-22 12:05 PM - Post#334428    
    In response to palestra38

  • palestra38 Said:
At Lexington in 2007, he spoke with Penn fans at the hotel (myself included) and not only convinced me that Harrison Gaines was the next coming,



Well, this explains a lot.



 
palestra38 
Professor
Posts: 32685

Reg: 11-21-04
Kevin Ollie wins arbitration with UConn
01-28-22 12:11 PM - Post#334429    
    In response to penn nation

Never had a discussion with him about Reilly...but to this day, I'll tell you that both of them could play.

 
Jeff2sf 
Postdoc
Posts: 4466

Reg: 11-22-04
Kevin Ollie wins arbitration with UConn
01-28-22 12:24 PM - Post#334430    
    In response to palestra38

a quick google search showed me this.
https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketba ll/story...

I am sure he did SOME recruiting but he wasn't the guy. I honestly don't know how we'd do with all those folks back. I loved Eggleston and Rosen is Rosen. We'd be better than we are now probably (
ken pom we were 282 in year ending 09
305 in year ending 2010 (miller fired)
185 in year ending 2011
132 in year ending 2012 (Rosen senior).
)

That's cool but that isn't setting the world on fire.

 
LyleGold 
PhD Student
Posts: 1712

Reg: 11-22-04
Kevin Ollie wins arbitration with UConn
01-28-22 12:25 PM - Post#334431    
    In response to Jeff2sf

Instead of typing at the bottom of the page, click “reply” in the box of the comment you’re responding to. That keeps the threads organized and avoids people feeling they are being accused of things they didn’t do.

 
yoyo 
Senior
Posts: 355

Reg: 03-25-09
Re: Kevin Ollie wins arbitration with UConn
01-28-22 12:35 PM - Post#334432    
    In response to LyleGold

  • LyleGold Said:
Instead of typing at the bottom of the page, click “reply” in the box of the comment you’re responding to. That keeps the threads organized and avoids people feeling they are being accused of things they didn’t do.



I prefer the quote function


 
Jeff2sf 
Postdoc
Posts: 4466

Reg: 11-22-04
Re: Kevin Ollie wins arbitration with UConn
01-28-22 12:58 PM - Post#334434    
    In response to LyleGold

eh, i'm good. the quote function is best.

 
Streamers 
Professor
Posts: 8141
Streamers
Loc: NW Philadelphia
Reg: 11-21-04
Re: Kevin Ollie wins arbitration with UConn
01-28-22 03:38 PM - Post#334446    
    In response to palestra38

  • palestra38 Said:
Never had a discussion with him about Reilly...but to this day, I'll tell you that both of them could play.


Reilly was a 3* star recruit as I recall with a dozen mid-major offers.

I can attest attest to the charm factor. Miller attended an alumni function in Atlanta while I was down there and He won completely won the room that night. I was surprised being aware of his prickly reputation by then.

 
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