palestra38
Professor
Posts: 32884
Reg: 11-21-04
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04-14-23 11:42 AM - Post#355757
In response to Penndemonium
There is no way he is on the bench next year.
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SomeGuy
Professor
Posts: 6415
Reg: 11-22-04
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04-14-23 02:23 PM - Post#355760
In response to palestra38
While I think there is plenty of opportunity for Holland to step up and take minutes, I don’t think it is anywhere close to a sure thing. Smith already was playing Monroe’s role when he was off the floor. So I assume we will see Smith step into a starting role. So the question becomes who fills Smith’s role as the first guard off the bench. That combo of rebounding, ball handling and defense is a little hard to find, and maybe I am getting too stuck in the idea that we need somebody to do what Monroe and Smith do (but Williams was doing a lot of the same things the year before). Laz is the best rebounder of the incumbents. McMullen is probably the best ball handler. Nobody in the group has really stuck out defensively to my eye, but the assignments and rotations suggest the staff views McMullen as ahead on that end. So I could see the top 8 becoming a top 7 with Laz both backing up Martz and serving as the 4th guard, or McMullen as 4th guard. And that’s before we even get to Thrower, who might have the most offensive potential of the group. I also think all 3 freshman perimeter players will be in the mix, and it sounds like Perkins in particular may be a fit.
I am intrigued by Holland just like everyone else, and I am very hopeful he gets lots of time and excels. But I can see a lot of other scenarios too.
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palestra38
Professor
Posts: 32884
Reg: 11-21-04
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04-14-23 04:01 PM - Post#355761
In response to SomeGuy
I think we saw Laz get exposed last year. Unless he develops a killer 3 point shot this off-season, I don't see him getting a lot of minutes.
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SomeGuy
Professor
Posts: 6415
Reg: 11-22-04
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04-14-23 05:52 PM - Post#355762
In response to palestra38
I guess I have trouble seeing how he was exposed. He had the highest ORAT on the team, and was second to Dingle in WS/40. All small sample size of course, but it seems strange that you would look at two kids who played 150-200 minutes last year and say the one with much better rate stats was exposed.
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penn nation
Professor
Posts: 21286
Reg: 12-02-04
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04-14-23 06:31 PM - Post#355764
In response to SomeGuy
Thrower seems very steady to me as a floor leader. I would trust him with bringing the ball up and knowing what to do with it.
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palestra38
Professor
Posts: 32884
Reg: 11-21-04
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04-15-23 03:41 PM - Post#355769
In response to SomeGuy
As the season went on, he was beaten pretty regularly on defense, did not shoot 3s well and shot FTs poorly. He's just not a guy who will help us win if he gets more minutes. We need to do better. As I said, if he somehow develops a 40% 3 point shot, I would change my mind.
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SomeGuy
Professor
Posts: 6415
Reg: 11-22-04
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04-15-23 11:04 PM - Post#355776
In response to palestra38
I don’t disagree on the defense, although that was an issue for all of the candidates. We had a drop off defensively whenever we got beyond our top 7 last year. I don’t think the minutes were enough to know who among them can step up on that end, though the decisions re playing time and assignments may provide some clues.
On Laz’s shooting, I don’t think either 3 pointers or foul shooting are an issue for him. His overall shooting efficiency was among the best on the team. With more run, I assume his ridiculously good 2 point shooting goes down and the other two go up. But admittedly the sample size is small for all these guys. I don’t conclude that Laz can’t shoot 3s or free throws any more than I conclude that Holland can’t shoot 2s.
Anyway, my point isn’t that Laz should be playing over Holland or anyone else. I’m saying that both the numbers and the playing time decisions the last two years suggest that there are a lot of possible scenarios here. There are 5 guys who obviously will play. I think there are lots of different ways to go after that, and I don’t think whether or not we win depends on what direction we go with those spots. How far we go will depend mainly on how far Dingle can take us and how much Spinoso develops.
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pennsive
Junior
Posts: 200
Reg: 11-21-04
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04-16-23 11:23 AM - Post#355780
In response to SomeGuy
Our top players can take us to the Ivy playoffs, but development of our next five players is the key to winning the tougher games during the season and in a two game playoff against the likes of Princeton and Yale. Without those key reserves, we will, as we have done for too many years, put up a good fight, take leads, and wear down in crunch time. The coaches must let those players play important minutes in both the first and second half of each game during the season so that they have confidence and fit neatly and can spark the team when needed in games where we really need them.. It is on the coaches as much as the players to build the team for end of game and end of season success.
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SomeGuy
Professor
Posts: 6415
Reg: 11-22-04
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04-16-23 11:42 AM - Post#355781
In response to pennsive
I see that a little differently. Princeton wasn’t playing any more guys than we were, and they were relying on their stars just like we were. In other words, there wasn’t anything different about the way our opponents were using or developing their depth.
Could we have developed different backups? Yes. As we are arguing here, we could have developed a different 8th and 9th guys, instead of Laz and Charles in those spots. But I think that is where the minutes would have been taken from, not from our top 7. All of these guys can play. There are lots of combos we could win with in those bench spots.
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