bradley
PhD Student
Posts: 1842
Age: 74
Reg: 01-15-16
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11-15-17 09:06 PM - Post#236480
In response to Tiger69
BYU defense is very good. Pressing D everywhere which makes it tough. Bell is playing out of control. Role players doing ok. I think that it has been a well played defensive struggle. BYU may be a little better but it might come down to the end.
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Tiger81
Masters Student
Posts: 412
Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
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11-15-17 09:39 PM - Post#236492
In response to bradley
Princeton's D and ball movement have suddenly come to life, looking much better after a lot of low-intensity on both ends.
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sparman
PhD Student
Posts: 1348
Reg: 12-08-04
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11-15-17 09:44 PM - Post#236498
In response to Tiger81
How often we get these inopportune cold shooting streaks and killer mistakes?
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sparman
PhD Student
Posts: 1348
Reg: 12-08-04
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11-15-17 09:48 PM - Post#236500
In response to sparman
The most common utterance by radio announcers when Tigers shoot is "he can't quite get it to go".
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Tiger81
Masters Student
Posts: 412
Loc: Montclair, NJ
Reg: 11-21-04
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11-15-17 09:59 PM - Post#236505
In response to sparman
Noah Savage is right: too much "hero ball" by Cannady, the Tigers need more ball movement
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Tiger69
Postdoc
Posts: 2818
Reg: 11-23-04
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11-15-17 09:59 PM - Post#236506
In response to sparman
Can't watch this game anymore. Too much one on one by us with four other guys essentially useless.
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1LotteryPick1969
Postdoc
Posts: 2277
Age: 73
Loc: Sandy, Utah
Reg: 11-21-04
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11-15-17 10:07 PM - Post#236508
In response to Tiger69
Yuck. Painful to watch.
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1LotteryPick1969
Postdoc
Posts: 2277
Age: 73
Loc: Sandy, Utah
Reg: 11-21-04
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11-15-17 10:10 PM - Post#236509
In response to Tiger69
Brennan shooting well when spotted up, but he clearly will not look for the shot off the pick and roll.
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sparman
PhD Student
Posts: 1348
Reg: 12-08-04
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11-15-17 10:14 PM - Post#236512
In response to 1LotteryPick1969
Tigers are almost always competitive against these nationally known teams, but seems like forever since they sealed the deal. Probably forgetting a notable win somewhere, but seems like "close but no cigar" is our motto.
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gokinsmen
Postdoc
Posts: 3678
Reg: 02-06-10
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BYU 11-15-17 10:14 PM - Post#236513
In response to Tiger69
What an ugly loss. The team needs to do some soul searching tonight. Do they want to collapse in fear whenever they face a "name" opponent? Or do they want to win one of these someday? Mitch getting 4 tech FTs at such a crucial time in the game is a low point in his career.
Good defense by both teams for most of the game, but our guys wilted under pressure as usual. It wasn't just the freshmen either. Bell was totally lost -- I was cringing on his behalf. At least Stephens was able to make some kind of contribution via rebounds and late buckets.
I'm sure the guys will get it together against weak opponents and make a run in the Ivy. And after that, another close loss in the tourney -- either conference or NCAA. Same old routine. Hey, at least we finally have a Top 100 recruit on the way!
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Vonsid
Sophomore
Posts: 146
Reg: 03-12-16
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Re: BYU 11-15-17 10:19 PM - Post#236515
In response to gokinsmen
Mitch getting t'ed up was him sending a message to his team that they need to wake the hell up. It was not a low point in his career. He identified that this is how he is going to get this group to start playing and that things are going to be different from this point on.
You also continue to be the most negative person on this message board.
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gokinsmen
Postdoc
Posts: 3678
Reg: 02-06-10
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BYU 11-15-17 10:29 PM - Post#236518
In response to Vonsid
Turning a 5pt deficit into a 9pt deficit is stupid any way you slice it. Getting not one but TWO techs on the same possession was an embarrassment and really energized BYU and their fan contingent.
No need to be a blind homer. Sometimes guys have to step up -- no more excuses and self-handicapping. To quote Brian Earl: "They just aren't playing hard enough." This team has so much talent but not enough heart...yet. Who will step up and lead?
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bradley
PhD Student
Posts: 1842
Age: 74
Reg: 01-15-16
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Re: BYU 11-15-17 10:42 PM - Post#236522
In response to Vonsid
It does follow a pattern of being close 2 pts with 3 minutes to go non-conference games against good opponents and then fade at the end. Mitch was horse from yelling at the guys at the beginning of the second half to move on offense.
BYU played right in the Tigers face literally every single possession that forced Stephens, Bell and Cannady to drive and the big guy for BYU played very tough at the rim. The Tigers played very well on the defensive end although BYU missed some wide open 3pt especially in the 1st half.
Bottom line is that the Tigers are good but not very good an not as good as last year-- my opinion and I hope that I am wrong. Will they become very good as the season progresses -- question mark. Weisz was missed tonite on the offensive end, passing the ball. I am pretty sure that they will be competitive in the IL and will have to wait for the two game tournament as they are not going to get a bid without winning the goofy IL tournament.
I think that Stephens and Bell will have far more success driving to the basket against IL teams. The reality was that BYU was stronger and tougher --- I thought Mormons were missionaries and kind people.
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TigerFan
PhD Student
Posts: 1892
Reg: 11-21-04
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BYU 11-15-17 10:54 PM - Post#236528
In response to bradley
Brutal, ugly game. No motion on offense (other than one pretty back door) just a lot of hero ball, which resulted in some terrible turnovers, awful circus shots, and obvious offensive fouls. I think Mitch was as mad at his team as he was the refs. I was in third row and din't have to read lips to know what he was saying. He was frustrated most of the game and seemed ready to blow well before he finally lost it.
The double tech fired Canaday up. On one trip he got his own rebound several times and then leapt in the air to poke a loose ball to a teammate. The team pulled from down 9 to down 3 (I think) and for a moment there was a sense that they could pull this one out. But then the uglies returned.
This was a step back from the Butler game and I am no longer confident that this is a good team. The Tigers need to get this one out of their system (and so do I--ugghhh!).
Edited by TigerFan on 11-15-17 10:56 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.
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JadwinGeorge
Senior
Posts: 357
Age: 75
Reg: 12-04-15
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11-15-17 10:59 PM - Post#236531
In response to bradley
Comparisons to last year's team are silly. After a team starts 4-6 and then goes 19-1 the rest of the way you might think no one would jump to conclusions after 2 games. I am not sure what drove Mitch nuts, but the game was over after he was tossed. Relax, Tiger fans, a long way to go....
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SRP
Postdoc
Posts: 4919
Reg: 02-04-06
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11-15-17 11:02 PM - Post#236533
In response to bradley
Frustrating game with the MH four-point giveaway at the crucial moment and the un-Princeton-like offense.
So far, my concerns pre-season have been pretty exactly reflected in the team's play. First-shot defense was spotty, although the defensive rebounding was first-rate. Once again, I think they miss Miller's post presence and Cook and Weisz's tenacity. Even more than last year it seems to me that the Tigers need to tilt a little more to creating turnovers and making opponents uncomfortable. They all have long arms. Why no extended zone?
Offensively, Weisz was really, really important in making the new-style dribble-drive offense not turn into a stand-around-fest. His sharp passes loosened the D even when they were not assists, and players leaned to find gaps where he could hit them. MH supposedly went away from the classic Princeton offense to be less predictable, but I think tonight the Tigers were more predictable. Where is the off-ball screening and cutting, the spacing, the three-man plays? If Bell had finished better at the rim, or some of Cannady's hero plays worked out better (and to be honest I thought some of them were going to go in), it would have been closer, but probably not enough. They have to commit to spreading the floor, cutting, and hitting open guys and then the driving lanes will be open along with the kickouts for threes.
Much looked much better than last time and I really like Schweiger's potential. Brennan wasn't bad but they need to let him play as a stretch four if they want him to be effective offensively as a three-point shooter. Wish I knew what was up with Gladson. And hey, LeBlanc can play basketball pretty well, even if he's no threat for all-Ivy.
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westcoast
Senior
Posts: 302
Reg: 03-08-16
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11-16-17 01:35 PM - Post#236625
In response to SRP
Gladson is recovering from a minor injury, but should be back be within the next couple of games, according to Kyle Franko of the Trentonian. He's been going through warmups, but hasn't been dressing for the actual games so far.
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bradley
PhD Student
Posts: 1842
Age: 74
Reg: 01-15-16
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11-16-17 02:44 PM - Post#236647
In response to westcoast
Gladson was wearing a knee brase in warm ups but he looked ok. Elijah Barnes is also close to being back on the floor. According to someone very close to the program, Barnes got a big thumbs up in preseason.
Henderson and Cannady's post game comments were interesting. Basic theme was good offense/bad defense against Butler and the reverse with BYU. As Coach stated, need to get both parts of the game working in sync. Cougars did hit 25 of 27 free throws which may have been the biggest factor in the game.
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1LotteryPick1969
Postdoc
Posts: 2277
Age: 73
Loc: Sandy, Utah
Reg: 11-21-04
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11-16-17 03:08 PM - Post#236657
In response to bradley
I was surprised how upbeat they both were. Cannady admitted he needs to drive and then DISH.
I do not understand the hesitation to shoot the 3-ball. Everyone pump-faked, then drove into the teeth of a collapsing defense. Not sure one can effectively dish in that scenario if you drive too deep. Gotta make the defense stay home.
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Tiger69
Postdoc
Posts: 2818
Reg: 11-23-04
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11-16-17 04:30 PM - Post#236690
In response to 1LotteryPick1969
Ugly game. But BYU made us look bad. This group is talented, but stil a work in process. As frustrating as it was to see this game, this is not the time to say the sky is falling. (Leave that one to the Penn fans).
The most glaring problem that I saw was the attempt of both Amir and Devin to try to take the game on his shoulders without using his teammates. Too much one on one, too little ball movement. BYU good D definitely contributed to our problems. But, our big three do not yet have enough confidence in their teammates to look for better alternatives than sucking it up and going to the hoop by themselves. Noble sentiment, lousy strategy. Much and Schwieger showed promise. Brennan, after some early good play, seemed reluctant to shoot when open. And LeBlanc was aggressive and made some nice plays. When/if these guys begin to work together like last year's group, they have the talent to be a very good team. I know that it is not easy for any of us. But, have patience.ðŸ…
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