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Username Post: I think this must be a sign        (Topic#3318)
Scott 
Sophomore
Posts: 144

Reg: 07-24-06
07-25-06 12:51 AM - Post#21579    

Lou emailed me that you guys have a new board so I read thru the recent posings on this board as well as the Yahoo! board. Then I made a lenghtly response on this board and the message did not post...I got some sort of error message...it may have timed out. I was doing other things while posting.

So posting about Loyola must just not be meant to be. Of course had Ridley not had me taken off of the alumni mailing list for refering to him as Fr Angelos then I may have never stopped posting to begin with :-)

I have no interest in rehashing my post that did not take. Perhaps I'll see some of you Nov 29 at Reitz when the Fightin' Blue Hens whip up on the Houns.

 
ericatbucknell 
PhD Student
Posts: 1940
ericatbucknell
Reg: 01-22-06
Re: I think this must be a sign
07-25-06 02:10 AM - Post#21580    
    In response to Scott

yeah... just for future reference, its usually a good idea to 'right click-copy' any long post before submitting when using the 'quick reply' feature. this board has an automated timeout clock (which i havent timed) that the admins have investigated but can do little about.

its happened to me more times than id care to count.

oh, and welcome to the boards!
The Bracket Bustin' Bison are Back!

Okay. First round streak BACK ON!


 
Lou 
Masters Student
Posts: 406
Lou
Age: 107
Loc: Atlanta
Reg: 07-19-06
Re: I think this must be a sign
07-25-06 10:19 AM - Post#21581    
    In response to Scott

Quote:

Lou emailed me that you guys have a new board so I read thru the recent posings on this board as well as the Yahoo! board. Then I made a lenghtly response on this board and the message did not post...I got some sort of error message...it may have timed out. I was doing other things while posting.

So posting about Loyola must just not be meant to be. Of course had Ridley not had me taken off of the alumni mailing list for refering to him as Fr Angelos then I may have never stopped posting to begin with :-)

I have no interest in rehashing my post that did not take. Perhaps I'll see some of you Nov 29 at Reitz when the Fightin' Blue Hens whip up on the Houns.




Sorry to hear that. I would have liked to have known your thoughts on this.
Jesus loves me.
I don't give a f--- what the rest of you think.


 
Administrator 
Junior
Posts: 241
Administrator
Reg: 11-08-04
Re: I think this must be a sign
07-25-06 11:12 AM - Post#21582    
    In response to ericatbucknell

It only seems to be an issue with the "Quick Reply." If you're planning on writing anything lengthy, definitely make sure to use the regular "Reply."

 
jdp 94 
Masters Student
Posts: 870
jdp 94
Loc: New York
Reg: 07-20-06
Re: I think this must be a sign
07-25-06 12:51 PM - Post#21583    
    In response to Administrator

That's too bad.

Perhaps Scott can muster up the energy to paraphrase himself.

 
Scott 
Sophomore
Posts: 144

Reg: 07-24-06
Re: I think this must be a sign
07-25-06 02:47 PM - Post#21584    
    In response to Scott

There have been a lot a great subjects touched on recently. I'll try to make time to again put in my 2 cents worth. After spending a ton of time getting my thoughts together and having them all disappear last night, I was kind of ticked off.

I will say now that I think the pictures of the stadium are beautiful.

 
Scott 
Sophomore
Posts: 144

Reg: 07-24-06
Re: I think this must be a sign
07-26-06 12:04 AM - Post#21585    
    In response to Scott

Ok, I'll try to rehash my thoughts from last night while watching the Orioles begin their wild card push.

1. Someone asked when was the last time Loyola extended a men's hoops coach's contract. Believe it or not, Dino rec'd an extension early on. Remember, under Dino, Loyola received votes in the USA Today coach's poll after winning the Battle of Baltimore.

2. John was mentioning how lax will not be a spectator sport and compared it to soccer. The difference is that people who play soccer by and large have no interest in attending soccer games while many many people who have played little or no lax do attend lax games. The lax Final Four is an EVENT while the soccer Final Four is by and large an afterthought even though millions more kids play soccer than lax. No, lax won't be taking the place of football but it could still grow. Twenty five years ago watching stock cars make left hand turns for three hours or so was a regional phenomenon that would never be big anywhere except for the south.

3. As Lax grows, the window for Loyola ever winning a Nat'l Title or for that matter to remain a player is closing. As lax spreads and more kids play, larger better funded schools will field teams and the Loyola's will be squeezed out of the picture. Consider Northwestern's women's lax program which was recently brought out of the mothballs and now has won consecutive titles.

4. I believe it was John who said that the only thing Loyola ever won in lax was the "rankings". That is true but what could have been had there been better facilities in place. Cottle did an amazing job of recruiting considering the home stadium was a parking lot covered by artificial turf. Had Cottle had a nice stadium to use as a recruiting tool we may have very well won some big games in May.

5. I think everyone is overrating Loyola's lax tradition. Loyola lax success began and ended with Cottle. It was well into his run of excellent seasons that the all-time winning % for the program reached .500. In the 50's and 60's hoops was king at Loyola while soccer ruled in the 70's into the mid to later 80's.

6. I think comparing this past season's hoops and lax attendance is misleading. This was the first time since '94 that the Hounds had a winning season and there was understandably a lot of excitement while lax was in the middle of another "down" year in the post Cottle era. It would be interesting to see what would happen in Baltimore if one of the local hoops teams got on a run where they were competitive year in and year out in a good conference. Would that team become "Baltimore's Team"?

7. It will be interesting to see how everything plays out with the MASN/CSN regional sports networks. MASN will begin to have a full schedule begining July 31. Could one of these networks pick up the MAAC televsion package? Right now CSN, which is Wash DC centric, shows most if not all of the CAA tv package games which means Towson gets exposure in Baltimore and the teams that they play get exposure in Baltimore. What this means is that a Baltimore hoops fan sees VCU or Hofstra etc...play occasionally so when those teams come to Towson to play the Tigers, this fan is more likely to attend due to familiarity. Is the same fan as likely to go to Reitz to see a Loyola - Canisius game when they have no exposure to Canisius.

8. I think Towson is better positioned than Loyola to become Baltimore's team. Not only is the CAA tv contract a bonus but the CAA is a much stronger league than the MAAC right now. The CAA may not continue to fly as high as it is now but it will be strong again next season as the league was fairly young last year. I thought that the MAAC was loaded in '94 with Manhattan, Canisius, Siena, St Peter's and Loyola. However seeing the CAA teams last year was amazing...JMU, Delaware and GA State were bad, Towson was mediocre but the rest of the league was very good. Drexel gave Duke and UCLA battles in the preseason NIT yet stuggled against CAA competition. Just as Loyola's recruiting improved when they moved to the MAAC, Towson's will also improve due to being a CAA member. In addition should Pat Kennedy find success at Towson he as a veteran coach is much more likely to stay at Towson that Patsos is to stay at Loyola if he somehow keeps winning.

9. Glad to see Joe Logan get a contract extension...he's a great guy. Time will tell if he is a good coach or if Candy Cage was simply a great recruiter who could not get the most out of her talent. I think it is probably a little of both. In Candy's final year the Hounds were picked by the coaches to win the MAAC and fell on their faces. Would Joe ever be a candidate for the men's job?

10. As a fan of a Loyola opponent, I must say that Patsos is a complete genius/jerk/buffoon/ whatever you want to call it. He's kind of a mixture of Gary Williams and Mark Cuban only more animated. Though a neutral observer would probably find him entertaining for a little while. I used to be put off by Mark Amatucci's antics when he was Loyola's coach and Amatucci was tame in comparison.

11. It will be interesting to see how Loyola does this year without Collins. I think he made the other players better and that last season was Patsos's one hit wonder season.

12. I love the design of the stadium. With one large grandstand you get the advantage of sitting high which is a better vantage point for seeing plays develop etc...the sight lines at Curley Field are terrible. However, I don't understand the lack of parking spaces.

The Orioles lead the very underrated KC Royals 4-2 in the 6th inning. It's going to be a fun October in Baltimore.

Have a great rest of the summer everyone.

 
jdp 94 
Masters Student
Posts: 870
jdp 94
Loc: New York
Reg: 07-20-06
Re: I think this must be a sign
07-26-06 12:08 PM - Post#21586    
    In response to Scott

Scott Thanks for your contribution. Good points. You were missed last season.

I agree Towson is better positioned to be Baltimore's basketball team, they have greater resources, alumni base and true mid-major conference - HOWEVER, they are dealing with some powerhouse programs that they may never be able to compete with. CAA bottom feeder status could just as well be their fate.

As for Loyola, I truly believe that the Hounds had a decade like the one Manhattan had - they could easily attain "Baltimore's team" status. Unlike the NYC market which Manhattan and Iona wallow in relative obscurity, The Baltimore sports landscape has plenty of room for us - potentially.

 
Lou 
Masters Student
Posts: 406
Lou
Age: 107
Loc: Atlanta
Reg: 07-19-06
Re: I think this must be a sign
07-26-06 12:54 PM - Post#21587    
    In response to jdp 94

Scott even if you just stop by to laugh at the program, I do hope you will stop by. I agree with JP that you are missed. If nothing else we can now call Jimmy Patsos "our new Dino." It gives me a warm and fuzzy feeling inside.

John one other issue we have in becoming "Baltimore's team" is that, as Scott said, Towson's matchups are much more interesting to local hoops fans. Fans know Mason, JMU, Delaware and the like. Until I went to Loyola I would not have been able to tell you that Canisius was a school, and not a gum disease, and I doubt many people are chomping to see (or would even recognize) most of the MAAC schools.
Jesus loves me.
I don't give a f--- what the rest of you think.


 
jdp 94 
Masters Student
Posts: 870
jdp 94
Loc: New York
Reg: 07-20-06
Re: I think this must be a sign
07-26-06 01:45 PM - Post#21588    
    In response to Lou

I agree to certain extent, Lou.

But the CAA doesn't allow for home games vs everyone in the conference. They will not always host George Mason, Old Dominion, etc. And although we get Canisius, Rider and Marist, Towson gets teams like Northeastern, Georgia State, James Madison and William & Mary.

Yes, on the whole, the CAA will bring Towson more attractive competition, but I don't think that the gap is as large as you think.

 
Scott 
Sophomore
Posts: 144

Reg: 07-24-06
Re: I think this must be a sign
07-26-06 02:15 PM - Post#21589    
    In response to Scott

Though I like playing everyone in the league home and home, what the CAA did was pretty good. There are two groups of 6 teams and each team plays the teams in their group a home and home...the CAA updated their site so I can't find Towson's group but I believe their group is Northeastern, Delaware, Hofstra, Drexel, and Mason. Of the other six teams, on a rotating basis, they play a home and home against two teams and one game each against the other four schools (two home and two road). This yields an 18 game league schedule and allows each school to host the teams in their group each year and the teams outside their group four times in a six year span. The schools in the other group that you play home and home rotate every two years.

 
jdp 94 
Masters Student
Posts: 870
jdp 94
Loc: New York
Reg: 07-20-06
Re: I think this must be a sign
07-26-06 02:36 PM - Post#21590    
    In response to Scott

you also have to keep in mind, with more schools, it is that much tougher for Towson to make the NCAAs through the CAA than Loyola to get in via the MAAC.

Last season, Hofstra & Old Dominion were good enough to make the 65 team field, but we may never see the day when the CAA sends 3, let alone 4 teams to the big dance.

 
Lou 
Masters Student
Posts: 406
Lou
Age: 107
Loc: Atlanta
Reg: 07-19-06
Re: I think this must be a sign
07-26-06 02:54 PM - Post#21591    
    In response to jdp 94

I don't think the 12 vs. 10 thing is that much of a difference. If the MAAC could go out and get 2 attractive programs that could help our RPI or otherall standing I hope they would jump at it despite reducing the chances for any one team to make the NCAA.

Towson has a tougher road right now not because they are in a 12 school league, but because they are in a league with Hofstra, ODU, Mason and those guys. We could be in a 3 team league with Duke and UNC instead of in a 10 team league with Rider and Canisius and I don't think our # of tournament appearances will improve.

That said John I think you are underestimating the CAA a bit. Those programs are a bit cyclical and a bit good, but they are strong. And the Mason run will help. The NCAA committee has a long memory on things like Mason. I think more than one fringe CAA team will make the NCAA in the coming years simply because Mason did so well.
Jesus loves me.
I don't give a f--- what the rest of you think.


 
Lou 
Masters Student
Posts: 406
Lou
Age: 107
Loc: Atlanta
Reg: 07-19-06
Re: I think this must be a sign
07-26-06 03:03 PM - Post#21592    
    In response to Scott

Quote:

8. I think Towson is better positioned than Loyola to become Baltimore's team. Not only is the CAA tv contract a bonus but the CAA is a much stronger league than the MAAC right now. The CAA may not continue to fly as high as it is now but it will be strong again next season as the league was fairly young last year. I thought that the MAAC was loaded in '94 with Manhattan, Canisius, Siena, St Peter's and Loyola. However seeing the CAA teams last year was amazing...JMU, Delaware and GA State were bad, Towson was mediocre but the rest of the league was very good. Drexel gave Duke and UCLA battles in the preseason NIT yet stuggled against CAA competition. Just as Loyola's recruiting improved when they moved to the MAAC, Towson's will also improve due to being a CAA member. In addition should Pat Kennedy find success at Towson he as a veteran coach is much more likely to stay at Towson that Patsos is to stay at Loyola if he somehow keeps winning.




By the way Scott, I think you and your CAA-bias () are over-estimating Towson by quite a bit. Yes they are in a better league and have a better TV contract, but they have about as strong of a track record in creating excitement and success with their basketball team as, well, Loyola. Kennedy is not having the recruiting success that he thought he would, as evidenced by them taking the risk with that LaSalle kid. While Loyola does not have the best reputation in Baltimore Patsos is rebuilding it, and Loyola’s stock in Washington has improved greatly thanks to their coach. Towson is thought of as a safety school for Baltimore hoopsters, and the average high school kid in Washington wouldn’t know that Towson is closer to the DC Beltway than Alaska – Anchorage. Kennedy might yet turn things around. Not having to worry about academics is his specialty, and he has it at Towson, but I think Loyola under Patsos has a much better chance at a 20 win season than Towson under Kennedy. I think it is even money at worse that Kennedy’s likelihood to stay is a benefit to Towson.

Rough night in Kansas City last night. Oh well. It isn’t like the Os were playing the team with the worst record in the League or something.
Jesus loves me.
I don't give a f--- what the rest of you think.


 
jdp 94 
Masters Student
Posts: 870
jdp 94
Loc: New York
Reg: 07-20-06
Re: I think this must be a sign
07-26-06 04:37 PM - Post#21593    
    In response to Lou

Quote:

That said John I think you are underestimating the CAA a bit. Those programs are a bit cyclical and a bit good, but they are strong. And the Mason run will help. The NCAA committee has a long memory on things like Mason. I think more than one fringe CAA team will make the NCAA in the coming years simply because Mason did so well.




I'm not underestimating the CAA at all. It is far better than the MAAC. They are a true mid-major. Unlike the MAAC.

That said, they are not ever getting 4 bids to the NCAA. It's just not happening. I doubt 3, but you never know if Hofstra is a bubble team again. They are owed one.

 
Scott 
Sophomore
Posts: 144

Reg: 07-24-06
Re: I think this must be a sign
07-27-06 01:53 AM - Post#21594    
    In response to Lou

First I want to say that I am enjoying posting on the Loyola site for the first time in a long while.

Lou, I don't think we will know if I am overrating the CAA effect on Towson until the next two recruiting classes. It is hard to say how all of the CAA programs will benefit, if at all from not only Mason's run but also the Hofstra and ODU runs in the NIT along with UNCW's superb 25 minutes vs GW in the NCAA's. There really is no prescident for this. I had always considered the CAA and MAAC to be equals but the quality of play really is a step or two above in the CAA.

A big advantage Towson has over Loyola if they start to draw some local fan interest is that Towson is much easier to get to and find parking. I know some have mentioned that the astroturf field is used for parking...how has that worked? If people still need to drive up and down Cold Spring, Millbrook for parking that has to be a real disincentive to attending a Loyola game.

The other big hurdle for Loyola to clear is the two semesters of Intermediate Foreign Language requirement. Not only does this hurt recruiting but it may very well cause academic problems once the student enroll.

 
Lou 
Masters Student
Posts: 406
Lou
Age: 107
Loc: Atlanta
Reg: 07-19-06
Re: I think this must be a sign
07-27-06 10:46 AM - Post#21595    
    In response to Scott

Quote:

First I want to say that I am enjoying posting on the Loyola site for the first time in a long while.

Lou, I don't think we will know if I am overrating the CAA effect on Towson until the next two recruiting classes. It is hard to say how all of the CAA programs will benefit, if at all from not only Mason's run but also the Hofstra and ODU runs in the NIT along with UNCW's superb 25 minutes vs GW in the NCAA's. There really is no prescident for this. I had always considered the CAA and MAAC to be equals but the quality of play really is a step or two above in the CAA.

A big advantage Towson has over Loyola if they start to draw some local fan interest is that Towson is much easier to get to and find parking. I know some have mentioned that the astroturf field is used for parking...how has that worked? If people still need to drive up and down Cold Spring, Millbrook for parking that has to be a real disincentive to attending a Loyola game.

The other big hurdle for Loyola to clear is the two semesters of Intermediate Foreign Language requirement. Not only does this hurt recruiting but it may very well cause academic problems once the student enroll.




Interesting point on the languages. I brought this up to someone at Loyola years ago and was told it was no big deal anymore because most high schools and even some middle schools now require foreign language, so most kids are coming in with some experience. But it certainly did me in at Loyola.

Obviously we have to wait and see how it plays out. I by no means mean to disrespect the CAA, which I do believe is a far superior conference. I just mean to disrespect Towson. I don’t believe in their coach, and I don’t believe in their program. Put it this way... a Loyola fan who knows Towson has every reason to be afraid that they are going to go big time as a Towson fan does about Loyola. I will believe it when I see it.

You are correct that parking is a problem. I would like to think it will be addressed if/when the stadium is ever built (another reason to be for the stadium), but I don’t think they have said what they would do with the land. I believe a parking deck is forbidden under the neighborhood covenant, but I think they could build an underground garage on the site and put a building over it.

As for the CAA, it is interesting. As you said I was a big advocate of us moving when the expansion began, for many of the reasons you mentioned. The (at the time) HTS deal, the importance of recruiting in DC, and the overall quality of opponents. A couple of years later, and seeing how the CAA has grown, I am not sure I am sorry we missed out. I wonder how Georgia State is enjoying loading its non-rev field hockey team or whatever on Delta twice a year to go to Boston and then go to Long Island, or whatever. I realize the CAA brings in more $$$ on hoops, but they better. Because the way the conference has expanded it causes the AD to have a lot higher expenses on non-hoops. I wonder if at the end of the day financially it is worth it.

And by the way remember when the CAA sold the Georgia State move on the basis of Atlanta’s media market? I wonder how much money they are bringing in on that, considering Ga. State has been unable to find a radio station to broadcast its game, let alone a tv network to pick up the CAA package.

PS: Scott hope you hang around. We miss you, you know, even if you just want to give us crap about how great the Hens are.
Jesus loves me.
I don't give a f--- what the rest of you think.


 
jdp 94 
Masters Student
Posts: 870
jdp 94
Loc: New York
Reg: 07-20-06
Re: I think this must be a sign
07-27-06 02:38 PM - Post#21596    
    In response to Scott

Quote:

First I want to say that I am enjoying posting on the Loyola site for the first time in a long while.




Scott - That's why we were wondering what happened to you last season. We finally had hope and actual good things to discuss, but you were AWOL.

Did you at least enjoy the first half of the season? Or are you still angry with the school?

 
Scott 
Sophomore
Posts: 144

Reg: 07-24-06
Re: I think this must be a sign
07-27-06 02:41 PM - Post#21597    
    In response to Lou

I would think the language thing is an issue. In trying to recruit a private school kid, it may not be but with an inner city kid it could be a problem simply because even if they offer foreign language, how much teaching/learning happens. Remember how Darrin Kelly was a National Honor Society student...from what I was told he would come to class at Loyola to sleep.

I don't understand the GA State or even the Northeastern thing with the CAA. I do get a chuckle about getting certain media markets on board...so what if nobody watches. However, Towson is basically in the center of the new CAA geographically. Baltimore schools used to always be the odd balls...the northenmost point in a southern conference or the southernmost point in a northeren conference. So travel expenses etc...for Towson should be lower.

So when does Loyola start their I-AA football program?

 
Lou 
Masters Student
Posts: 406
Lou
Age: 107
Loc: Atlanta
Reg: 07-19-06
Re: I think this must be a sign
07-27-06 03:33 PM - Post#21598    
    In response to Scott

Without doubt it is easier for Towson than it is for Northeastern or Ga. State, but we are still talking 10 hour bus trips in either direction. At least with the MAAC Loyola can pair games (Canisius/Niagara, Siena/Marist, etc.) I realize that it is set up so that every team doesn't have to go both directions every year, but it seemingly is going to be a 2.5 to 3-day trip to Boston every time you have to play there. Easy for hoops, really tough for field hockey, track, tennis, etc. I do wonder if 10 years from now Towson will look back at the expense and wonder, at least privately, if it was worth it. Of course if they keep getting teams to the final four or multiple bids the conference revenue sharing is going to help.

I would hate for Loyola to start a football program. It is not worth it to put the Mount Union-like multiple decade unbeaten streak at risk!
Jesus loves me.
I don't give a f--- what the rest of you think.


 
jdp 94 
Masters Student
Posts: 870
jdp 94
Loc: New York
Reg: 07-20-06
Re: I think this must be a sign
07-27-06 06:10 PM - Post#21599    
    In response to Lou

the fact that homecomming is scheduled around a soccer game is downright embarrassing.

give me football. surely we can compete with Towson. hell, it will even get me to contribute to stadium construction!

 
Scott 
Sophomore
Posts: 144

Reg: 07-24-06
Re: I think this must be a sign
07-28-06 12:53 PM - Post#21600    
    In response to jdp 94

You are right Lou, the MAAC really does have a favorable geographic setup. I never really thought about how compact the league is geographically. Loyola being the southermost member may actually commute less miles than Towson though Towson is in the center of their conference. For the NYC based teams in the MAAC the travel is downright minimal.

John, it would be a while before Loyola could compete with Towson in football especially if Loyola joined the non-scholarship MAAC.

 
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